Fox News Under Fire, Says Planned Parenthood Doesn’t Do Abortions

[Marc_Anthony]

That’s fine. But you can’t say that abortion shouldn’t be funded because it’s mass murder and too controversial until you are ready to defund the military. A large number of people feel the way about war that you do about abortion, but you don’t see it as a compelling argument when it’s used about something that you support, so why should I, or anyone else fighting for women’s rights?

I didn’t say it should be defunded because it’s too controversial, Somebody else did, I think, but not me. I said it should be defunded because it’s mass murder.

You’re confusing me completely . I never said people CAN’T fight to defund the military, I just disagree with them. But they have every right to try and convince me otherwise, just like we have every right to try and convince people that abortion is wrong (and not a women’s rights issue) or planned parenthood is evil.

 

[Lochias]

That’s fine. But you can’t say that abortion shouldn’t be funded because it’s mass murder and too controversial until you are ready to defund the military. A large number of people feel the way about war that you do about abortion, but you don’t see it as a compelling argument when it’s used about something that you support, so why should I, or anyone else fighting for women’s rights?

It’s comparing apples to oranges. There is no argument than can logically be made in defense of killing unborn children.

War is far more complicated. I find it a little ironic that you are using the idea of “some see war as an evil” as your argument, when it is the freedoms that are retained through defense and offense in war that let many choose to butcher their unborn children in the first place, however vile it may be.

 

[Marc_Anthony]

What in the world does this have to do with Catholic Apologetics? Can’t we have at least some dignity and respect for the purpose of these boards?

Planned Parenthood is the largest abortion provider in the United States (I don’t know world stats), and Catholics oppose abortion. Defunding it is a social justice matter and, as this thread shows, debate is a natural consequence of this position, making it an apologetics issue.

 

[PJD1987]

That’s fine. But you can’t say that abortion shouldn’t be funded because it’s mass murder and too controversial until you are ready to defund the military. A large number of people feel the way about war that you do about abortion, but you don’t see it as a compelling argument when it’s used about something that you support, so why should I, or anyone else fighting for women’s rights?

According to Church Teaching, abortion is intrinsically evil, meaning always and everywhere. There is only one exception, when the life of the mother is at risk and the goal is to save the life of the mother, not to kill the child. War is not intrinsically evil. They are different and not comparable, except to moral relativists. That is the difference between our position, which is moral objectivism.

God bless.

-Paul

 

[BlueEyedLady]

It’s comparing apples to oranges. There is no argument than can logically be made in defense of killing unborn children.

War is far more complicated. I find it a little ironic that you are using the idea of “some see war as an evil” as your argument, when it is the freedoms that are retained through defense and offense in war that let many choose to butcher their unborn children in the first place, however vile it may be.

I used it in response to the whole abortion shouldn’t be funded because too many people see it as murder. A lot of people say the same thing about the military. I personally think that both of the aforementioned groups are wrong. But as it stands our government recognizes that they have the right and responsibility to protect and defend the nation. And the highest court has repeatedly held that a woman has a constitutional right to make her own reproductive choices.

And just as the pro choice movement upsets you, the pro life side scares the heck out of me. I can’t think of anything more threatening to me than the possibility of our government deciding that women are worth so little. So just as your side will fight, advertise, raise money, and protest so will pro choicers.

 

[Lochias]

And just as the pro choice movement upsets you, the pro life side scares the heck out of me. ** I can’t think of anything more threatening to me than the possibility of our government deciding that women are worth so little.** So just as your side will fight, advertise, raise money, and protest so will pro choicers.

I’m sorry, but this phrase is pure, unadulterated illusion and misinformation, and sheer ignorance, unintentional or otherwise, can excuse it.

Read this, and let it be very, very clear in your mind: The pro-life movement has absolutely NOTHING to do with the worth of women. ALL people have the right to life and to love, and it is the welfare of the child we are concerned with, NOT the relative worth of the woman. ALL people have the right to life and to love.

 

[Marc_Anthony]

And just as the pro choice movement upsets you, the pro life side scares the heck out of me. I can’t think of anything more threatening to me than the possibility of our government deciding that women are worth so little. So just as your side will fight, advertise, raise money, and protest so will pro choicers.

I still don’t get your point.

Yeah, they will. And? Doesn’t change my beliefs. Neo-Nazis can protest all they want, but I’m still not going to be convinced that Jews should be banned from government positions or whatever it is Neo-Nazis believe.

 

[BlueEyedLady]

I still don’t get your point.

Yeah, they will. And? Doesn’t change my beliefs. Neo-Nazis can protest all they want, but I’m still not going to be convinced that Jews should be banned from government positions or whatever it is Neo-Nazis believe.

I’m not sure neo Nazis have beliefs anymore as much as they have delusions.

 

[livingwordunity]

I believe it is a given that at least some PP clinics perform abortions.

What usually gets left out of these discussions is that probably ALL of them also provide prenatal care and help for women who DON’T take the abortion option. Ergo, if you close all of them down, you’re depriving a lot of women (and a lot of the unborn) of a lot of needed care.

That’s if you close down all the Catholic hospitals that provide health services without pressuring mothers to kill their babies. But that’s the goal of Democrats, to make abortion pushers like Planned Parenthood the only choice for women’s healthcare.

 

[manualman]

BlueEyed, if/when a full 35-45% of Americans are full blown pacifists and another 20-30% are conflicted on the morality of maintaining a military at all, then we might be talking about equivalency.

Until then, try to make more reasonable comparisons, OK?

P.S. If you are referring to a more specific conflict, like say, Iraq then I tend to agree with you that it was a horrible blunder made that should have been opposed more widely (but a major tangent to this thread!). But at the time this country got involved in that conflict opposition to it was a VERY small minority. Again, nothing like the deep division and nearly even split this nation holds over the abortion issue.

 

[ndeparis88]

Agreed entirely. And it really won’t be a serious problem either. Just reroute the public and charitable funding that previously went to them and give it to legitimate health care non-profit organizations. I really doubt you’ll find a PP affiliate or branch in a location where there are NO alternative clinics for the poor. They’ll just be able to expand and be better funded with the cash that used to be sent to PP. It’s as simple as writing the same check to different people in most cases.

Plus there can be room to budget more money for NaPro tech and more research and awareness about NFP, and responsibility so there can potentially be a decrease in the number of mothers without means. Hope no one takes this sentence the wrong way I mean the best. But think about how much more support that can be offered women who only know the lies that PP advertises. Now there can be more support through out the pregnancy and maybe more emphasis on ramping up better adoption agencies.

 

[manualman]

…more emphasis on ramping up better adoption agencies.

Instead of closing them down under the phony battle flag of “marriage equality.”

 

[RobbyS]

I believe it is a given that at least some PP clinics perform abortions.

What usually gets left out of these discussions is that probably ALL of them also provide prenatal care and help for women who DON’T take the abortion option. Ergo, if you close all of them down, you’re depriving a lot of women (and a lot of the unborn) of a lot of needed care.

No, they do refer women where to go for services such as mameograms et al. but these are not women’s clinics per se.

 

[ndeparis88]

I used it in response to the whole abortion shouldn’t be funded because too many people see it as murder. A lot of people say the same thing about the military. I personally think that both of the aforementioned groups are wrong. But as it stands our government recognizes that they have the right and responsibility to protect and defend the nation. And the highest court has repeatedly held that a woman has a constitutional right to make her own reproductive choices.

And just as the pro choice movement upsets you, the pro life side scares the heck out of me. I can’t think of anything more threatening to me than the possibility of our government deciding that women are worth so little. So just as your side will fight, advertise, raise money, and protest so will pro choicers.

In order to actually have a choice you have to be alive to do so. Just saying. No one has a right to kill anybody, or to deprive them of the chance to live, You are worth more than you feel, but abortion denies the God given ability that only women have to bring life into the world, and instead it is negated on behalf of selfishness. It is not our Jobs to rein over life and Death, our nihilism knows no bounds.

 

[RobbyS]

I don’t disagree with this. But if they ARE to be shut down, it behooves us as a country to make sure that all those of reduced means who received prenatal care from them continue to get it from SOMEWHERE, and to allow for a seamless transition.

Planned Parenthood receives huge amounts of money that might be used for basic medical care. The problem is that it has been supported by upper class women for years, who regard it as the equivalent of the Red Cross.

 

[RobbyS]

Instead of closing them down under the phony battle flag of “marriage equality.”

Adoption has long been down-played by feminists,who is treat it as a kind of child abandonment.

 

[jmjconder]

BlueEyed, if/when a full 35-45% of Americans are full blown pacifists and another 20-30% are conflicted on the morality of maintaining a military at all, then we might be talking about equivalency.

Until then, try to make more reasonable comparisons, OK?

P.S. If you are referring to a more specific conflict, like say, Iraq then I tend to agree with you that it was a horrible blunder made that should have been opposed more widely (but a major tangent to this thread!). But at the time this country got involved in that conflict opposition to it was a VERY small minority. Again, nothing like the deep division and nearly even split this nation holds over the abortion issue.

Great response! I fully agree.

 

[CaptFun]

That does not remove our obligation from destroying it though.

Right now they’re the biggest abortion providers in the country. Saying, “Oh well, what’s the point of getting rid of them, somebody else will take their place!” is a cowardly excuse.

Planned Parenthood is a sickening organization and needs to be destroyed.

Epic!

---

But not as epic as your story vignette at the bottom!

“But he was undoubtedly a moron to begin with. Illiterate, superstitious, murderous…Look at him, and tell me if you see the progeny of a once-mighty civilization? What do you see?”

“The image of Christ,” grated the monsignor, surprised at his own sudden anger. “What did you expect me to see?”:yup: :clapping:

Hope that Monsignor is now teaching Ethics at a genuinely Catholic University somewhere. And grading HARD!

 

[_Abyssinia]

Um, yes they do. And they do adoption referral. Even the ridiculously biased lifenews article that the OP linked talks about how they do do prenatal care and adoption referral.

Documents from Planned Parenthood for 2009 - 2010 show they provided prenatal care to 31098 women, 841 women referred to adoption agencies, 329445 abortions

plannedparenthood.org/files/PPFA/PPFA_Annual_Report_08-09-FINAL-12-10-10.pdf

Over 91% of pregnancy services Planned Parenthood provided to pregnant clients were abortion services

Was surprised at the prenatal number, that is a small number. 6 million women get pregnant every year. If you take into account miscarriage, abortion, there are still millions of women getting prenatal care not from Planned Parenthood

 

[Lochias]

I’m sorry, but this phrase is pure, unadulterated illusion and misinformation, and only sheer ignorance, unintentional or otherwise, can excuse it.

Read this, and let it be very, very clear in your mind: The pro-life movement has absolutely NOTHING to do with the worth of women. ALL people have the right to life and to love, and it is the welfare of the child we are concerned with, NOT the relative worth of the woman. ALL people have the right to life and to love.