Fr. Altier's homilies gone?

[Della]

Catholic29:

These days are not condusive to Catholic orthodoxy in Saint Paul and Minneapolis to say the least. Particulary when your own shepherds are against you in that regard. Just ask any member of the Legionaries of Christ or Regnum Christi who have recently lived or worked in Flynn’s archdiocese. But personally I have had enough of all of this hypocrisy, and am re-evaluating why I am Catholic at all.

Just a couple of thoughts: Firstly, I strongly object to your contention that “these days are not condusive to Catholic orthodoxy in Saint Paul and Minneapolis to say the least.” It is a broad generalization that in no way reflects the truth. My parish, Epiphany, is certainly orthodox as are all our priests, and ours is not a rarity.

Secondly, if the judgments made by the archbishop are questionable to you to the point of leaving the Church over them (a statement that makes me wonder just how much good Fr. Altier’s ministry has done for you), then it behooves you to find out what actually happened in the case of the Legionaries of Christ and Regnum Christi. Here is an article that deals fairly with this issue: Minnesota archbishop bars Legionaries from his archdiocese.

 

[Dan-Man916]

Has Fr. Altier ever criticized St. Joan of Arc parish?

Also, does Fr. Altier also say the latin tridentine mass?
I had heard that his parish has an indult to say the old latin mass, but i don’t know if this is true.

thanks

 

[Sherlock]

Della:

Catholic29:

Just a couple of thoughts: Firstly, I strongly object to your contention that “these days are not condusive to Catholic orthodoxy in Saint Paul and Minneapolis to say the least.” It is a broad generalization that in no way reflects the truth. My parish, Epiphany, is certainly orthodox as are all our priests, and ours is not a rarity.

Secondly, if the judgments made by the archbishop are questionable to you to the point of leaving the Church over them (a statement that makes me wonder just how much good Fr. Altier’s ministry has done for you), then it behooves you to find out what actually happened in the case of the Legionaries of Christ and Regnum Christi. Here is an article that deals fairly with this issue: Minnesota archbishop bars Legionaries from his archdiocese.

Della,

Epiphany is a good parish, but it is not representative of majority of parishes in the diocese. There are some good, solid, orthodox parishes (St. Agnes, Holy Family, Epiphany, St. Michael’s in Stillwater, Nativity, etc.) but I would NOT say that they are that common. The norm is Catholic Lite (meaning, no mention of “difficult” Church teaching----such as contraception—that might offend), with soft, easy homilies and varying degrees of liturgical innovations and/or abuses. I’d like to think differently, but my experience tells me otherwise.

I agree with your other comments, however. If Catholic29 is thinking of leaving because of the failings, real or perceived, of bishops and other humans, then his faith is based on shaky ground.

 

[Della]

Sherlock:

Della,

Epiphany is a good parish, but it is not representative of majority of parishes in the diocese. There are some good, solid, orthodox parishes (St. Agnes, Holy Family, Epiphany, St. Michael’s in Stillwater, Nativity, etc.) but I would NOT say that they are that common. The norm is Catholic Lite (meaning, no mention of “difficult” Church teaching----such as contraception—that might offend), with soft, easy homilies and varying degrees of liturgical innovations and/or abuses. I’d like to think differently, but my experience tells me otherwise.

I agree. I used the phrase “not a rarity” which is not the same thing, to me anyway, as “common.” Unfortunately, you are right, but at least most parishes aren’t out and out heterodox, as Catholic29 seemed to imply–as I read him, anyway.

I agree with your other comments, however. If Catholic29 is thinking of leaving because of the failings, real or perceived, of bishops and other humans, then his faith is based on shaky ground.

What bothers me is people who will depend on one priest’s ministry to this degree. I’m not charmed by Fr. Altier, and can take him or leave him, although I think him over the top and too judgmental of his fellow priests. I didn’t care for a pastor at our parish who seemed to only care for people who agreed with his modernist ways and who sneered at our devotion for Mary, but he could never have caused me to question my faith in the Church. As St. Therese did, and asked us to do, we should pray for our priests. If Fr. Altier is orthodox and fine in every way, it will come out in God’s good time as it did for Saint Padre Pio. If he isn’t, that too will become evident in God’s good time.

 

[Eileen_T]

If anyone would like a link to Fr Altier’s homilies from 2001 - 2005 you could PM me.

 

[hypnotist]

Fr. Altier has frequently published opinions on subjects he knows nothing about and has been needlessly and eroneously inflammatory.
I have heard him ramble on about how acupuncture was a sin,and how he has written that hypnotism is against the first commandment. He has talked about books he has not read. He calls bishops, as a whole, liars.
His sermon on Virtus is an example of this type of rhetoric
Notice that Fr. Altiers BS is in computer science, and that he does not hold any advanced degree after ordination.
It would be very easy for someone with as little formal training as he has had, and with as deep regard as he has for his own reasoning to eventually be found to be in need of censure.

 

[rwoehmke]

Cathy_of_Alex:

I’m a former member of St. Joan of Arc so I know what kind of baloney goes on there. It bothers me that they are allowed to post their homilies of dissent and they still have gay/lesbian material on their page (even though they were told to remove it) but Fr. Altier is silenced. Plus, the dissenters are in the newspaper nearly every week and nothing is said or done. They are not excommunicated or even told to cease.

Perhaps Flynn has spoken quitely with the Joan of Arc leadership and they have chosen to ignore him. I suspect they would also disregard any public remonstrations or follow the narrowest letter of the law. Fr. Alteir, on the other hand, is an obedient priest, and although I have only heard his name mentioned respectfully in the past and am not familiar with his work, I admire him for his obedience and respect for his Bishop. It is a good example he sets for all of us.

 

[Ave_Maria_1]

I am sorry about the silencing of this priest. When I wished for a good homily after listening to fluff or heresy, I would look up his homily.

Strange how dissidents such as Fr. McBrien or Curran and legions of others seem to go on and on and are never silenced but a priest who is orthodox and even offers the Holy Sacrifice in Latin is silenced. Sigh. Such is the age of the Church we live in…

Ave Maria!

 

[Catholic29]

Della:

Catholic29:

Just a couple of thoughts: Firstly, I strongly object to your contention that “these days are not condusive to Catholic orthodoxy in Saint Paul and Minneapolis to say the least.” It is a broad generalization that in no way reflects the truth. My parish, Epiphany, is certainly orthodox as are all our priests, and ours is not a rarity.

Secondly, if the judgments made by the archbishop are questionable to you to the point of leaving the Church over them (a statement that makes me wonder just how much good Fr. Altier’s ministry has done for you), then it behooves you to find out what actually happened in the case of the Legionaries of Christ and Regnum Christi. Here is an article that deals fairly with this issue: Minnesota archbishop bars Legionaries from his archdiocese.

What you say may be true, but I honesty don’t know what is reality anymore.

Though I once considered myself an orthodox Catholic in the past, I can’t honestly say I am that now. I am just sick of the infighting and hypocrisy in this Church that nobody, not even God, seems able to stop. Most of whom that are considered Catholic seem to have their own personal agenda, and have little desire to follow or serve anything bigger than themselves.

Choose to believe me or not, but that is what I have witnessed.

Sherlock:

I agree with your other comments, however. If Catholic29 is thinking of leaving because of the failings, real or perceived, of bishops and other humans, then his faith is based on shaky ground.

When you say my faith is based on shaky ground, you are correct. Here is a thread, which is now closed, that deals with my contentions and questions more in depth: forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=97929

 

[Catholic29]

Della:

I agree. I used the phrase “not a rarity” which is not the same thing, to me anyway, as “common.” Unfortunately, you are right, but at least most parishes aren’t out and out heterodox, as Catholic29 seemed to imply–as I read him, anyway.

What bothers me is people who will depend on one priest’s ministry to this degree. I’m not charmed by Fr. Altier, and can take him or leave him, although I think him over the top and too judgmental of his fellow priests. I didn’t care for a pastor at our parish who seemed to only care for people who agreed with his modernist ways and who sneered at our devotion for Mary, but he could never have caused me to question my faith in the Church. As St. Therese did, and asked us to do, we should pray for our priests. If Fr. Altier is orthodox and fine in every way, it will come out in God’s good time as it did for Saint Padre Pio. If he isn’t, that too will become evident in God’s good time.

I was never a big time follower of Fr. Altier, though I have listened to a few of his homilies in the past on his website www.desertvoice.org , which is now censored for no apparent good reason. But that was before other issues cropped up in my life which has resulted in my questioning of the Catholic faith and Christianity altogether. Just click on my name and read my profile, it now says I am in theological Limbo.

 

[Eileen_T]

hypnotist:

Fr. Altier has frequently published opinions on subjects he knows nothing about and has been needlessly and eroneously inflammatory.
I have heard him ramble on about how acupuncture was a sin,and how he has written that hypnotism is against the first commandment. He has talked about books he has not read. He calls bishops, as a whole, liars.
His sermon on Virtus is an example of this type of rhetoric
Notice that Fr. Altiers BS is in computer science, and that he does not hold any advanced degree after ordination.
It would be very easy for someone with as little formal training as he has had, and with as deep regard as he has for his own reasoning to eventually be found to be in need of censure.

I have responded to a post of your on another thread about Fr Altier (forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?p=1366474#post1366474)).

I this post you refer to Father “rambling on about how acupuncture was a sin” etc and giving his ‘opinions’ on “subjects he knows nothing about and has been needlessly and eroneously inflammatory.”

I am curious as to why you have avoided what appears to be the real issue for you . . . the fact that Fr Altier’s Examination of Conscience booklet list hypnotism as a mortal sin against the 1st Commandment.

1. I am the Lord your God. You shall not have strange gods before me.

• Involvement in occult practices, e.g., witchcraft, ouija boards, seances, palm reading, tarot cards, hypnotism, divination, astrology, black magic, sorcery, etc.

I can see how this would upset you, I just wonder why you attacked Fr Altier over other things and avoided mentioning hypnotism?

It would be very easy for someone with as little formal training as he has had, and with as deep regard as he has for his own reasoning to eventually be found to be in need of censure.

How many years did he study for the priesthood?

Also, are you trying to say that unless someone has a University Degree in a subject, they don’t know what they are talking about?

St Paul was a tentmaker who received his knowledge of Christian doctrine from the Holy Spirit. I believe that the Holy Spirit has a habit of choosing to work through those who are uneducated in the world’s estimation, in order that people will see that what is being done - or said - is from God.

Take St Therese, the Little Flower as an example. There are hundreds of saints who could be used as an example.

The fact that Fr Altier has chosen to be obedient to his Bishop says a great deal about what you say is the “deep regard he has for his own reasoning.” Looks more like humility to me.

 

[Eileen_T]

As I posted before, if you PM me I will send you a link to his homilies.

 

[IsaiahStar]

rwoehmke:

Perhaps Flynn has spoken quitely with the Joan of Arc leadership and they have chosen to ignore him. I suspect they would also disregard any public remonstrations or follow the narrowest letter of the law. Fr. Alteir, on the other hand, is an obedient priest, and although I have only heard his name mentioned respectfully in the past and am not familiar with his work, I admire him for his obedience and respect for his Bishop. It is a good example he sets for all of us.

That is a good point. If I were in his position I think I would find it very difficult to be obedient, to say the least…I am angry with the archbishop, but seeing how Fr. Altier is responding gives me some hope and encouragement.

 

[hurst]

Catholic29:

Though I once considered myself an orthodox Catholic in the past, I can’t honestly say I am that now. I am just sick of the infighting and hypocrisy in this Church that nobody, not even God, seems able to stop.

In other words, you want something to go according to your own ideas, and if it doesn’t happen, then you’ll just have to leave?

Guess what? That is what Judas Iscariot did, according to one perspective. He was tired of Jesus tolerating the waste of expensive perfume or taking too long to overthrow the Roman occupation, etc. He finally agreed to hand Him over to force Him to defend Himself and establish His “kingdom” sooner, according to some studies.

You seem to want things “fixed” so much, that you threaten spiritual suicide.

But God is allowing these problems, obviously. He must have a good reason. And the reason is that He allows it to serve as a test for others who do not support such things.

1 Corinthians 11:19 For there must be also heresies: that they also, who are approved, may be made manifest among you.

Furthermore, even in the OT God allowed Israel’s Kings to follow their tendency to idolatry. What we should do is get a hint about how God works. He gave us free will and won’t remove it. He disciplines us according to our conduct so that we might learn.

Catholic29:

Most of whom that are considered Catholic seem to have their own personal agenda, and have little desire to follow or serve anything bigger than themselves.

Choose to believe me or not, but that is what I have witnessed.

I have witnessed the same things. Won’t you join the faithful at the foot of the Cross with Our Sorrowful Mother, who also had to stand by helpless to stop the tearing apart of the body of Christ?

There is something bigger here to serve than our own desire to have perfect members of the pilgrim Church. Do we deserve such perfect members? But the Church is perfect, for it is the body of Christ. The division does not please God, but He allows it to draw out a greater good and glory.

Catholic29:

When you say my faith is based on shaky ground, you are correct. Here is a thread, which is now closed, that deals with my contentions and questions more in depth: forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=97929

I can understand that you don’t like the hypocrisy. But rememeber that we all offend in many different ways. Consider that Jesus deserves to be served by us regardless of whether others do so or not.

I think the proper response for what you are witnessing is to offer prayers of reparation to Our Lord for these offenses you encounter. Or do you think your own feeling of being offended is more important to tend to? I am sure God is more offended than you are by the division you see. Someone posted a link to a mystic who was receiving messages to that extent. (livingmiracles.net/Myrna.html). Also there are First Friday Vigils of Reparation that are available in some places. I encourage you to look into this concept. It is definitely a better way to expend yourself over this issue.

The same can be said of the censure of Fr. Altier’s homilies. Obedience is more important, in the long run. If someone is serving God truly, then these things will not bother them because they do not take a personal stake in them. They look to God and offer themselves in whatever other way is allowed to them. Let us try to do the same. Sometimes we are called to voice our concern, but let us not rebel.

hurst

 

[pianoplayingmom]

I just noticed something rather ironic. Fr. Altier’s little booklet entitled An Examination of Conscience: A preparation for the Sacrament of Penance, copywritten in 2002, has Archbishop Flynn’s imprimatur on it. Isn’t that interesting?

I think the fact that Fr. Altier is obeying this command of silence speaks volumes about how he views his priesthood and his obedience to God. A friend told me that Padre Pio, too, was silenced for a long time by the Vatican who falsely accused him of faking miracles and having sex with women. At least in this situation, no one has accused Fr. Altier of any improprieties.

 

[OurLadyOfEfes]

Cathy_of_Alex:

I hope people on this board who are from the Archdiocese of St. Paul and Minneapolis will join me in writing to Archbishop Harry Flynn.

I’m a former member of St. Joan of Arc so I know what kind of baloney goes on there. It bothers me that they are allowed to post their homilies of dissent and they still have gay/lesbian material on their page (even though they were told to remove it) but Fr. Altier is silenced. Plus, the dissenters are in the newspaper nearly every week and nothing is said or done. They are not excommunicated or even told to cease.

In one of the recent issues of the Catholic Spirit (the archdiocesen newspapaer) it was apparent in his column that the Archbishop was not happy that there were people upset by the Virtus program.

From what I’ve heard from Fr. Altier, Father’s main concerns were that Planned Parenthood was involved in developing Virtus and the material is not age appropriate. Also, it’s better left to parents to instruct their children in sex ed.

We need all the faithful clergy we can get in this archdiocese! One more reason to pray to St. Michael during this Lenten season!

Im with you in that letter writing to the Archbishop, however it should be very charitable. Let me know!