Forced to give communion to non-Catholics?

[Lepanto]

One of the administrators at a local (secular) nursing home insists that the Extraordinary Ministers who distribute communion there do so to even the non-Catholic residents if they request it.

By the way, the administrator is Catholic so she thinks she knows Church law.

I showed her the follwowing from:
vatican.va/archive/ENG1104/__P2T.HTM

Unfortunately, I had to conceded that there are a lot of loopholes in the Canon Law verbiage.

Bottom line: how can I demonstrate to her that under normal circumstances, only Catholics who have received the sacrament of Holy Communion are allowed to be given Catholic communion?

Can. 844 §1. Catholic ministers administer the sacraments licitly to Catholic members of the Christian faithful alone, who likewise receive them licitly from Catholic ministers alone, without prejudice to the prescripts of §§2, 3, and 4 of this canon, and ⇒ can. 861, §2.

§2. Whenever necessity requires it or true spiritual advantage suggests it, and provided that danger of error or of indifferentism is avoided, the Christian faithful for whom it is physically or morally impossible to approach a Catholic minister are permitted to receive the sacraments of penance, Eucharist, and anointing of the sick from non-Catholic ministers in whose Churches these sacraments are valid.

§3. Catholic ministers administer the sacraments of penance, Eucharist, and anointing of the sick licitly to members of Eastern Churches which do not have full communion with the Catholic Church if they seek such on their own accord and are properly disposed. This is also valid for members of other Churches which in the judgment of the Apostolic See are in the same condition in regard to the sacraments as these Eastern Churches.

§4. If the danger of death is present or if, in the judgment of the diocesan bishop or conference of bishops, some other grave necessity urges it, Catholic ministers administer these same sacraments licitly also to other Christians not having full communion with the Catholic Church, who cannot approach a minister of their own community and who seek such on their own accord, provided that they manifest Catholic faith in respect to these sacraments and are properly disposed.

§5. For the cases mentioned in §§2, 3, and 4, the diocesan bishop or conference of bishops is not to issue general norms except after consultation at least with the local competent authority of the interested non-Catholic Church or community.

 

[RichT]

I am assuming you are a minister of care. Do you have a person in charge of pastoral care for your parish or diocese? If so, you need to ask them for help. They need to call this person and set them straight.

 

[Seven_Sorrows]

You could just ask her “what is up?”
If she is catholic, she should believe it IS truly the body and blood of jesus christ. She should also believe in confession and that we must be pure to receive Jesus. We must also believe that we ARE receiving Jesus. So if you just let anyone receive Jesus you are not even respecting God at all. If the person hasn’t been to confession Jesus would be going in an unpure body which corinthians talks about “receviing unworthily”. if they don’t believe it is jesus, it is making a mockery of the cerimony. and tell the lady…if the people really wanted it, or really believed it was jesus…they would become catholic!!!

 

[Marauder]

If you are an EMHC it isn’t really your job anyway.
Before the next time you go talk to your pastor or at least the person in charge of the Ministry of the Sick in your parish about the problem. Hopefully they will solve the problem.

If you KNOW someone is not Catholic while on your own visiting people, don’t give them communion. If the person complains, have them talk to the person in charge of the ministry and/or the pastor.

 

[Mysty101]

Where do you get the Communion you distribute? Speak to the Priest in charge there. It may be a misunderstanding. I was once told that if a patient practices a religion (usually Episcopalian) which believes in the real presence, is not visited by his priest and requests to receive, we are permitted to give them Holy Communion. This does not translate that you can give to any non-Catholic who asks.

It is not up to a lay person to tell you you must distribute Communion to non Catholics. The priest who consecrated the hosts is responsible for their safe-keeping.

Were the hosts consecrated by a Catholic Priest? If not, no Catholic EMHC should distribute them.

 

[John_Colean]

**I probably have a rather unorthodox view of this subject that many may not agree with, but here goes. We refer to the Eucharist as “The Lord’s Supper”. It is not the Catholic Church’s supper or the supper of the Pope or anyone else. It is pure and simple The Lord’s Supper. I am not aware of any Scripture passages where the Lord excluded people who had a genuine desire to share in and partake of his graces. I have to ask myself the question, “If Christ were here today, what would He do”. I will agree that it is not appropriate for someone who does not believe that Christ is truly presence to receive. However, there are many non-Catholic Christians who believe in the real presence and I believe they should be accorded the opportunity to receive as all Catholics. I believe the Church should move towards removing and not institutionalizing obstacles from the Faithful. I was amazed to learn recently that the word religion come from the Latin root means “supernatural constraint”. I would simply ask the nursing home resident if they understood that this was the Body of Christ and let the Lord deal with the rest. **

 

[Mysty101]

John—the font and size you use are difficult to read, but I’ll take a shot at what I think you may be saying.

Catholic EMHC operate under the Pastor of their Parish or another Catholic Priest. They are Catholic, and are to give Communion to Catholics—nothing about being kind or nice—loving our brothers or anything like that. We are Catholic.

These are the laws of our Religion, and no one can force us to break them. This is guaranteed under the Religous Freedom guaranteed by our constitution. You cannot force a Catholic EMHC to give Communion to a non-Catholic, any more than you could force that non-Catholic to take it, if he didn’t want it,

 

[leonardoboff]

**I probably have a rather unorthodox view of this subject that many may not agree with, but here goes. We refer to the Eucharist as “The Lord’s Supper”. It is not the Catholic Church’s supper or the supper of the Pope or anyone else. It is pure and simple The Lord’s Supper. I am not aware of any Scripture passages where the Lord excluded people who had a genuine desire to share in and partake of his graces. I have to ask myself the question, “If Christ were here today, what would He do”. I will agree that it is not appropriate for someone who does not believe that Christ is truly presence to receive. However, there are many non-Catholic Christians who believe in the real presence and I believe they should be accorded the opportunity to receive as all Catholics. I believe the Church should move towards removing and not institutionalizing obstacles from the Faithful. I was amazed to learn recently that the word religion come from the Latin root means “supernatural constraint”. I would simply ask the nursing home resident if they understood that this was the Body of Christ and let the Lord deal with the rest. **

John,

Eucharistic unity is not so simple as you would wish it to be.

The Churches ministers are in fact custodians of the sacraments and have a responsibility to see that due reverence is always accorded to the celebration of the mysteries of our faith.

Another way of looking at this is to understand the meaning and the tradition that lies behind the whole initiation process. There are many who have enrolled upon the path of intiation that are waiting and preparing for the moment they recieve full entry into the Church community through Holy Communion. Their patience has a purpose and reminds us all that grace is never cheap.

 

[RichT]

**I probably have a rather unorthodox view of this subject that many may not agree with, but here goes. We refer to the Eucharist as “The Lord’s Supper”. It is not the Catholic Church’s supper or the supper of the Pope or anyone else. It is pure and simple The Lord’s Supper. I am not aware of any Scripture passages where the Lord excluded people who had a genuine desire to share in and partake of his graces. I have to ask myself the question, “If Christ were here today, what would He do”. I will agree that it is not appropriate for someone who does not believe that Christ is truly presence to receive. However, there are many non-Catholic Christians who believe in the real presence and I believe they should be accorded the opportunity to receive as all Catholics. I believe the Church should move towards removing and not institutionalizing obstacles from the Faithful. I was amazed to learn recently that the word religion come from the Latin root means “supernatural constraint”. I would simply ask the nursing home resident if they understood that this was the Body of Christ and let the Lord deal with the rest. **

Oh My…

 

[John_Colean]

Hopefully this font will be a little easier to read. My position is really not directed specifically at forcing an Eucharist Minister to distribute the sacred Species to all nursing homes residences, but is addressed on a much broader basis. Perhaps my comment is out of place, but I believe it is related in a general context. You indicated that “We are Catholic” or Universal and that is my very point. I am not sure that we are being Universal and meeting Christ’s direction when we are more concerned with following the rule(s) than making Christ available to all. It is very convenient for those in authority to dictate rules and regulations to those who are not in authority. Simply to say this is the rule weakens the institutions which is proposes to protect. Was this not Christ’s primary complaint towards the Jewish leadership, i.e. they had overburdened the faithful in a number of different areas.

Regarding the comment from Thread #8 that Grace is not cheap – it may not be cheap, but it is God’s free gift.

 

[kmktexas]

John,

Suz said “We are Catholic” Capital “C”. Members of the Roman Catholic Church (and certain other Churches in union with it).

You are speaking of catholic equalling universal. That’s small “c” catholic, as proclaimed in the Creed.

EMHCs, and regular ministers of Communion, are bound by the Church’s rules for distributing Communion. While those rules do allow for non-Catholics to receive Communion is some extraordinary circumstances, a routine visit by an EMHC to a nursing home is not likely to meet the conditions for that kind of exception.

 

[All4lifetoo]

**I probably have a rather unorthodox view of this subject that many may not agree with, but here goes. We refer to the Eucharist as “The Lord’s Supper”. It is not the Catholic Church’s supper or the supper of the Pope or anyone else. It is pure and simple The Lord’s Supper. I am not aware of any Scripture passages where the Lord excluded people who had a genuine desire to share in and partake of his graces. I have to ask myself the question, “If Christ were here today, what would He do”. I will agree that it is not appropriate for someone who does not believe that Christ is truly presence to receive. However, there are many non-Catholic Christians who believe in the real presence and I believe they should be accorded the opportunity to receive as all Catholics. I believe the Church should move towards removing and not institutionalizing obstacles from the Faithful. I was amazed to learn recently that the word religion come from the Latin root means “supernatural constraint”. I would simply ask the nursirng home resident if they understood that this was the Body of Christ and let the Lord deal with the rest. **

John, this font is very hard to read. I hope you change it.

Regarding the issue, Christ is here today. He speaks through His Church. His Church teaches that some people are unworthy to receive His Body and Blood. St. Paul was the first one of His Church to teach this. Unworthy reception of His Body and Blood leads not to salvation, but to condemnation. For this reason, His Church teaches that one must be prepared to receive before one can receive. This preparation consists of being in communion with the Church and of being in a state of grace. This teaching guards and protects the souls of those who are unprepared to receive Holy Communion. If someone TRULY want to receive Holy Communion and to benefit from the reception, they will properly prepare for it, not complain because they are being denied.

 

[Mysty101]

All4lifetoo:

Regarding the issue, Christ is here today. He speaks through His Church. His Church teaches that some people are unworthy to receive His Body and Blood. .

We are all unworthy. I wouldn’t want non-Catholics to think we are making a judgement call on them. They have their Eucharist according to their laws, and I would not violate their lawss. I would hope they would respect the laws of the RCC. It would be better to say non-Catholics are “unprepared acording to the laws of the Roman Catholic Church” (**Matthew 16 **19… whatever you bind on earth will be1] bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be2] loosed in heaven." ) since Christ has entrusted the safekeeping of His sacraments to her.

 

[All4lifetoo]

Mysty101:

We are all unworthy. I wouldn’t want non-Catholics to think we are making a judgement call on them. They have their Eucharist according to their laws, and I would not violate their lawss. I would hope they would respect the laws of the RCC. It would be better to say non-Catholics are “unprepared acording to the laws of the Roman Catholic Church” (**Matthew 16 **19… whatever you bind on earth will be1] bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be2] loosed in heaven." ) since Christ has entrusted the safekeeping of His sacraments to her.

You are using the word “unworthy” in a different sense than I did. What you say is true in general, in that we have all sinned and none of us deserve to receive Jesus in the Eucharist, nor do we deserve mercy. Both of these are pure grace from God. That is why we pray at Mass, “Lord I am unworthy to receive You, but only say the word, and I shall be healed.”

I used the word “unworthy” in a very specific sense of being in a state of sin or of not being in communion with Rome, and I specified these. If you change the meaning or the sense of the word as I intended it, and then argue against the new meaning or sense, you are arguing against a straw man.

I can understand how someone might take offense against being called unworthy, but perhaps that will prompt them to correct the situation. St. Paul used the word, and told the Corinthians to examine themselves before partaking. We shouldn’t shy away from using the same terms the Scriptures use. The CCC uses the word, and distinguishes between worthy and unworthy reception. If the Church herself uses the word, I don’t see why we should not.

 

[Mysty101]

All4lifetoo:

. We shouldn’t shy away from using the same terms the Scriptures use. The CCC uses the word, and distinguishes between worthy and unworthy reception. If the Church herself uses the word, I don’t see why we should not.

I disagree. I do not think it is Christian charitable behavior to use a term that you have a good idea will be offensive, when there is another way of saying what needs to be said.

Use the term unworthy for Catholics, who prefess to follow Catholic beliefs, but do not live according to the laws of the Catholic Church—they are unworthy.

But a non-catholic who is not bound by Catholic laws is simply not in Communion with the Catholic Church, and unworthy is a poor choice of words in that situation. He practices a different Religion, and therefore may be worthy of Communion, but not a Catholic sacrament.
smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/8/8_5_11.gif

 

[All4lifetoo]

Mysty101:

I disagree. I do not think it is Christian charitable behavior to use a term that you have a good idea will be offensive, when there is another way of saying what needs to be said.

Use the term unworthy for Catholics, who prefess to follow Catholic beliefs, but do not live according to the laws of the Catholic Church—they are unworthy.

But a non-catholic who is not bound by Catholic laws is simply not in Communion with the Catholic Church, and unworthy is a poor choice of words in that situation. He practices a different Religion, and therefore may be worthy of Communion, but not a Catholic sacrament.

smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/8/8_5_11.gif

People take offense over all kinds of things. One cannot refuse to speak the truth simply because someone may take offense over it. This is the same kind of thinking that causes our priest and bishops to fail to speak about Hell, sin, divorce and remarriage, contraception, etc. They are afraid of giving offense.

Additionally, the use of the word “unworthy” does not need to give offense because it can be explained in terms that they understand that it does not mean blameworthy. One does not say, “Your are unworthy to receive Communion” and leave it at that. One goes on to explain what it means. One explains that a person who is not in communion with the Pope, who does not accept the teaching of the Church, is not spiritually prepared to recieve Communion. One explains that to receive Communion, while actually not in communion, is to bear false witness to all present and to God. Many will accept these explanations and reflect upon what actions it would take for them to become worthy to receive Communion. Others have so much pride, that they can’t stand to be told that they cannot receive Communion, no matter how they are told.

ANY baptised Christian is bound by Catholic laws. Christ has only one Church and one Pope. All validly baptised Christians, by viture of their baptism, are bound to obey the Pope and Christ’s Church. Those who are not in full communion with the Church and the Pope are not excused from obeying the Church and the Pope although they may not be culpable (blameworthy) for their disobedience. The very reason that the Pope says the proper term for their comunities is “ecclesial communities” and not “churches” is because there is only ONE Church. Baptism brings them into that ONE Church although it is a partial inclusion by virtue of their disobedience (knowingly or unknowingly).

 

[Mysty101]

It would be far easier to just use a term which is acceptable.

A priest or a bishop is speaking to someone who claims to follow Catholic teaching. A non-Catholic does not.

There is no reason to use Cathoic terminology to a non-catholic when a more acceptable term would convey the message you need to get across.

Have you ever distributed Communion in a hospital or nursing home? I have, and I will not offend these people, if I can avoid it.

 

[All4lifetoo]

Mysty101:

It would be far easier to just use a term which is acceptable.

I really have no problem with this. I don’t use terms that I know are going to give offense unless they are unavoidable or are needed in the conversation. I also don’t avoid using terms simply because they might give offense.

A priest or a bishop is speaking to someone who claims to follow Catholic teaching. A non-Catholic does not.

False. The entire mission of the Church is to go out and evanglize, to take the word of God to those who do not have it. Priests and bishops speak to non-Catholics all the time. Likewise, non-Catholic ministers speak to Catholics all the time.

There is no reason to use Cathoic terminology to a non-catholic when a more acceptable term would convey the message you need to get across.

False. That is like saying we should not speak of transubstantiation to a Luthern, because they don’t accept it.

Have you ever distributed Communion in a hospital or nursing home? I have, and I will not offend these people, if I can avoid it.

What do you mean here? Do you mean that you give Communion to those who are not Catholic just so you don’t offend them? I hope you don’t mean this.

 

[Mysty101]

All4lifetoo:

.

I would not knowingly give a non-Catholic Communion—however

I would not tell a non-Catholic they were unworthy to receive Communion.

If you want to do this—do it.

I will not. I will explain it in a way which is less offensive . How on earth are you evangelizing if you turn someone off???

 

[Exporter]

Lepanto,
**How do you know that administrator is Catholic, she may be lying. If she is Catholic she knows better. ONLY CATHOLICS can recieve the Eucharist! **

You must be a weak minded person to distribute the Eucharist to non-Catholics. You are COMMITING A SIN if you did that! You have to confessthat sin , quick.

**If you prance around giving the Eucharist ( which is Jesus Christ) to lets say a Baptist or an Evangelical, the families of those people **
**Could sue you for a million! The very idea! If I was a Baptist and some one came by passing out the Catholic Eucharist to me, I would sue for all you have! **