For Catholics: How do you know that the

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I believe the Catholic Church is infallible because of my faith in Jesus.

Here is just one simple reason why.

Jesus came and taught his disciples, Jesus is God, if what he taught them somehow was not taught properly by him then it would be his fault as he was the teacher.

God has to have a way to maintian the message he taught would not be changed. The Bible does not do that alone as we can see with all the different interpretations out there.

I believe God doesn’t make mistakes or do things halfway and when he created a Church it would be done right.

Therefore I believe in a infallible church maintained by God, not by men, or it would have fallen.

My faith in God is why I believe in the Church, not my faith in the Church. Just as my faith in God, who made the Church is the reason I believe in the Bible.
 
Stingray, here is what I believe, and what Catholics believe:

Credo in unum Deum, Patrem omnipotentem, factorem coeli et terrae, visibilium omnium, et invisibilium. Et in unum Dominum Jesum Christum, Filium Dei unigenitum. Et ex Patre natum ante omnia saecula. Deum de Deo, lumen de lumine, Deum verum de Deo vero. Genitum, non factum, consubstantialem Patri: per quem omnia facta sunt. Qui propter nos homines, et propter nostram salutem descendit de coelis. Et incarnatus est de spiritu sancto ex Maria Virgine: et homo factus est. Crucifixus etiam pro nobis, sub Pontio Pilato passus, et sepultus est. Et resurrexit tertia die, secundum Scripturas. Et ascendit in coelum: sedet ad dexteram Patris. Et iterum venturus est cum gloria, judicare vivos et mortuos: cujus regni non erit finis. Et in Spiritum Sanctum, Dominum et vivificantem: qui ex Patre Filioque procedit. Qui cum Patre et Filio simul adoratur et conglorificatur: qui locutus est per prophetas. Et unam, sanctam, catholicam et apostolicam Ecclesiam. Confiteor unum baptisma in remissionem peccatorum. Et exspecto resurrectionem mortuorum. District of Great Britain Et vitam venturi saeculi. Amen.
Well, some omit the Filioque, but other than that, there is what we believe.
 
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Stingray:
teachings of the Catholic Church are infallible?
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Because the Holy Spirit is the driver, and He don’t need GPS.
 
Amen to all of the above…and I have an example of the catholic church and infallibility!

Before the 1930’s all churches did not approve of birth control…as the years rolled on (and planned parenthood) the women’s movement, sexual revolution…most all churches caved in and gave the big O.K. to birth control. Consequently lax ideas about abortion followed (most women who have an abortion are not athiest I’m guessing) The Catholic church took a beating for this position as it was very unpopular…but held her ground.

Not too long ago I heard an alarming statistic about the birth control pill. Up to 75% of women who are on the pill have accidental abortions. It’s simple…oops…I skipped my pill yesterday…without the hormone to hold me back I ovulate and become pregnant, I then double up on the pill the next day and the new life is gone totally unbeknownst to me…

The Catholic Church made a very hard decision without science to back it up at the time. Now that’s Infallibility!
 
I believe Jesus doesn’t make promises he cannot keep.
I don’t believe Jesus would make a promise that would introduce error into heaven.

Jesus made this statement…

“Whatsoever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, whatsoever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven…”

Now - if Jesus didn’t provide a way for Peter’s decisions to protected from error - then isn’t He exposing heaven to the possiblity of introducing human error into it?
 
(Joshua):
Because the Holy Spirit is the driver, and He don’t need GPS.
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That’s great !

I like to quote Jesus on this one. He promised the Church that whenever 2 or more of you meet and invoks His Name, then He is with us.

No Catholic conclave, meeting, or decree is ever with out these few words starting it :

“In the Name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit”

If Jesus is with us, how can any Catholic decree ever be made in error ???

Won’t happen, Can’t happen.

wc
 
For any better example of Papal infallibility, one only need to look at the controversy before declaing the doctrine of the Immaculate Conception. The Pope had no idea which side to go with. He was faced with a deeply divided issue with folks on both sides insisting they were right, both side threatening to divide the Church if they did not get a proclamation in their favor.

Jesus sent His own mother to clarify this one, up close and in person ! (read about Lourdes). No one could dispute the new evidence, Mary herself told the Church what was the way to go. IF that’s not infallibility, I don’t know what is.

wc
 
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wcknight:
For any better example of Papal infallibility, one only need to look at the controversy before declaing the doctrine of the Immaculate Conception. The Pope had no idea which side to go with. He was faced with a deeply divided issue with folks on both sides insisting they were right, both side threatening to divide the Church if they did not get a proclamation in their favor.

Jesus sent His own mother to clarify this one, up close and in person ! (read about Lourdes). No one could dispute the new evidence, Mary herself told the Church what was the way to go. IF that’s not infallibility, I don’t know what is.

wc
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I love this and I think it is the exact way to explain infallibility…GIVE EXAMPLES…because they are there
 
Genesis315 so aptly wrote, "That’s the way it’s always been interpreted because that’s what the teaching was before the New Testament was written. The New Testament was written to support this teaching, not the other way around. That’s why this interpretation is correct. The interpretation came before the verses.

Show me evidence that the earliest Christians did not believe these things. Also show me why your interpretation is better than the interpretation which has been handed down by the Church for 2000 years.

The burden of proof is on you to prove this interpretation is wrong.
StngRay, can you get to the point? What is it you want to ask? You have been posting all over the map. What’s your point?
 
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Exporter:
Genesis315 so aptly wrote, "That’s the way it’s always been interpreted because that’s what the teaching was before the New Testament was written. The New Testament was written to support this teaching, not the other way around. That’s why this interpretation is correct. The interpretation came before the verses.

Show me evidence that the earliest Christians did not believe these things. Also show me why your interpretation is better than the interpretation which has been handed down by the Church for 2000 years.

The burden of proof is on you to prove this interpretation is wrong.
StngRay, can you get to the point? What is it you want to ask? You have been posting all over the map. What’s your point?
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I don’t understand your comments. The point of this thread is to find out how it is you know what you claim to know.

God bless,
Stingray 🙂
 
Because Jesus told the Apostles, we have proof in the Holy Scriptures as well as in Sacred Tradition. Why do we trust Sacred Tradition? the same reason we trust the Bible. ← Because the Holy Spirit inspires and because Jesus promised the Church never to fall under hades.
 
I have been wondering something for some time now, people expect Catholics to defend the faith constantly, proving that it is correct. Why don’t they try to prove it wrong? Why make us scramble around everytime they mention something, like “prove to me that Mary is sinless” we should be saying to them “prove to me that Mary was not sinless”.
 
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mgy100:
Stingray, here is what I believe, and what Catholics believe:

Credo in unum Deum, Patrem omnipotentem, factorem coeli et terrae, visibilium omnium, et invisibilium. Et in unum Dominum Jesum Christum, Filium Dei unigenitum. Et ex Patre natum ante omnia saecula. Deum de Deo, lumen de lumine, Deum verum de Deo vero. Genitum, non factum, consubstantialem Patri: per quem omnia facta sunt. Qui propter nos homines, et propter nostram salutem descendit de coelis. Et incarnatus est de spiritu sancto ex Maria Virgine: et homo factus est. Crucifixus etiam pro nobis, sub Pontio Pilato passus, et sepultus est. Et resurrexit tertia die, secundum Scripturas. Et ascendit in coelum: sedet ad dexteram Patris. Et iterum venturus est cum gloria, judicare vivos et mortuos: cujus regni non erit finis. Et in Spiritum Sanctum, Dominum et vivificantem: qui ex Patre Filioque procedit. Qui cum Patre et Filio simul adoratur et conglorificatur: qui locutus est per prophetas. Et unam, sanctam, catholicam et apostolicam Ecclesiam. Confiteor unum baptisma in remissionem peccatorum. Et exspecto resurrectionem mortuorum. District of Great Britain Et vitam venturi saeculi. Amen.
Well, some omit the Filioque, but other than that, there is what we believe.
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well, i guess that clears it all up for him… :rolleyes: . thanks for showing us all you great knowlege of latin (or your great knowlege of cutting and pasting) but this brings nothing to the discussion.
 
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