Free Will and Predestination in Catholicism

[Catholic4Christ]

Is there free will in heaven?

We know that the angels are in heaven, and that after some test many of them rebelled against God, while others did not. So we have evidence of at least one instance of free will exercised in heaven.

I think it is like asking if Jesus’ humanity has free will. The answer would be “yes,” but His human will is always united to His divine will. Same with saints in heaven - once they have become holy enough by the grace of God to dwell in heaven, they would always choose to exercise their free will in union with God’s will because they know it’s the best.

Even with the demons, it is speculated that their rebellion was their own choice based on a test so that the angels could choose whether to love God. We have that test too, but it’s here on earth instead. Adam and Eve were tested (“Don’t eat the fruit”) so that they could choose whether to follow God, and we have our own choices. So far as we know, the “test” is over once we’re in heaven, and since we’ve become holy enough to dwell with God, we aren’t exactly likely to go against His will since we by the definition of “holiness” agree with it.

 

[Tomdstone]

So far as we know, the “test” is over once we’re in heaven, and since we’ve become holy enough to dwell with God, we aren’t exactly likely to go against His will since we by the definition of “holiness” agree with it.

It is not likely, but is it possible to exercise our free will once we are in heaven?

 

[Catholic4Christ]

It is not likely, but is it possible to exercise our free will once we are in heaven?

I would say yes since we know of at least one instance (the test of the angels) of free will being exercised in Heaven. How this will look without such a test is difficult to say. I suppose it depends on whether God gives “options” to the Saints regarding what ways they glorify Him, intercede for us, and carry out His will. Free will need not be merely a choice between good and bad. If the joys of heaven are so great that without a test we would never do evil, it doesn’t necessarily mean that we have no free will. I have the choice to go to my parish or to the parish across town to worship God. I have the choice to donate my money to a charity or to give it directly to the homeless. The Saints probably have a deeper understanding of what choices are best, but i don’t think that necessitates a only single choice for each “saintly” action. I suppose I won’t know for sure until (God willing) I get there!

 

[steve_b]

Thank you. The links to CCC work fine. But I could not get the video to play.

try this, same video, hope that works youtube.com/watch?v=RrDXwF771p4

 

[Bookcat]

God is outside of time.

and “To God, all moments of time are present in their immediacy.” (CCC 600)

It is not so much that God “foresees” -as “sees” .

All of time is before God–all our decisions etc are all as it were freshly before God.

They are seen as they are actually taking place a particular instant in time (and all this is present to God at once).

It is not as it if is some “play written in advance” where the actors simply come on stage at their cue and read their lines.

Our choices - are part of things.

As are the choices of others around us and circumstances that intersect (be the good or evil of others choices etc). All is involved.

 

[Tomdstone]

God is outside of time…

I don’t see how that can be true. Jesus was God and Jesus was inside of time. He lived and walked on earth. Further, the Eucharist is God and the Eucharist is in time.

 

[Frankenfurter]

I don’t see how that can be true. Jesus was God and Jesus was inside of time. He lived and walked on earth. Further, the Eucharist is God and the Eucharist is in time.

Jesus is NOT inside of time. He lives ‘today’ outside of our time. But you are right, he did lower himself to be inside of time for our sake. But that was a temporary state for him. His human nature lived inside of time. But he is more than that. We are not.

The Eucharist is a sacrament which uniquely connects our time to the outside-of-time reality of God. So it is both. It is in our time, and it is outside of time. That makes it extremely unique.

Your question really invokes the uniqueness and power of sacraments - things that are these unique ladders, or walkways, or connections, or islands, between these realms.