**Originally Posted by jakasaki
This isn’t your “personal sand box” - if you need to send a message to a poster, use the PM system otherwise, anything you post in the forums is for all to address.
Oh God!I’m discuzzing with byzantine, OK?
:tsktsk: :tsktsk: :tsktsk:
Friendship, you’ve been doing such a good job responding to all these people ignoring you, that perhaps you can use the time spent on that to respond to the answers I gave you.Fizzle! I doubt that you realy can’t understand or try to show that you can’t understand.
About Orientalists(not orientalism!) I explained eanough and if your bigotry let you, I said real things. If we must trust what your orientalists say so you must accept what our relegion scientists say. Absolutly for knowing the reality of a history event we must try to study first books about that event such as Ibn hisham, Al-maqazi vaghedi, and the holy Quran.
But You answered me discourteous, So I get you out of my friends list, because I have no friendship with brusque ones. Absolutly if you repeat insulting me again I’ll give you a nice houce in my ignore list.
Why would you ignore people that you disagree with? This is a forum where all can express their views.Fizzle! I doubt that you realy can’t understand or try to show that you can’t understand.
About Orientalists(not orientalism!) I explained eanough and if your bigotry let you, I said real things. If we must trust what your orientalists say so you must accept what our relegion scientists say. Absolutly for knowing the reality of a history event we must try to study first books about that event such as Ibn hisham, Al-maqazi vaghedi, and the holy Quran.
But You answered me discourteous, So I get you out of my friends list, because I have no friendship with brusque ones. Absolutly if you repeat insulting me again I’ll give you a nice houce in my ignore list.
My friend you can think I can’t reply you! Absolutly answering logical posts takes more time than others! But be sure this discussion will be contniued.Friendship, you’ve been doing such a good job responding to all these people ignoring you, that perhaps you can use the time spent on that to respond to the answers I gave you.
I just ignore boisterous members. If I feared people dissagree with me, I never loged on here!
about Jaklasaki, this member affronted me, So out the ID of this member in my ignore list.
All right. I’m waiting.
My fiend, please read my sentences carefuly, I said" all jews are so and if it is not a generall bilief in judaism, There no problem because Quran didn’t said “all of jews…”
taken from: islamic-awareness.org/Quran/Contrad/External/ezra.html
There are number of traditions concerning the site of Ezra's tomb. According to Josephus it is in Jerusalem; other hold that he was buried in Urta or in Zunzumu on the Tigris; but the general accepted version is that his tomb is situated in Uzer, a village near Basra. This tradition is mentioned by Benjamin of Tuleda, Pethahiah of Regensburg, Judah Alharizi, and other travelers, Jewish and non-Jewish who visited Babylonia.[1]...we can deduce that the inhabitants of Hijaz during Muhammad's time knew portions, at least, of 3 Enoch in association with the Jews. The angels over which Metatron becomes chief are identified in the Enoch traditions as the sons of God, the Bene Elohim, the Watchers, the fallen ones as the causer of the flood. In 1 Enoch, and 4 Ezra, the term Son of God can be applied to the Messiah, but most often it is applied to the righteous men, of whom Jewish tradition holds there to be no more righteous than the ones God elected to translate to heaven alive. It is easy, then, to imagine that among the Jews of the Hijaz who were apparently involved in mystical speculations associated with the merkabah, Ezra, because of the traditions of his translation, because of his piety, and particularly because he was equated with Enoch as the Scribe of God, could be termed one of the Bene Elohim. And, of course, he would fit the description of religious leader (one of the ahbar of the Qur'an 9:31) whom the Jews had exalted.[3]H. Z. Hirschberg proposed another assumption, based on the words of Ibn Hazm, namely, that the 'righteous who live in Yemen believed that 'Uzayr was indeed the son of Allah.' According to other Muslim sources, there were some Yemenite Jews who had converted to Islam who believed that Ezra was the messiah. For Muhammad, Ezra, the apostle (!) of messiah, can be seen in the same light as the Christian saw Jesus, the messiah, the son of Allah.[4]This grievous charge against the Jews, the commentators endeavour to support by telling us, that it is meant of some ancient heterdox Jews, or else of some Jews of Medina; who said so for no other reason, than for that the law being utterly lost and forgotten during the Babylonish captivity, Ezra having been raised to life after he had been dead one hundred years, dictated the whole anew unto the scribes, out of his own memory; at which they greatly marvelled, and declared that he could not have done it, unless he were the son of God. Al-Beidawi adds, that the imputation must be true, because this verse was read to the Jews and they did not contradict it; which they were ready enough to do in other instances.
That Ezra did restore not only the Pentateuch, but also the other books of the Old Testament, by divine revelation, was the opinion of several of the Christian fathers, who are quoted by Dr.Prideaux, and of some other writers; which they seem to have first borrowed from a passage in that very ancient apocryphal book, called in our English Bible, the second book of Esdras. Dr. Prideaux tells us, that herein the Fathers attributed more to Ezra, than the Jews themselves, which he laboured much in, and went a great way in the perfecting of it. It is not improbable however, that the fiction came originally from the Jews, though they be now of another opinion, and I cannot fix it upon them by any direct proof. For, not to insist upon the testimony of the Mohammedans (which yet I cannot but think of some little weight in a point of this nature,) it is allowed by the most sagacious critics, that the second book of Ezra was written by a Chrisitian indeed, but yet one who had been bred a Jew, and was intimately acquainted with the fables of the Rabbins; and the story itself is perfectly in the taste and was of thinking of those men.[5]But it is not at all unlikely that the source of Mohammed's indictment of the Jews is to be found among the Samaritans or amongst Arab tribesmen of Samaritan strain. If we found in Samaritan literature the opposite belief that Ezra (or Uzair) was the son of Satan, we would be well-nigh sure of having settled the matter.[7]We must be sure that hadith is realy said by prophet Muhammad, first. I’m not sure and you must confirm it. We have eanough reasons to say that some people create apoctryphal hadithes and big number of such hadithes came in hadith books.
Quran never asked god to curse others.Yes Quran says they’ll to hell. It is not only reason. They deny prophethopod of prophet Muhammad.
No,No, No. they had not same condition with christians. And about “the jews” it is the problem of translations. Quran says وَ قالَتِ الْيَهُودُ عُزَيْرٌ ابْنُ اللَّه and it just mean:
The goverment was Islamic and jaziah was a tax.(Muslims gave zakat and khoms) Absolutly if someone doesn’t give tax goverment gives it by force. Islamic goverment had to save them instead of tax.
An example can help. A number of enemies attack us and kill some of people and come back to their country. Is it true if we don’t do any thing because they don’t want fight with us? Or if some people betray and encourange enemies to attck us, What we must do? Absoluty they want war us but their war is hidden.
Do what?
As I said before Quran didn’t said all of jews and Quran is not a book about relegions and just replied the persons whi dicussed muslims.