For "cafeteria" Catholics

[Mojo674]

I find labeling each person leads to greater harm. In truth the Church only has two terms: heretic and orthodox. One should not readily call a fellow brother or sister in Christ either of these terms without knowing their situation and knowledge. You must help others learn their faith, do not bash them or attack them for having less knowledge. Even though I’m part of the Ruthenian Byzantine Catholic Church, what I say to certain Catholics is very simple. Christ was nailed upon the cross with arms stretched out. He gives all of Himself to you and the world. All He asks is to give all of yourself to Him and His people. We are to die everyday and crucify ourselves and passions so that we might be one with Him. St. Paul converted countless people to the Faith by dying each day. This is the exact same teaching, in East and West. That is why I love this image of how an Eastern Monk lives each day.

http://www.uncutmountainsupply.com/prodimages/lg/11J10.jpg

~Servant of God Nicholas

 

[CB_Catholic]

We are our brothers keeper. If our brother is in sin, we must help bring them into conformity with Church teaching. If they reject the Church, they reject Christ.
To allow our brothers and sisters to remain in sin without correction is wrong.

Oh for heaven’s sake. Nobody said a thing about not correcting a brother if they are in sin. The issue is judging PEOPLE and labeling them, esp. without knowing all the facts. And taking the log out of your own eye before you notice the one in your brother’s. You judge sin, not people.

 

[hudson]

I find the term “Cafeteria Catholics” offensive and find the term used by the more closeminded Catholics to quell rightly deserved criticism of some questionable Church stances. This type of paranoia is one of the reasons why many people choose to leave the Catholic faith.

Just because one raises relevant questions about his/her faith does not make him/her a Heretic.

Reading your posts sounds like the term Cafeteria Catholic fits perfectly.

 

[Veritatis3]

Oh for heaven’s sake. Nobody said a thing about not correcting a brother if they are in sin. The issue is judging PEOPLE and labeling them, esp. without knowing all the facts. And taking the log out of your own eye before you notice the one in your brother’s. You judge sin, not people.

More than likely the people who take offense are those who defy the Church on one or more issues.
I didn’t label anyone, they label themselves by not following Church teaching. It isn’t judging anyone to ask those who accept our Lord in the Eucharist to follow His Church.

 

[Veritatis3]

I find the term “Cafeteria Catholics” offensive and find the term used by the more closeminded Catholics to quell rightly deserved criticism of some questionable Church stances. This type of paranoia is one of the reasons why many people choose to leave the Catholic faith.

Just because one raises relevant questions about his/her faith does not make him/her a Heretic.

You don’t have to understand Church teaching, but you must follow it. If you choose not too, your wrong. No questions asked, simply wrong.

I don’t understand why this is difficult. Follow the rules, plain and simple.

 

[Veritatis3]

I find the term “Cafeteria Catholics” offensive and find the term used by the more closeminded Catholics to quell rightly deserved criticism of some questionable Church stances. This type of paranoia is one of the reasons why many people choose to leave the Catholic faith.

Just because one raises relevant questions about his/her faith does not make him/her a Heretic.

I just read through your posts…your not Catholic are you? Because a Catholic conforms his will to that of God’s Church, not the other way around.

 

[Heliotropium]

I just read through your posts…your not Catholic are you? Because a Catholic conforms his will to that of God’s Church, not the other way around.

You didnt know? Heretics are now calling themselves “cultural Catholics”, “open minded Catholics”, and my favorite “enlightened Catholics.”

 

[archangel04]

Really? By complaining from three thousand miles away on a message board? By complaining that they don’t have the right to use the title “Catholic”? By pointing out the faults of others? Seriously?

And I’ll bet that nintey nine percent of the people on this message board wouldn’t have the guts to call out their best friend if he were doing something to jeapordize his salvation. I’ll bet that ninety nine percent of the people on this message board would never speak to that friend if he were to call them out for some sin they were engaged in.

These people are members of the Body of Christ in baptism along with us. It’s like breaking your left wrist and then yelling at it because it had the audacity to break. You don’t curse your wrist because it is broken, you nourish it, nurse it and even favor it. Ever think of inviting one of those cafeteria Catholics to play golf or over for a barbeque?

Oh, thank God i’m not like “Those” people! (wink, nod). You know, those “Caf-a-teeeer-ria” Catholics who don’t kneel and recieve in their tounges. And meanwhile Christ is asking a harlot with five husbands for a drink of water.

Bah. Take the logs out of your own eyes. The questions asked in the original post are execllent. But whoever said that we reject the teaching of the Church when we sin was absolutely correct. The degeneration into hipocrisy on some of these threads is disgusting.

-Tim-

Boy you are angry

 

[mathematoons]

Amen to that. Since coming to this website less than a year ago, I have read the comments of many Catholics who state, “I dont believe that” or “the Church is wrong.” Many times this statement comes from Catholics who refuse to accept the teachings of the Church regarding contraception.

If you profess to be Catholic you profess to believe everything the Church has taught and currently teaches. If you don’t believe everything, you aren’t Catholic.

Why don’t we have more members like this?

 

[thistle]

In the past I have asked for a definitive list of what one MUST believe as a Catholic. So for me, unless it’s spelled out specifically somewhere, that is how I choose. I’ve seen a lot of people attempt to list the required beliefs but they always end up throwing one or two things in there that are not required. These are the same people calling other people cafeteria Catholics.

The church cannot error in faith and morals, however humans can, even the Pope unless he invokes the very specific circumstances which grant his statements infallible.

The problem is that Catholics make claims that such and such must be believed even though it is simply not the case.

I’ll give one example. The Assumption of Mary. There are a lot of Catholics who believe she was taken up into heaven before she died, however there are others who believe she died first, and simply was the first one to experience what we all will experience when Christ returns.

According to the teachings of the Church, a Catholic is free to believe either way and based upon my own personal studies, I believe the latter. But you would be surprised how terrible I have been treated in the past for my belief even though there has never been a definitive statement from the Church.

I feel that a lot of people are misclassified as “cafeteria Catholics”. And I think that those who consider themselves a “cafeteria Catholic” and lay the label on to other people are just as much a cafeteria Catholic as the people they accuse unless they have studied every detail of the Catholic faith and follow it to the letter.

Personally I hate labels of any kind. A person who tries to be as Catholic as they can based on how they were taught isn’t any less of a Catholic than someone who was fortunate enough to have a better catechism.

The very first Spiritual Work of Mercy is to to instruct the instruct the ignorant, not shun and reject them.

newadvent.org/cathen/02006b.htm
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assumption_of_Mary#Catholic_teaching
newadvent.org/cathen/10198d.htm

Its very easy. The Catechism of the Catholic Church contains a summary of ALL Church teachings (inafllible and non-infallible) and disciplines and it has footnotes with references to Scripture and other Church documents which support the Church teachings. Catholics MUST accept all the teachings therein.

Using your example you will find the teaching on the Assumption of Mary in the CCC but nothing on whether she died or not first. You must believe she was assumed but you are free to believe she died first or not.

Read the CCC. All the teachings are there.

 

[novusCatholic]

Read the CCC. All the teachings are there.

Good advice.

 

[mathematoons]

Read the CCC. All the teachings are there.

That’s good to know–I wondered if maybe there were teachings outside the CCC I had to know.

 

[jps23430]

Yes, as long as it IS what the Church teaches, and not what some posters on a forum THINK the Church teaches. There have been some doozies posted.

Labeling people “cafeteria Catholics” is a bad idea. Some people truly do not understand Church teaching, some have had very poor catechesis, and some have actually been advised by those in authority whom they know and trust. The actual culpability is really unknown to us. Plus, you have to make sure you aren’t in that group. Every time we sin, we choose to ignore Church teaching.

Labeling anybody anything is actually a bad idea in general. Praying for them is a better idea.

Thank you, I agree. Especially with your statement about poor catechesis. therefore we need to stop labeling or judging. When we do that we are assuming that people are making their decisions that we know are sinful with the same knowledge about church teaching that we have. This simply isn’t the case. Most Catholics, with cradle Catholics in particular do not know their own faith. We cannot fault them for this because most don’t even know that they don’t know. I spent most of my life as one of those people. Thinking I could pick and choose and never really knowing or understanding what the Church taught.

now when it comes to people that DO udnerstand but choose to dissent, I don’t understand.
Personally, I don’t believe there is such a thing as a cafeteria catholic.
Unlike other religions, the Catholic church does not give the option of agreeing with some while opposing other doctrines. The Church teaches that IT is the Bride of Christ, set up by Christ and that it is infallible on doctrinal issues.
Now, you can either agree with that or not.
But if you don’t and are one of those who consider yourself to be a “cafeteria” catholic, I am wondering why?
If you disagree with the Church on certain doctrinal issues, or pick and choose which ones you are going to follow, than why be a Catholic at all.
If you disagree with ANY church doctrine.( not anything a catholic–even the Pope-- says, but a doctrine), then you in effect disagree with the Churches stance that is is infallible on those issues. Would this not make the Church exceptionally arrogant in your point of view, to assert infallibility when in fact it is not? Why would anybody want to be a member of a church like that?

Food for thought.