Freaked out by these papal quotes...are they true?

[Ben_Sinner]

source: waronyou.com/forums/index.php?topic=13861.0

Blasphemous titles claimed for the Pope had embellished and enlarged over the centuries, but a few of these boastful claims appear in an ecclesiastical Roman Catholic dictionary. I’m taking this right out of a Roman Catholic dictionary by Lucius Ferraris, entitled Prompta Bibliothecca Canonica, volume 6, pages 438 and 442, article, Pope, the Catholic Encyclopedia, 1813 edition, volume 6, page 48, speaks of this book as “a veritable encyclopedia of religious knowledge and a precious mine of information.” Those are the words of the Vatican. “The Pope is of so great dignity and so exalted that he is not a mere man, but as it were, God and the vicar of God.” Remember, the Roman emperors were deified. “Hence, the pope is crowned with a triple crown as King of heaven and of earth and of the lower regions.” That is an exact word-for-word description of Osiris. **“So that if it were possible that the angels might err in the faith or think contrary to the faith, they could be judged and excommunicated by the pope.”
**
"The pope is, as it were, God on earth, sole sovereign of the faithful of Christ, chief King of Kings, having plenitude of power to whom has been entrusted by the omnipotent God direction, not only of the earthly, but also of the heavenly kingdom." If that’s not blasphemy, according to the definition, then I don’t know what is, folks.

** “The Pope can modify divine law, as since his power is not of man, but of God.” **

 

[Ben_Sinner]

and just to be clear. I’m not an anti-catholic troll. I came across this due to some anti-catholic people I knew referencing me to this…

I’m assuming that the quotes are taken out of context or are just lies but I just want to get a verification.

Plz help! I don’t want the Catholic Faith to be false!!!

 

[aegsemj]

Jesus told the first Pope (Peter) “Whatever you bind on Earth will be bound in heaven, whatever you loose on Earth will be loosed in heaven”. So yes, I would say most of those quotes are true, based on Jesus’ words.

 

[1ke]

I have said it before and I will say it again: I think you are bording on sinful behavior by continuing to seek out these crazy website that are causing you to doubt the holy Catholic faith. You need to STOP IT.

Go talk to your priest about this obsession of yours with conspiracy theory websites. You would do better to read the CATECHISM than this garbahge.

These supposed quotes give no sources, and you should give it not one more thought nor should you continue to seek out and correspond with these anti-Catholic people.

 

[Ben_Sinner]

I have said it before and I will say it again: I think you are bording on sinful behavior by continuing to seek out these crazy website that are causing you to doubt the holy Catholic faith. You need to STOP IT.

Go talk to your priest about this obsession of yours with conspiracy theory websites. You would do better to read the CATECHISM than this garbahge.

These supposed quotes give no sources, and you should give it not one more thought nor should you continue to seek out and correspond with these anti-Catholic people.

it does give a source though

right out of a Roman Catholic dictionary by Lucius Ferraris, entitled Prompta Bibliothecca Canonica, volume 6, pages 438 and 442, article, Pope, the Catholic Encyclopedia, 1813 edition, volume 6, page 48,

I guess now after re-reading it. The only quote that bothers me is the “triple crown and is king over heaven,earth, and the lower regions quote”

 

[1ke]

it does give a source though

right out of a Roman Catholic dictionary by Lucius Ferraris, entitled Prompta Bibliothecca Canonica, volume 6, pages 438 and 442, article, Pope, the Catholic Encyclopedia, 1813 edition, volume 6, page 48,

Which is suspect given that the title indicates the book is not written in English but Italian. And where would these anti-Catholics even get their hands on this book from 1813?
There is always an obscure book written in another language that anti-Catholics supposedly quote from. That way, you cannot refute it. They have likely mistranslated it or rely on someone else’s translation. Anti-Catholics usually aren’t particularly scholarly.

I guess now after re-reading it. The only quote that bothers me is the “triple crown and is king over heaven,earth, and the lower regions quote”

I suggest the vatican website is a better source.

vatican.va/news_services/press/documentazione/documents/sp_ss_scv/insigne/triregno_en.html

 

[AnneElizabeth]

I have said it before and I will say it again: I think you are bording on sinful behavior by continuing to seek out these crazy website that are causing you to doubt the holy Catholic faith. You need to STOP IT.

Go talk to your priest about this obsession of yours with conspiracy theory websites. You would do better to read the CATECHISM than this garbahge.

These supposed quotes give no sources, and you should give it not one more thought nor should you continue to seek out and correspond with these anti-Catholic people.

I mean no offense, but I think that the OP is NOT bordering on sinful behavior by looking at these websites. I think the OP is probably looking at these things because it was brought up in their soul and they have concerns. There is nothing wrong with this. That is preservation. There is nothing wrong with asking questions. I do see everything wrong in doing the opposite as if that were so, Jesus would not have asked us to SEEK Him. One doesn’t build a true and solid faith life merely by being obedient blindly.

My question for you 1ike is, why are you so annoyed by the OP’s questioning that you need to scare him with threat of sin? How is seeking sinning? I do agree that it would be better to read the catechism ALONG WITH reading these other websites. I can’t see Christ being offended by that at all. It is what He asks.

 

[Burdensome1]

Ben -

Have no worries. The Pope cannot modify divine law. Even WikiAnswers knows this:

3. The pope may speak on a matter of dogma or doctrine (official teaching) of the Church e.g. the presence of Christ in the Euharist or the Incarnation’ in these cases he is explaining, or developing what the Church already believes and teaches. In this sense, Catholics believe he is speaking for God - but no pope can change doctrine.

wiki.answers.com/Q/Does_the_pope_speak_for_God

The book “John Paul II for Dummies” agrees:

P.112 “He (the Pope) can’t change or alter divine law.”

---

So, if I can figure out that only wacko anti-Catholic websites claim the Pope can change divine law by spending 1 minute Googling…why can’t you?

 

[1ke]

I mean no offense, but I think that the OP is NOT bordering on sinful behavior by looking at these websites. I think the OP is probably looking at these things because it was brought up in their soul and they have concerns. There is nothing wrong with this. That is preservation. There is nothing wrong with asking questions. I do see everything wrong in doing the opposite as if that were so, Jesus would not have asked us to SEEK Him. One doesn’t build a true and solid faith life merely by being obedient blindly.

My question for you 1ike is, why are you so annoyed by the OP’s questioning that you need to scare him with threat of sin? How is seeking sinning? I do agree that it would be better to read the catechism ALONG WITH reading these other websites. I can’t see Christ being offended by that at all. It is what He asks.

I suggested the OP seek direction from his priest, as I have many times in the past. This post is not a one time thing. Those who have spiritual issues such as the OP, persistent doubt, scrupulosity, etc, should NOT be seeking out such websites with the frequency the OP does. He should, instead, be talking to a spiritual director.

I am not annoyed with the OP, I am concerned for him.

 

[Immacolata]

Do not let anti-Catholic conspiracy theories sway you from your faith. Pray for those who judge other religions, and, if you are particularly impressionable, avoid those who try to sway your faith with asinine theories and do not go on those websites.

May God bless you.

 

[RockstarBuffalo]

I have said it before and I will say it again: I think you are bording on sinful behavior by continuing to seek out these crazy website that are causing you to doubt the holy Catholic faith. You need to STOP IT.

Go talk to your priest about this obsession of yours with conspiracy theory websites. You would do better to read the CATECHISM than this garbahge.

These supposed quotes give no sources, and you should give it not one more thought nor should you continue to seek out and correspond with these anti-Catholic people.

Yeh, because to question and attempt to educate yourself is a sin. :nope:
Breaking news. Being a good Catholic doesn’t mean being a robot that only does what it’s programed to…

 

[Saints_Alive]

Ben, ever heard of “prayers for the pope” ? Even Pope BXVI asked us to pray for him in his first homily as pope.

If Catholics or popes believed popes to be God, why would we pray for them ? We’d pray to them wouldn’t we ?

A pope is Christ’s Vicar on Earth. He does the Will of God to shepherd the flock.

 

[Immacolata]

Yeh, because to question and attempt to educate yourself is a sin. :nope:
Breaking news. Being a good Catholic doesn’t mean being a robot that only does what it’s programed to…

It is not a sin, nor is 1ke mad with OP, but it is not the best to give attention to conspiracy theories that try to sway you from your faith because they believe it is “wrong.”

 

[Burdensome1]

Obviously the OP has issues, if he didn’t he’d just google a little himself and figure it out, so there’s something else going on here.

 

[Fragile]

Even as a new Evangelical believer I had just about every wacko come out of the woodwork to tell me I was in the wrong chruch, and this was before the internet!

Try not to let the crazies upset you.

 

[Truthstalker]

I do not think you should be turning the OP himself into the issue on a personal basis. Please answer his questions instead of attacking him.

Thank you.

 

[sowinskija]

Obviously the OP has issues, if he didn’t he’d just google a little himself and figure it out, so there’s something else going on here.

I disagree, google can be extremely misleading. It’s a good idea to come here.

 

[R_C]

What 1ke said.

In general, we need a strong and solid faith in order to read anything outside of the Church. Otherwise it may even be sinful to do so, that is, to dwell on the writings of heretics, especially writings against the Bride of Christ, Holy Church. The Lord is most displeased by these writings.

I do urge you to be very careful: we know for a million reasons that the Catholic Church is the Church of Christ, to which God calls all the people of the world to be into so that they may be saved through it and that outside of it, like outside of Noah’s ark, there is no salvation. No quote, no matter how strange, could ever change this.

I invite you, for your personal peace, to read more on what the Church Fathers had to say about Holy Church, the bishops, and the Holy Father, and I invite you to reflect on the fact that centuries ago we didn’t have democracies and senators, we had emperors and kings, and the approach was much different, and there was no such thing as “politically correct”. I do not know, and have no interest in further researching quotes from a silly website, but I do know that nobody can truly understand the majesty of the office of the Vicar of Christ.

When we speak of office, we refer to the dignity, not to the person. Ex. when we say angel, we refer to the office, else we would say spirit. The same applies to priests and bishops.

St Francis of Assisi, whom - as you probably know well - was a very simple and humble follower of Christ who had a major impact (and a most beneficial one!) on the Church, said once:

If I were to meet a priest and an angel, I would bend my knee. First to the priest, then to the angel.

He had a great understanding of the majesty of the Holy Orders, which, enabling priests and bishops to act in persona Christi, truly makes them in their office a living image of Christ, with God-given authority to forgive sins and above all else to bring forth the astounding miracle of transubstantiation in which the Holy Eucharist truly becomes the living Christ.

Just imagine how much greater is the office of the Holy Father. If Christ is the head of the Church and the Church is its mystical body of which we are all members, then the Pope is the visible head of the Church. He is the living Vicar of Christ, and is endowed by the Holy Spirit with extraordinary graces in matters of faith and morals, for on his shoulders relies the cross of ruling over the entire Church Militant. It is to Peter and to the Popes that would follow Him - that is, to the office of the Pope - that Christ said: “I shall give you the keys of the kingdom. Truly I say to you, whatever you bind on earth shall have been bound in heaven; and whatever you loose on earth shall have been loosed in heaven.” This is the Sacred Scripture!

And you are scandalized by a quote that speak in such high words of the Pope? Why, then perhaps you’d be even more scandalized when you read that all the Church Fathers agreed on the specific point that God became man so that men may become God, and to find out that the Catechism teaches that truly we partake in the divine nature.

Do you know what water and wine represent? Water represents humanity, wine divinity. “By the mystery of this water and wine - prays the priest during Mass - may we come to share in the divinity of Christ, who humbled himself to share in our humanity.” Do you see the astonishing significance of the Lord’s very first miracle? Do you understand now why the priest adds water to the wine in the Eucharist?

We see that the people are signified by the water, but Christ’s blood by the wine. Therefore when water is mixed with the wine in the chalice, the people [are] made one with Christ. (Pope Julius, Concil. Bracarens iii, Can. 1)

Indeed, “He was God, and then became man, and that to deify us” (s. Athanasius of Alexandria), and “he who listens to the Lord, and follows the prophecy given by Him, will be formed perfectly in the likeness of the teacher—made a god going about in flesh” (s. Clement of Alexandria), or, as St. Augustine of Hippo writes:

‘For He hath given them power to become the sons of God.’ (John 1:12) If we have been made sons of God, we have also been made gods.

Where, then, is the great scandal in saying that the Vicar of Christ is like a god, when all, all of the Church Fathers teach that it is God’s explicit will that in Christ we all be deified?

Surely nobody would dare to offer to any creature the cult of latria reserved to God alone, not even to the most illustrious members of the body of Christ, the saints of the Church Triumphant who are in heaven with Him.

See, then, just how petty and ignorant are the people who write these articles? Before twenty centuries of theology they are nothing, or, rather, less than nothing, because the truth is not in them, and falsehood is absence and emptiness.

Stay close to Christ and His Church, learn more about it, and one day it will be you who will be able to immediately reject all this heretic, pagan, antichristian nonsense with utmost serenity.

This is all you should know about the Pope as undisputable truth:

882 The Pope, Bishop of Rome and Peter’s successor, “is the perpetual and visible source and foundation of the unity both of the bishops and of the whole company of the faithful.” “For the Roman Pontiff, by reason of his office as Vicar of Christ, and as pastor of the entire Church has full, supreme, and universal power over the whole Church, a power which he can always exercise unhindered.”

 

[Byrnwiga]

source: waronyou.com/forums/index.php?topic=13861.0

Blasphemous titles claimed for the Pope had embellished and enlarged over the centuries, but a few of these boastful claims appear in an ecclesiastical Roman Catholic dictionary. I’m taking this right out of a Roman Catholic dictionary by Lucius Ferraris, entitled Prompta Bibliothecca Canonica, volume 6, pages 438 and 442, article, Pope, the Catholic Encyclopedia, 1813 edition, volume 6, page 48, speaks of this book as “a veritable encyclopedia of religious knowledge and a precious mine of information.” Those are the words of the Vatican. “The Pope is of so great dignity and so exalted that he is not a mere man, but as it were, God and the vicar of God.” Remember, the Roman emperors were deified. “Hence, the pope is crowned with a triple crown as King of heaven and of earth and of the lower regions.” That is an exact word-for-word description of Osiris. **“So that if it were possible that the angels might err in the faith or think contrary to the faith, they could be judged and excommunicated by the pope.”
**
"The pope is, as it were, God on earth, sole sovereign of the faithful of Christ, chief King of Kings, having plenitude of power to whom has been entrusted by the omnipotent God direction, not only of the earthly, but also of the heavenly kingdom." If that’s not blasphemy, according to the definition, then I don’t know what is, folks.

** “The Pope can modify divine law, as since his power is not of man, but of God.” **

Well, the Prompta Bibliotheca Canonica appears to be here. I don’t see how they’ve gotten those things from that book (at columns 438 and 442).

 

[prodigalson2011]

Hi again Ben,

When you’ve got some time, read this article and watch every one of those gross anti-Catholic mistranslations, distortions and fabrications get dismantled. Fear not, Ben. The truth will always prevail.