Former Militant atheist - Some Advice needed

[Dameedna]

Arguments are exhausting and annoying - probably an indication that the one behind the negativity is the Liar.

It’s not actually negativity , It’s more like I don’t want to hear it

But I appreciate what you are saying, thanks.

 

[Dameedna]

Quite…I have been at the nihilistic stage for at least the past three years…there does not appear to be a satisfactory answer to be had at this moment.

I consider your assessment to be entirely accurate that a physical universe that may be conceived to have appeared out of nothing for no reason whatsoever is unquestioningly problematic…the only issue with which I may yet equally contend is that the presence of a creative energy that has always existed in an unchanged state is clearly no less a potentially unresolvable issue.

Interesting. I haven’t had any conversations with people who have gone through the same thing.

So you are still suffering through Nihilism? Mine Lifted one day. Like it just “went”. I know the difference between depression and Nihilism so it wasn’t a depression that went away, the Nihilism did. It was really strange.

How do you deal with it?

 

[Dameedna]

If I ask someone to give me a physical description of alien life, he would have to construct an image of it using colors he has seen, physical attributes of animals or plants he has seen, etc. There is no other way. The resulting composite may not exist in reality, but its components do. Thus, when we speak about meaning, it must be because somehow we have experienced it.

Really good Point there Bill.

 

[Randy_Carson]

I know it’s probably not something that can be answered, but there were many things I thought couldn’t be answered but actually can be.

I used to think the idea of a God was just absurd. But taking a step back, the idea that the universe just appeared, created solar systems and galaxies, then created life, then that life became more and more complex, then that life could sit there contemplating it’s existence. Protons Neutrons and Electrons, figuring out how Protons Neutrons and electrons work.

It’s absurd to think it all just happened.

So next step is, Is there a theistic God? If so, what is the nature of this God? How or why would we “believe” that about God’s nature? How can we know that what people thought was God communicating with them, not just their own minds? Their own thoughts?

I know people say just have faith, but if we have such a strong capacity to reason surely there are better answers than just “believe”. I can’t believe something just because it feels good, or “seems” right. It has to be true.

I agree. Just have faith can seem pretty weak. I do second the recommendations of Frank Sheed’s books: Theology for Beginners and Theology and Sanity.

He covers the material needed to answer your questions above in considerable depth but his writing is clear and not overly academic. He was writing for a popular audience.

At the moment, I have no particular christian authors I’m reading. I’ve read Lewis, but am looking for ideas, particularly coming from a more atheist perspective, or at least one who understands athiests.

Oh and I also like John Domonic Crossan.

Thanks

You might like the books by two former atheists who have become believers:

J. Warner Wallace
Cold-Case Christianity
God’s Crime Scence

He has an awesome website, btw. And TONS of excellent YouTube videos. I’ve watched many hours of his presentations. He walks you through how he used his cold-case detective skills to investigate the claims of Christianity.

Lee Strobel
The Case for Christ
The Case for the Real Jesus
etc (he has a series)

Strobel was the legal editor for the Chicago Tribune. Solid academic credentials in law and in atheism! But like Wallace, he did his own investigation.

These books are packed with EVIDENCE and they are very interesting to read. Give one of Wallace’s YouTube presentations a try to get the flavor, and let me know if this is what you are looking for.

 

[Dameedna]

I’d just like to thank everyone that has replied to my post. I’m sorry if I missed responding to anyone, but I have read every response. You have given me a lot of resources and it seems people are very happy to discuss this beyond the usual “Just have faith and pray” but understand my questions and thinking processes.

So thanks everyone, lot’s of good ideas.

And if there is a God…God Bless you all!!

 

[mattp0625]

Hi all,

I’m a former militant atheist, now just plain ole atheist. It has taken a long time but I’m seriously entertaining the idea I might be wrong.

I’ve come at this from a very different angle than I’ve seen other atheist converts to catholicism and I’m hoping there might be some out there that can help me research my rather confused questions further.

So two things.

1. Is there a God.

I don’t know, but I used to think this ridiculous and irrational. I don’t think so anymore. I see lots of books , articles , topics on this but usually in the context of a particular religion. I’d love some more info just on the topic of “What might be true”. I keep digging deeper and deeper and still cannot draw a conclusion. My questions are just never really answered.

1. What religion represents God.

This one is some-what easier. After reading about the various faiths, the only one I think could possibly be true, or have some truth is Christianity.But I have a very difficult time accepting any of the metaphysical parts of the Christian story.

I drew this conclusion that only christianity(and Judaism) could possibly be accurate mainly by studying Islam, by challenging my views on moral/cultural relativism and by sufferin through two years of Nihilism after I actually look my atheist arguments to their logical conclusion.

So I’m looking for resources that help me see the intellectual arguments as to why I should choose to believe there is a “theistic” God, and why I should accept the metaphysical aspects of Christianity(such as miracles, ressurection) etc.

I’m really stuck. I’ve read so much but it’s not really coming at me from an angle I can relate to. Too much “Just have faith” type information. That’s not enough for me.

Not sure if my posts make sense I have read some works by Lewis and others. I would love to believe certain things are true, but I won’t believe just because I want to.

Christianity has almost sort of snuck up on me, I didn’t expect to be taking it seriously at any point in my life.

That’s great that you’ve read CS Lewis. Philosophy is one branch that will help your journey.

You can also use history just as the ancient historian Tertullian. I also liked Bill O’Reilly’s killing Jesus.

The writings of Saint Ignatius of Antioch will also help, given that he was a first century bishop where Christianity began out of persecution. You will see the historical conncetion of the Catholic Church to the apostles of Christ.

There are also many books on the mystical, but you have to choose your sources wisely. I like Sister Briege McKenna (mircales) and Gabriel Amorth (exorcism).

I also enjoy the writings of many saints such as Saint Faustina and Padre Pio (not necessarily their biographies).

Good luck on your journey.

 

[AveOTheotokos]

I would recommend this website: strangenotions.com/.

Dameedna, the link above posted by polyphony has a LOT of good info. Here is a good place to start on the site:
strangenotions.com/god-exists/

 

[Dameedna]

Thanks again for the recent replies. Great info.

 

[AmbroseSJ]

I think that maybe the reason Christianity has surprised you with its reasoning, is that it accounts perhaps better than any other religion for why God is hidden from the world.

Atheism is not at all unreasonable when seen from the viewpoint of the obvious absence of God in the world.

John Henry Newman held that TO A CONSISTENT MIND there is no medium between Atheism and Catholicism.

IOW, either one is tending toward or already Atheist, or the reverse. There is no staying put somewhere in the middle. BUT, and it’s a big but, that holds only for a consistent mind. Many Christians do NOT understand what Newman meant by this.

There is the basic feeling that God is hidden, and it seems unaccountable. For that reason, it is reasonable to search for some Divine Revelation that would account for His hiddeness. The Judeo-Christian revelation seems the most reasonable IMHO.

 

[Dameedna]

I think that maybe the reason Christianity has surprised you with its reasoning, is that it accounts perhaps better than any other religion for why God is hidden from the world.

To be honest I’m not entirely sure what The Catholic church say’s about that.

What appealed to me about Christianity and why it seems more accurate than the others, is it’s understanding of human nature.

It is also “objective” in a way no other religion is.

And the most important one to me, is that it chews through human narcissism. A narcissist cannot “separate” themselves from others emotionally. They do not even recognize such a separation exists.

If a person cannot recognize their separation from others, they could never recognize their separation from “God”.

“I am that which I am”, does not sound like the nonsense it used to.

Christianity challenges human narcissism more than any other religion.

I just don’t know if it comes from a “God” or if mankind figured some things out.

John Henry Newman held that TO A CONSISTENT MIND there is no medium between Atheism and Catholicism.

IOW, either one is tending toward or already Atheist, or the reverse. There is no staying put somewhere in the middle. BUT, and it’s a big but, that holds only for a consistent mind. Many Christians do NOT understand what Newman meant by this.

I’m not sure I do either…lol!! I’ve come at this from a very different angle, and I haven’t really found anyone that has drawn the same conclusions as me for the same reasons.

 

[AmbroseSJ]

Dameedna:

And the most important one to me, is that it chews through human narcissism. A narcissist cannot “separate” themselves from others emotionally. They do not even recognize such a separation exists.

I don’t follow?

 

[Jelrak_TB]

I have thought about these questions a lot. I don’t have many answers, and you may find them unsatisfactory, but here’s where I am currently with them.

The natural world is full of “small” meanings. Creatures have purposes, physical attributes of creatures have purposes that serve the creatures, plants provide oxygen and food, which supports creatures, and minerals and soil support plants. Things made by humans have purposes too, even if it is just enjoyment, such as music or art. Celestial bodies such as the Sun seem to have meaning, as they keep the Earth in the right zone for this life to continue. If this universe contains so much meaning, I can’t conclude that the universe itself or existence itself has none.

Furthermore, human beings often speak about meaning as if it implicitly exists. They don’t mean a shallow utilitarianism either, but a deep meaning that is greater than a sort of mechanical functionality. We can only think or speak about things we can conceptualize, which is only possible if we have experienced it. If I ask someone to give me a physical description of alien life, he would have to construct an image of it using colors he has seen, physical attributes of animals or plants he has seen, etc. There is no other way. The resulting composite may not exist in reality, but its components do. Thus, when we speak about meaning, it must be because somehow we have experienced it.

Thank you for sharing this insight…