Formally switching from one Eastern Rite to another Eastern Rite?
- Thread starter Zekariya
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Marybeloved
Guest
Werenāt you coptic before, Zechariah? I remember a debate with you late last year about divorce and contraception where you were arguing for oriental orthodox. How come you didnāt join the church via coptic catholic church? How did you get to Melkite?
I converted to the Antiochian Orthodox Church. Later I become Coptic Orthodox. My baptism certificate is Antiochian Orthodox. I had no Coptic certificate. Therefore I was received as a Melkite.
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ByzCathCantor
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Well, given your baptismal roots, reception into the Melkite Catholic Church seems consistent with canonical norms.I converted to the Antiochian Orthodox Church. Later I become Coptic Orthodox. My baptism certificate is Antiochian Orthodox. I had no Coptic certificate. Therefore I was received as a Melkite.
That said, I honestly have never heard of anyone seeking to transfer from one non-Latin canonical Church to another, but it should be possible. I would think that the reasons might be more heavily scrutinized given, if nothing else, the relative infrequence of such requests.
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Stephentlig
Guest
I wouldnāt really see the point on switching but. . . 
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JohnMulhall
Guest
Hi,
Iām not sure it really matters since all Eastern Catholic Churches beyond the āeasternā nomenclature simply reflect a nationality/culture. Itās not like how there is a difference between Polish National and Roman Catholic, where a baptism and a profession of faith are made (going from PNC to RC, which is what Iāve personally seen, as a friend of mine ācrossed the Danubeā so to speak). These Churches either never left, or came back, to the Latin communion. Also, take care because I spoke with some priests and apparently the term āriteā isnāt used to distinguish between these Churches.
The various flavors of Eastern Catholic Churches are sui iuris, but they are all in communion with each other (as well as with the Latin Church). So, itās probably just a matter of going to that particular church and letting them know that you are there - like going from one parish to another. There might be some learning curve linguistically and what not, so there is probably some formation involved there. God Bless and let me know how it goes!
JOHN
Iām not sure it really matters since all Eastern Catholic Churches beyond the āeasternā nomenclature simply reflect a nationality/culture. Itās not like how there is a difference between Polish National and Roman Catholic, where a baptism and a profession of faith are made (going from PNC to RC, which is what Iāve personally seen, as a friend of mine ācrossed the Danubeā so to speak). These Churches either never left, or came back, to the Latin communion. Also, take care because I spoke with some priests and apparently the term āriteā isnāt used to distinguish between these Churches.
The various flavors of Eastern Catholic Churches are sui iuris, but they are all in communion with each other (as well as with the Latin Church). So, itās probably just a matter of going to that particular church and letting them know that you are there - like going from one parish to another. There might be some learning curve linguistically and what not, so there is probably some formation involved there. God Bless and let me know how it goes!
JOHN
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ByzCathCantor
Guest
That is not really accurate. While a number of EC Churches follow the Byzantine Rite in liturgical tradition, there are others that do not, and the differences become less subtle between them. Your statement may be more true of Churches of the same Rite, but not of all Eastern & Oriental Catholic Churches in general.
By way of example, I am a Ruthenian, so I would feel most comfortable among the Ukrainians, but less so among the Melkites, despite our common Byzantine heritage.
As much as I love the Maronite and Chaldean Churches and my friends among their faithful, I am much more a stranger among them than in another Byzantine Rite Church.
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SonCatcher
Guest
A formal transfer can be requested through your Melkite and Coptic bishops. However, you would regardless be allowed to attend liturgy in either form. It only would make a difference if you have children whom you want baptized Coptic or (if you are male) seeking Orders.Is that possible? I have found no information on the internet. Could I switch from Melkite to Coptic? or is only switching from Western to Eastern allowed?
Any information on this would be wonderful!
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JohnMulhall
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Oh, cool! I see, Byz. Thanks for the correction! Any resources you could point me to regarding the EC? Apparently I have some more studying to do!
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ByzCathCantor
Guest
Well, the best way to learn is via experience. I see you live in Cleveland. There are several Ruthenian and Ukrainian Greek Catholic Churches in your area. Iām sure they would love to have you among them for a Divine Liturgy. There is no substitute!Oh, cool! I see, Byz. Thanks for the correction! Any resources you could point me to regarding the EC? Apparently I have some more studying to do!
Stay tuned here, as well - a good number of contributors from a fair number of the Eastern & Oriental Churches, Catholic & Orthodox.
John, adding to ByzCathCantor, here is the list of Eastern parishes in Ohio (including the ones in Cleveland): byzcath.org/index.php/find-a-parish-mainmenu-111?catid=84
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malphono
Guest
The Cleveland area also has Melkites and Romanians. And of course Maronites.
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malphono
Guest
No, not at all. Each Church, even those within the same ritual family, exists and an entity. To move from one to another requires a canonical transfer.
The standard method would be to start the process of transferal through the Church you wish to transfer to. But your case is a little unusual in that there is no Coptic CC jurisdiction in North America, so it would, in fact, be the local Latin Ordinary with whom youād be dealing on the receiving end. Depending on the diocese, bishop, etc, that may or may not complicate matters. In any case, keep in mind that the receiving bishop, is going to ask the reasons why you wish to transfer. Also, the unusual circumstances may require that the petition be sent to Rome. Perhaps the best thing would be to contact a JOCD (maybe through the Melkite Eparchy?), and see if he can facilitate matters.
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ByzCathCantor
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Yes, Cleveland is a ātarget rich environmentā for those seeking an Eastern Catholic experience. Thanks for the follow-up. I did not mean to exclude, especially as I am fond of all of those traditions!The Cleveland area also has Melkites and Romanians. And of course Maronites.
Thanks for this info. I am not planning on changing rites anytime soon as I donāt live anywhere near the two Coptic Catholic parishes in the U.S. I had searched the internet and couldnāt find anything about going from one Eastern-rite to another. I was also wonder if canonically one is Eastern or Western (since there wasn no information on the matter). Or if canonically one a particular rite of the East or West.
Theologically (such as being Cyrillian) and liturgically (private prayers) I am Coptic Catholic. I belonged to a Coptic Orthodox parish before being received into the Catholic Church. I attend the local Melkite parish and I am technically a Melkite due to being baptized Antiochian.
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malphono
Guest
One question: I presume that the AOC baptism was recognized by the COC, so when you were received by the COC, how was it done? By Christmation? By another route? Yes, I realize this is none of my business, but OTOH it could have a bearing on your current status. More than ever, I think you need to have a chat with a JOCD.
As for the CCC in this country, from what Iāve heard (and it is, admittedly hearsay) its practices seem to be more latinized than one might at first think. It could well be that those hearsay reports are wrong, so perhaps mardukm might be able to offer some details and maybe some clarification.
I was baptized and Chrismated (Confirmed) in the Antiochian Orthodox Church.
I was Chrismated when I joined the Coptic Orthodox Church. I was received in the Catholic Church by a profession of faith. I had only my Antiochian baptism/Chrismation certificate as the Coptic Church didnāt issue me one.
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malphono
Guest
My take is that, despite where you were baptized (and first chrismated), since you were canonically received by the COC and then entered into communion with Rome, a case could be made that you are already Coptic. Absolutely, speak with a JOCD. At this point I would suggest one who is not a Melkite, for reasons which are probably pretty obvious.I was baptized and Chrismated (Confirmed) in the Antiochian Orthodox Church.
Sure, thanks.My take is that, despite where you were baptized (and first chrismated), since you were canonically received by the COC and then entered into communion with Rome, a case could be made that you are already Coptic. Absolutely, speak with a JOCD. At this point I would suggest one who is not a Melkite, for reasons which are probably pretty obvious.
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