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Reuben_J
Guest
Then she should not be wasting her time here. Go and convert the heathens - there are many unbelievers out there and many of those are really grieving. She should go out there and preach her Gospels and save them.I think CU is not a “guy”.
I also think that CU is not really here for “Catholic Answers”, but in the hopes that “debating through the Scriptures” the Reformed view will win over whatever Catholics may be here that are among the “elect”.
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Christian_Unity
Guest
:hey_bud:Then she should not be wasting her time here. Go and convert the heathens - there are many unbelievers out there and many of those are really grieving. She should go out there and preach her Gospels and save them.
I’m a guy, so please don’t address me as “she”. Hey, I’m not here to convert Catholics to my flavor of Christianity because there is only one body of Christ. I just needed an answer regarding purgatory for the Christian Fellowship FB group site consisting of Catholics and Protestants. If you guys don’t want me here, that’s cool. I’m spending way too much time on here anyways. I just enjoyed the Internet fellowship and have learned quite a bit about Catholic theology.
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Reuben_J
Guest
Thanks for the clarification, CU. If it is proselytizing, it is not taken kindly here and it is also against the Forum’s rule. You have to be careful on that because if it is to be found with some basis and reported, you could be banned. I think the Forum welcome anyone who wants to be here.
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CopticChristian
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guanophore
Guest
For you and all those who would like to participate in the discussion on this point, please take a moment to read Acts chap. 10
Pertinent to the topic of this thread, he redefined several of the concepts under discussion
free will
elect/election
justification
salvation
regeneration
partaking of the divine nature
apostasy
heresy
falling from grace
perseverance of the saints
He also invented/coined some new terms and ideas to explicate his views, such as “forensic” justification and monergism. I am not sure if he is the originator of the modifier “true” Christian, but this is used by the modern descendants of Calvin to distinguish between apparent Christians and the elect. Others are:
Total Depravity
Unconditional Election
Limited Atonement
Irresistable grace
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guanophore
Guest
God bless you Ben!
I wish more of those who claim to be Catholic would do the same.
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guanophore
Guest
Ok.
Did you get it?
I love a good debate, especially with someone of Calvanistic pursuasion. I am still waiting for a reasoned response to Cornelius’ conversion. I have never read where Calvin explained this episode, and would really like to understand how it is interpreted to support the notion of total depravity.
ps, You sure did start a lot of threads for a one question visit!
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pablope
Guest
Nice dodge and evasion…CU…you advocate for unity and charitable dialogue…yet you come up describing Catholic responses as a dog and phony show…so much for your charity…does not charity start with your own self?
And here is the question I asked…so why don’t you respond:
[SIGN]Which is the dog and pony show…your interpretation (which was borne out of the reformation) or the Catholic’s whihc is based on 2000 yrs of apostolic tradition?
And is the Word of God limited to the written word? Where is this written in the Bible? [/SIGN]
Or you are averse to answerting tough questions?
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Christian_Unity
Guest
I actually have an urgent need to remain on here for my own Catholic edification and education. I was just added to a Facebook multi-denominational Christian group site in which the administrators are very Protestant by statement of faith. The group has a few Catholics and Orthodox believers on there, but the site is very Protestant dominated… and already see a Catholic struggling on there. I also have my own Christian Fellowship site which just almost doubled in size today consisting of Catholics and Protestants.Thanks for the clarification, CU. If it is proselytizing, it is not taken kindly here and it is also against the Forum’s rule. You have to be careful on that because if it is to be found with some basis and reported, you could be banned. I think the Forum welcome anyone who wants to be here.
Even though I am not Catholic, I do push hard for correct Catholic theology postings which I am not opposed to. I hate it when Christians misrepresent other Christians from different communities (intentionally or unintentionally). I basically adhere to sola scriptura and justification by faith alone, but respect the Catholic view of Apostolic Succession and a sacramental process of salvation too. I have a lot to learn about the Catholic traditon and Faith.
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Christian_Unity
Guest
Yep, I think I started way too many threads to respond to them all. It also started with seeking a correct answer on purgatory for my own Facebook fellowship site. It’s way too much fun over here. Hey, Catholic Christians are really cool. Some of my best friends on my site are Catholic… some friends that I have had for over 40 years. My college roomate from 30 years ago just became a Catholic Priest a few years ago. He was very successful in world standards before he became a Priest.Ok.
I love a good debate, especially with someone of Calvanistic pursuasion. I am still waiting for a reasoned response to Cornelius’ conversion. I have never read where Calvin explained this episode, and would really like to understand how it is interpreted to support the notion of total depravity.
ps, You sure did start a lot of threads for a one question visit!
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CopticChristian
Guest
CU,
Your postings have caused me to reflect and ask many questions. Many times I think of those that post about Protestants and absence from the fullness of the Faith. There are those that post of the pigmy in Africa.
What I came to reflect on was this. In my paradigm, my view as seen through the eyes of deposit of Faith as seen in the Catechim is this.
The Catechism is divided into 4 parts. I believe, I live/Sacraments/ I seek/Morality and I pray. I and I am sure many wonder about those that are absent from the Sacraments.
This caused me to reflect on grace. When you say Faith that is wihout works is dead Faith…and I look to the Catechism I see…
So It caused me to reflect on those gifts and what animates them…it is grace. What is grace…help…it is help from the Father to do what it is you were created to do…and how do you get it? Well most would say Sacraments…but when reflecting on the order of the Catechism it is clear that prayer is as important in seeking grace as anything else.
What is prayer? Well the Catechism says…Thanksgiving, Petition, Intercession, Persevering and Meditative…and we are to pray without ceasing…and with prayer we recieve grace…and it is grace that animates the virtues…
So the Pigmy…the whatever that doesn’t even know about all of the above raising their eyes, knowing that there is something bigger than themselves, asking for help in times of need…recieves grace…and with that grace…the ability to act becomes the Faith that is working…because when it is working there is hope and when there is Faith and Hope there is love…or Charity and acts that merit…but not because of me or you but because we were gifted with the gifts of the vitues and the gift of grace to animate those virtues…all gift…start to finish…
So, thank you for causing me to reflect…and I did enjoy Moby Dick.
K
KathleenGee
Guest
I always thought you were a guy, CU…do appreciate your charity…but some times, you came across bypassing our answers, and then giving more elaborate responses…a little reflective of prosletyzing.
I still think some of your ongoing questions that we answer you and don’t answer you or give you peace is because you are missing out on the reality of participation in the sacraments.
Without them, it is concept against another concept, word against word, but no mano a mano.
I went to the place of Forbidden Fruit the other day. I was reading an address to Catholics that there are many Catholics getting to the breaking point of always being misrepresented by some Protestants, and that to start actively defending our faith.
I went to CARM. And right away on the Roman Catholic site, Mr. Slick was saying Catholics believe they can be a god by reading CCC460…the very one that the Mormons use to say the Catholic Church says we can become as gods…Mr. Slick also gives passages from St. Justin the Martyr. When I was there previously I wrote out St. Justin’s description of the Mass in 150 AD and it was pulled.
Anyway, I told the Catholics not to participate on this website as they made them look ridiculous, and you cannot defend your faith on such a site. I even admitted, after pointing out false representation and saying what was done to me previously, that I had no intention of putting myself out on such a thread. So immediately after, I was banned for being a troll by 4Him, and also got a friend request from a Catholic. Told the person not on CARM.
It is the ideas about our faith that causes so much division. Protestants need to get a universal Catholic Catechism, and go from one point to the next to avoid taking things out of context like the ‘slicks’ do.
If you have experienced Christ at Mass, you also likewise experience the gravity of one sin, and the need for confession to a priest for absolution. And if you study the spiritual life from the reference of the sacraments and the communion of faith we enjoy in the Church with the Holy Father and bishops, and believers in communion with them, you can eventually understand purgatory.
But there are Protestant ‘ministers’ out there who are deliberately misleading Christians about Catholics. And there is a Benedictine bishop who is preparing laymen to go out to confront misrepresentations about our faith in our country.
But, thank you Christian Unity, for your desire to work for unity.
The Truth will set us free from the bondage of division and misunderstandings.
I still think some of your ongoing questions that we answer you and don’t answer you or give you peace is because you are missing out on the reality of participation in the sacraments.
Without them, it is concept against another concept, word against word, but no mano a mano.
I went to the place of Forbidden Fruit the other day. I was reading an address to Catholics that there are many Catholics getting to the breaking point of always being misrepresented by some Protestants, and that to start actively defending our faith.
I went to CARM. And right away on the Roman Catholic site, Mr. Slick was saying Catholics believe they can be a god by reading CCC460…the very one that the Mormons use to say the Catholic Church says we can become as gods…Mr. Slick also gives passages from St. Justin the Martyr. When I was there previously I wrote out St. Justin’s description of the Mass in 150 AD and it was pulled.
Anyway, I told the Catholics not to participate on this website as they made them look ridiculous, and you cannot defend your faith on such a site. I even admitted, after pointing out false representation and saying what was done to me previously, that I had no intention of putting myself out on such a thread. So immediately after, I was banned for being a troll by 4Him, and also got a friend request from a Catholic. Told the person not on CARM.
It is the ideas about our faith that causes so much division. Protestants need to get a universal Catholic Catechism, and go from one point to the next to avoid taking things out of context like the ‘slicks’ do.
If you have experienced Christ at Mass, you also likewise experience the gravity of one sin, and the need for confession to a priest for absolution. And if you study the spiritual life from the reference of the sacraments and the communion of faith we enjoy in the Church with the Holy Father and bishops, and believers in communion with them, you can eventually understand purgatory.
But there are Protestant ‘ministers’ out there who are deliberately misleading Christians about Catholics. And there is a Benedictine bishop who is preparing laymen to go out to confront misrepresentations about our faith in our country.
But, thank you Christian Unity, for your desire to work for unity.
The Truth will set us free from the bondage of division and misunderstandings.
C
CopticChristian
Guest
KG,
All you can do is believe/Live/Act/Pray…and in that prayer realize that the truth is essential…because to suppress the truth is againg the Will of God…
This is why we must constantly direct those that lie to the truth…
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Christian_Unity
Guest
Thanks for sharing all of that. It is good to be a thinking Christian… as we are called to love our God with all of our heart, soul, strenght, and mind. The Catholic Faith is very rich in history which I can appreciate.CU,
Your postings have caused me to reflect and ask many questions. Many times I think of those that post about Protestants and absence from the fullness of the Faith. There are those that post of the pigmy in Africa.
What I came to reflect on was this. In my paradigm, my view as seen through the eyes of deposit of Faith as seen in the Catechim is this.
The Catechism is divided into 4 parts. I believe, I live/Sacraments/ I seek/Morality and I pray. I and I am sure many wonder about those that are absent from the Sacraments.
This caused me to reflect on grace. When you say Faith that is wihout works is dead Faith…and I look to the Catechism I see…
So It caused me to reflect on those gifts and what animates them…it is grace. What is grace…help…it is help from the Father to do what it is you were created to do…and how do you get it? Well most would say Sacraments…but when reflecting on the order of the Catechism it is clear that prayer is as important in seeking grace as anything else.
What is prayer? Well the Catechism says…Thanksgiving, Petition, Intercession, Persevering and Meditative…and we are to pray without ceasing…and with prayer we recieve grace…and it is grace that animates the virtues…
So the Pigmy…the whatever that doesn’t even know about all of the above raising their eyes, knowing that there is something bigger than themselves, asking for help in times of need…recieves grace…and with that grace…the ability to act becomes the Faith that is working…because when it is working there is hope and when there is Faith and Hope there is love…or Charity and acts that merit…but not because of me or you but because we were gifted with the gifts of the vitues and the gift of grace to animate those virtues…all gift…start to finish…
So, thank you for causing me to reflect…and I did enjoy Moby Dick.
C
Christian_Unity
Guest
I do apologize for starting too many threads without full participation on them. I was like a kid in the candy store when I got on this site. I’ve been on that new multi-denominational Facebook site… and I can state that the rules and administrators are not neutral to the Catholics and Orthodox Christians on that site… which frustrates me. CARM, Chick tracts, etc can be so offensive and unfair to the Catholic Faith. Be patient with me since there is a very difficult balance between holding to one’s personal convictions and fellowshipping outside of one’s normal circle of fellowship. When I fight with my Protestant siblings on Facebook about what Catholics believe… I will be referring them to this site and your Catholic answers. I think all Christians should try to disagree agreeably on many of the issues that we see differently… as we all continue to grow and learn.
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Carlan
Guest
Dear Coptic Christian, I love your post and relate to it so. I am a quiet old basic educated one with a bit of experienceCU,
Your postings have caused me to reflect and ask many questions. Many times I think of those that post about Protestants and absence from the fullness of the Faith. There are those that post of the pigmy in Africa.
What I came to reflect on was this. In my paradigm, my view as seen through the eyes of deposit of Faith as seen in the Catechim is this.
The Catechism is divided into 4 parts. I believe, I live/Sacraments/ I seek/Morality and I pray. I and I am sure many wonder about those that are absent from the Sacraments.
This caused me to reflect on grace. When you say Faith that is wihout works is dead Faith…and I look to the Catechism I see…
So It caused me to reflect on those gifts and what animates them…it is grace. What is grace…help…it is help from the Father to do what it is you were created to do…and how do you get it? Well most would say Sacraments…but when reflecting on the order of the Catechism it is clear that prayer is as important in seeking grace as anything else.
What is prayer? Well the Catechism says…Thanksgiving, Petition, Intercession, Persevering and Meditative…and we are to pray without ceasing…and with prayer we recieve grace…and it is grace that animates the virtues…
So the Pigmy…the whatever that doesn’t even know about all of the above raising their eyes, knowing that there is something bigger than themselves, asking for help in times of need…recieves grace…and with that grace…the ability to act becomes the Faith that is working…because when it is working there is hope and when there is Faith and Hope there is love…or Charity and acts that merit…but not because of me or you but because we were gifted with the gifts of the vitues and the gift of grace to animate those virtues…all gift…start to finish…
So, thank you for causing me to reflect…and I did enjoy Moby Dick.
and because of God’s basic actual grace standing ready calling all his children I am, because of his sanctifying grace, here now waiting and hoping for salvation. God help us all to say yes to your actual grace! Peace, Carlan
K
KathleenGee
Guest
CU…thanks for your good answer to my recent post, and for your work on unity and there is alot of work Protestants need to do to disengage from the indoctrination they have received against the universal Christian faith.
Jesus is the Cornerstone, and the 4 foundations of our faith in another way to describe us is one, holy, catholic, and apostolic…in that order.
Jesus is the Cornerstone, and the 4 foundations of our faith in another way to describe us is one, holy, catholic, and apostolic…in that order.
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Christian_Unity
Guest
I just wanted to check in with you guys. I have been busy on a Christian Facebook site in which someone requested that I join. You know me, I jumped right in there by starting threads which created quite a bit of activity. The site appeared to be ecumenical for all Christians and found out that the site administrators were all Fundamentalists who were not Catholic friendly at alll. They treated the Catholics terribly on that site. You would be proud of me because I came to the defense of the Catholic Faith on that site… and those Fundamentalist administrators got really mean to me for sticking up for the Catholic Faith. Sometimes Independent Baptist Fundamentalistism can just make people mean and ugly people. Just because I stuck up for the Catholic Faith does not mean I am on the Roman Road (in case you are wondering). On my personal Christan Facebook Fellowship site, I am seeing more Catholics joining, and saw some of the Protestants of that site leave… because some Protestants have no desire for unity between Catholic and Protestants. :hey_bud:
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CopticChristian
Guest
CU,
This is admirable. This is CAF. Catholic Answers Forum. I see that you have started threads, not asking questions, rather promoting Calvinism and in each post defending/teaching/promoting Calvinism. You started this thread and what you call discussing a difficult question about Soveriengty of God that I see as promoting Calvinism
I don’t see you asking questions.
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