? For Protestants and disunity

[aidanbradypop]

What does believing in Jesus mean? Does it mean that we should do what he commanded or can we just believe in him?

John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.

That verse comes to mind. What do you mean by doing as he commanded? Am I living as Christ like as I can? Do I love God and neighbor? I accepted the free gift of salvation by Grace. I believe in my soul that Christ died for my sins. I do charity, preach the Gospel, feed the hungry, provide for the poor…etc. I am in no way perfect and thank God everyday that when I fall, He helps to restore me.

If that is what you are getting at then I would say that I try my best to live as he commanded.

If you are referring to being a member of the Catholic Church then no.

 

[aidanbradypop]

This…

The OP Adam.

 

[Isaiah45_9]

What verse?

John 17:11

 

[aidanbradypop]

John 17:11

And our faith in Christ makes us one! When we all get to heaven, God willing, are we going to be seperated like the bad joke at the church coffee hour? Catholics on one said and Protestants in another room?

 

[GaryTaylor]

The OP Adam.

So

The OP Adam.

Here…

Adam wants one church so I thought I would offer

How do you arrive at the church conclusion whichever it may be? I was under the impression it was Jesus alone. Why Church at all? Why the Bible for that matter? I mean in your opinion Jesus is enough as it seems thats what has been stated. Or am I misunderstanding you?

Whats the connection with AOG, Evangelicals etc. I’m not getting what your saying.

 

[aidanbradypop]

How do you arrive at the church conclusion whichever it may be? I was under the impression it was Jesus alone. Why Church at all? Why the Bible for that matter? I mean in your opinion Jesus is enough as it seems thats what has been stated. Or am I misunderstanding you?

Whats the connection with AOG, Evangelicals etc. I’m not getting what your saying.

Gary

Salvation only comes by Christ alone. We gather at church to praise God, fellowship with fellow believers, partake in baptisms, eat the Lord’s Supper and hear the Word of God preach. We attend services to enrich ourlives, grow in our faith and prepare use to share the Gospel with others. We are called to keep the Sabbath Holy as well.

Our salvation does not come from the church. It comes froms the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ.

Acts4:10-12
John 14 : 6

Those come to mind

 

[GaryTaylor]

Gary

You answered nothing of what I asked, do you plan on it? I asked

Adam wants one church so I thought I would offer

How do you arrive at the church conclusion whichever it may be? I was under the impression it was Jesus alone. Why Church at all? Why the Bible for that matter? I mean in your opinion Jesus is enough as it seems thats what has been stated. Or am I misunderstanding you?

Whats the connection with AOG, Evangelicals etc. I’m not getting what your saying.

 

[aidanbradypop]

You answered nothing of what I asked, do you plan on it? I asked

Adam wants one church so I thought I would offer

How do you arrive at the church conclusion whichever it may be? I was under the impression it was Jesus alone. Why Church at all? Why the Bible for that matter? I mean in your opinion Jesus is enough as it seems thats what has been stated. Or am I misunderstanding you?

Whats the connection with AOG, Evangelicals etc. I’m not getting what your saying.

Gary I answered you questions. Sorry it is not the answers you want. Have a good evening.

 

[GaryTaylor]

Gary I answered you questions. Sorry it is not the answers you want. Have a good evening.

I can’t see where. But as long as you think so.

Salvation only comes by Christ alone

But…

We gather at church to praise God, fellowship with fellow believers, partake in baptisms, eat the Lord’s Supper and hear the Word of God preach. We attend services to enrich ourlives, grow in our faith and prepare use to share the Gospel with others. We are called to keep the Sabbath Holy as well.

So you need to go to Church or no? And why the one you attend?

 

[aidanbradypop]

So you need to go to Church or no? And why the one you attend?

We all should attend our church services regularly. Jesus alone saves me and not a church. That does not mean we forego church attending. We are to keep the Sabbath Holy. I do not believe OSAS. Not sure if you thought that or not.

If someone accepts the gift of salvation and then doesn’t attend services, I assume they would have a rough time building their faith and keeping it strong. Of course I will not judge their soul, but I would personally find it tough to build my relationship with Jesus if I did not attend or read the Scriptures. I in no way meant that we should not attend church. Sorry if it came across that way.

Why Evangelical and AoG? Because that is where I wish to worship and fellowship. Just as you or any other Catholic wishes to be Catholic.

 

[SyroMalankara]

We all should attend our church services regularly. Jesus alone saves me and not a church. That does not mean we forego church attending. We are to keep the Sabbath Holy. I do not believe OSAS. Not sure if you thought that or not.

Keep the Sabbath Holy how? When did Sabbath include Saturday. Please cite verses for both reasons.

If someone accepts the gift of salvation and then doesn’t attend services, I assume they would have a rough time building their faith and keeping it strong.

Why, if all that’s needed is believing in Jesus, why would it be rough? I believe that gravity exists and don’t need it reinforced communally on a regular basis to keep that belief strong.

Of course I will not judge their soul, but I would personally find it tough to build my relationship with Jesus if I did not attend or read the Scriptures.

One could read at home, or not read at all. I don’t need to read about gravity to believe its real.

 

[aidanbradypop]

Keep the Sabbath Holy how? When did Sabbath include Saturday. Please cite verses for both reasons.

Why, if all that’s needed is believing in Jesus, why would it be rough? I believe that gravity exists and don’t need it reinforced communally on a regular basis to keep that belief strong.

One could read at home, or not read at all. I don’t need to read about gravity to believe its real.

You are doing wonderful it sounds like!

 

[SyroMalankara]

You are doing wonderful it sounds like!

Except Jesus never said just believe in me and you are assured salvation. He said directly the opposite, “many will say to me Lord, Lord…”.

 

[aidanbradypop]

Except Jesus never said just believe in me and you are assured salvation. He said directly the opposite, “many will say to me Lord, Lord…”.

So John 3:16 is false?

Yes many will. I pray that they find our Lord and Savior and place their trust and faith in Him.

 

[SyroMalankara]

No, but isolating the verse out of context like you have is false.

John 3:3 Jesus answered him, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born anew, he cannot see the kingdom of God.”** 4 Nicode′mus said to him, “How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mother’s womb and be born?” 5 Jesus answered, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. 6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.[c] 7 Do not marvel that I said to you, ‘You must be born anew.’[d] 8 The wind[e] blows where it wills, and you hear the sound of it, but you do not know whence it comes or whither it goes; so it is with every one who is born of the Spirit.” 9 Nicode′mus said to him, “How can this be?” 10 Jesus answered him, “Are you a teacher of Israel, and yet you do not understand this? 11 Truly, truly, I say to you, we speak of what we know, and bear witness to what we have seen; but you do not receive our testimony. 12 If I have told you earthly things and you do not believe, how can you believe if I tell you heavenly things? 13 No one has ascended into heaven but he who descended from heaven, the Son of man.[f] 14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, so must the Son of man be lifted up, 15 that whoever believes in him may have eternal life.”[g]

16 For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. 17 For God sent the Son into the world, not to condemn the world, but that the world might be saved through him. 18 He who believes in him is not condemned; he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God. 19 And this is the judgment, that the light has come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. 20 For every one who does evil hates the light, and does not come to the light, lest his deeds should be exposed. 21 But he who does what is true comes to the light, that it may be clearly seen that his deeds have been wrought in God.

Believe, yes. Believe all to what the testimony gives witness. Believe. Repent. Be Baptized in Water and Spirit. Do Good Deeds. Be Saved.**

 

[aidanbradypop]

No, but isolating the verse out of context like you have is false.

John 3:3 Jesus answered him, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born anew, he cannot see the kingdom of God.”**** 4 Nicode′mus said to him, “How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mother’s womb and be born?” 5 Jesus answered, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. 6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.[c] 7 Do not marvel that I said to you, ‘You must be born anew.’[d] 8 The wind[e] blows where it wills, and you hear the sound of it, but you do not know whence it comes or whither it goes; so it is with every one who is born of the Spirit.” 9 Nicode′mus said to him, “How can this be?” 10 Jesus answered him, “Are you a teacher of Israel, and yet you do not understand this? 11 Truly, truly, I say to you, we speak of what we know, and bear witness to what we have seen; but you do not receive our testimony. 12 If I have told you earthly things and you do not believe, how can you believe if I tell you heavenly things? 13 No one has ascended into heaven but he who descended from heaven, the Son of man.[f] 14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, so must the Son of man be lifted up, 15 that whoever believes in him may have eternal life.”[g]

16 For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. 17 For God sent the Son into the world, not to condemn the world, but that the world might be saved through him. 18 He who believes in him is not condemned; he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God. 19 And this is the judgment, that the light has come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. 20 For every one who does evil hates the light, and does not come to the light, lest his deeds should be exposed. 21 But he who does what is true comes to the light, that it may be clearly seen that his deeds have been wrought in God.

Believe, yes. Believe all to what the testimony gives witness. Believe. Repent. Be Baptized in Water and Spirit. Do Good Deeds. Be Saved.

I have no problem with what you just wrote. I am a born again Christian. What is your point?

 

[SyroMalankara]

I have no problem with what you just wrote. I am a born again Christian. What is your point?

My point is that “believing” just ain’t enough.

 

[aidanbradypop]

My point is that “believing” just ain’t enough.

My point is that salvation comes from Jesus Christ and not a Church. I’m sure you may disagree and that is ok. Peter said to repent, believe and be baptized. I have done all three. I try to live as Romans 12 instructs me to. I am not against good works. They are not part of saving me, yet a good tree produces good fruit and I try to live by that.

I fear we are off topic.

 

[Abu]

aidanbradypop
My point is that salvation comes from Jesus Christ and not a Church.

Your “point”, by ignoring Christ’s teaching, **“if he refuses to hear even the Church let him be like the heathen and a publican” (Mt 18:17), **is relegating Christ’s teaching to the trash can!

Further, having commissioned Peter as His first Vicar, on whom He founded His Church, Jesus instructed the eleven and proclaimed: “All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth. Go therefore and make disciples of all nations….teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you…” (Mt 28:18-20).
Thus, from the first, the faithful “remained faithful to the teaching of the Apostles, to the brotherhood, to the breaking of bread, and to the prayers.” (Acts 2:42).

Therefore, brothers, stand firm and hold fast to the traditions that you were taught, either by an oral statement or by a letter of ours." (2 Thess 2:15).

“Take as your norm the sound words that you heard from me, with faith and love that are in Christ Jesus. Guard this rich trust with the help of the Holy Spirit that dwells within us.” (2 Tim 1:13-14). Again St Paul writes: “And what you heard from me through many witnesses entrust to faithful people who will have the ability to teach others as well.” (2 Tim 2:2).

In Colossians 2: 4-23, St Paul calls on his flock to follow Christ “as you were taught” and warns against merely “human precepts and teachings.”

1 Cor 1:10: I urge you brothers, in the name of Our Lord Jesus Christ, that all of you agree in what you say, and that there be no divisions among you, but that you be united in the same mind and in the same purpose.

We are of God. He who knows God hears us; he who is not of God does not hear us. By this we know the spirit of truth and the spirit of error. (1Jn 4:6).

St. Paul says also, “through the Church the manifold wisdom of God might now be made known to the principalities and powers in the heavenly places (Eph 3:10).” The Church teaches even the angels! This is with the authority of Christ! We are redeemed by Christ’s Passion and Death (heaven was opened); we are not saved until we co-operate with Him.

St Paul is very clear: “I fill up in my flesh what is still lacking in regard to Christ’s afflictions, for the sake of His Body which is the Church.” (Col. 1:24).

That Catholic Church is supreme, as founded by Christ as His sole Church, and affirmed as just that by the Apostles and St Paul.

We cannot be saved without the Church. It is through the Church, which carries on and makes present the salvific work of Jesus Christ in the world, that all who are saved reach heaven (even if it is perhaps only there that they realize it). Those who, through no fault of their own, have never known Christ or his Church can still be saved. But their salvation, too, is the effect of Jesus working through his Church. In a positive sense, this theological principle “means that all salvation comes from Christ the Head through the Church which is his Body” (CCC 846).
Encyclopedia of Catholic Doctrine, OSV].

 

[Adamski]

My point is that “believing” just ain’t enough.

Book of James … Even the Demons believed