Fr. Z: Can a trans-man be ordained?

[1neophyte]

Well it’s not like it hasn’t happened.

dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4725466/America-s-female-priest-dies-84.html

What a pretty lady!

 

[NeedImprovement]

Too bad he didn’t address the issue of the other way around (trans woman??), even though it is a an explanation of redundent explanation for the redundant staff of redundancy working in the department of redundancy department.

There are a couple of priests who addressed it in the combox of that particular post by Fr. Z, if I recall correctly.

 

[SyroMalankara]

Well it’s not like it hasn’t happened.

dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4725466/America-s-female-priest-dies-84.html

The article failed to mention that the “wedgewood community” is most likely a UnitedChurch of Christ denomination, that a priest who decided to marry a nun probably isn’t a good fit, that this person seems to have psychological problems beyond gender, and that self awareness was not there even while working as a psychologist for those in drug rehab - clearly not a good fit for priesthood.

 

[SyroMalankara]

Also, another article is disturbing enough that this person need not apply at any Christian denomination for any kind of leadership, except maybe some liberal fringes like the UU and some Anglican bodies:
aumag.org/2017/05/26/nancy-ledins-advocate/

How would you counsel someone who suffers from a terminal disease and fears death?
[She chortles]…with great difficulty. Having said that, I think a person with a terminal illness knows there is an end time and the counseling time is meant to open that door into the next dimension. Since I also believe in reincarnation, I find it easier to talk of the next dimension instead of the finality of this earth span time.
*
Through all of your ups and downs, did you ever stop believing in God?*
No. **I was most fortunate in meeting Ramtha [an entity] and having a fabulous theologian friend in Jim Fitz. Both taught me that we are living a unique adventure, which allow us to look with fascination at life, death, and the next dimension.

I strongly believe in the next dimension, Ruby. Believing in reincarnation, perhaps that means settling on another galaxy. Whether that is fact or not, my belief structure says that one short lifetime can’t be all there is. I believe we live on….**

This “Ramtha” thing is ridiculously awful: en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/J._Z._Knight

In her teachings “Ramtha” has made several controversial statements such as that Christianity is a “backward” religion, that Jesus’ parables can be explained by means of photon waves and probability,[25] that “murder isn’t really wrong or evil” (if one believes in reincarnation),[26] or (during the court case JZ Knight v Jeff Knight) Jeff Knight stated that Ramtha had declared that HIV is Nature’s way of ‘getting rid of’ homosexuality.

 

[victrolatim]

Anyone else tired of the whole transgender hype? Time for the media to move on to another “flavor of the month”

 

[Joe_5859]

Well it’s not like it hasn’t happened.

dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4725466/America-s-female-priest-dies-84.html

I’m not surprised that it happened, but I’m somewhat surprised that it happened nearly 40 years ago.

From the article:

A surgeon in Trinidad, Colorado would perform the surgery in 1979, leading to a national debate whether Nancy Ledins was still technically a priest in the church.

The debate should be over whether he is technically a woman. He is not.

These scenarios are only “groundbreaking” if one is operating under the assumption that it is actually possible for a man to become a woman (and vice versa). As it is not possible, there’s really no story here. It’s sad when men leave the priesthood, and even more sad when they start living a life in contradiction to Church teaching, but these sorts of things have been happening since the beginning of the Church.

 

[Padres1969]

The article failed to mention that the “wedgewood community” is most likely a UnitedChurch of Christ denomination, that a priest who decided to marry a nun probably isn’t a good fit, that this person seems to have psychological problems beyond gender, and that self awareness was not there even while working as a psychologist for those in drug rehab - clearly not a good fit for priesthood.

Not relevant to the point I was making. The priest in question transitioned before leaving the RCC and was still a Catholic priest when he transitioned. Heck she remained a Catholic priest until the day she died despite having joined that Wedgewood Community.

 

[ComplineSanFran]

Not relevant to the point I was making. The priest in question transitioned before leaving the RCC and was still a Catholic priest when he transitioned. Heck she remained a Catholic priest until the day she died despite having joined that Wedgewood Community.

That’s exactly the point. Thank you, Padres.

 

[SyroMalankara]

That’s exactly the point. Thank you, Padres.

Not really. We don’t know if the Holy See had ruled anything about the individual. That would be between the individual and the local bishop/Congregation for Clergy. Unless someone released it, we would have no knowledge. I don’t trust the aforementioned to take their word for it.

 

[OraLabora]

Not really. We don’t know if the Holy See had ruled anything about the individual. That would be between the individual and the local bishop/Congregation for Clergy. Unless someone released it, we would have no knowledge. I don’t trust the aforementioned to take their word for it.

My guess is that she would have been laicized. In the eyes of the Church of course “she” was still a male.

But even a laicized priest remains… a priest. The effects of the sacrament are indelible. A laicized priest can validly offer the sacraments, but not licitly so except in danger of death.

 

[SyroMalankara]

My guess is that she would have been laicized. In the eyes of the Church of course “she” was still a male.

But even a laicized priest remains… a priest. The effects of the sacrament are indelible. A laicized priest can validly offer the sacraments, but not licitly so except in danger of death.

Even that ‘standard’ seems to not be a universal norm, in the case of mental illness, such as this could be or Ex Archbishop Milingo, its presumed invalid. In the case of Milingo, the Holy See stated:

As for those recently ordained by Archbishop Milingo, the Church’s discipline in imposing the penalty of excommunication latae sententiae upon those who receive episcopal consecration without pontifical mandate is well-known. While expressing hope for their conversion, the Church reaffirms what was declared on 26 September 2006, namely that she does not recognize these ordinations, nor does she intend to recognize them, or any subsequent ordinations based on them, in the future. Hence the canonical status of the supposed bishops remains as it was prior to the ordination conferred by Archbishop Milingo.

I’d expect the same in regard to any attempted Sacramental action in this case.