Free Will in the Westminster Confession of Faith

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SojournerOnEarth

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And no, there is no hymn that I know of called “We Robotically Worship Thee, O Big Mean God”

From the Westminster Confession of Faith:
Chapter IX
Of Free Will
I. God has endued the will of man with that natural liberty, that is neither forced, nor, by any absolute necessity of nature, determined good, or evil.[1]

II. Man, in his state of innocency, had freedom, and power to will and to do that which was good and well pleasing to God;[2] but yet, mutably, so that he might fall from it.[3]

III. Man, by his fall into a state of sin, has wholly lost all ability of will to any spiritual good accompanying salvation:[4] so as, a natural man, being altogether averse from that good,[5] and dead in sin,[6] is not able, by his own strength, to convert himself, or to prepare himself thereunto.[7]

IV. When God converts a sinner, and translates him into the state of grace, He frees him from his natural bondage under sin;[8] and, by His grace alone, enables him freely to will and to do that which is spiritually good;[9] yet so, as that by reason of his remaining corruption, he does not perfectly, or only, will that which is good, but does also will that which is evil.[10]

V. The will of man is made perfectly and immutably free to do good alone in the state of glory only.[11] http://www.reformed.org/documents/w...ml?body=/documents/wcf_with_proofs/ch_IX.html
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The bracketed numbers are to footnotes.
 
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Calvinists who follow the Westminster Confession of Faith believe in free will.

Calvinists who follow John Calvin do not.
“Man is now deprived of freedom of will, and miserably enslaved.”
-John Calvin, Institutes of the Christian Religion Book 2 Chapter 2
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That is the title of the chapter. The content of the chapter is even worse.
 
What they believe is so nonsensical even people like the JW mock them lol.

Really no point in commenting when it comes to Calvin :roll_eyes: is just asking for a ban really.
 
I remember the two JW gentleman visiting my doorway. They were so ridiculously charitable I cannot imagine them mocking anyone. They may not agree but they don’t agree with the rest of Christianity…

I’m not a Calvinist but have you read through his Systematic Theology?
 
dmar198 said:
Calvinists who follow the Westminster Confession of Faith believe in free will.

Calvinists who follow John Calvin do not.
“Man is now deprived of freedom of will, and miserably enslaved.”

-John Calvin, Institutes of the Christian Religion Book 2 Chapter 2
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I’m pretty sure Calvin and the Westminster Confession are on the same page.

Calvinists believe man was created with free will but as a result of the fall and the effects of original sin, man is totally depraved and dead in sin–i.e. the will is in bondage to sin. According to Calvin, however, humans sin out of necessity (the corruption of our nature makes it inevitable), however, we do not sin from compulsion. We sin willingly out of a depraved nature. This is how Calvinists attempt to defeat the “robot” objections.

Calvinists also believe that when God effectually calls a person to salvation, he also regenerates them, repairing the will and freeing it from the bondage of sin.
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The above excerpt is, for all practical purposes, a denial of free will for fallen man. In Catholicism fallen man is not free to reach or approach God on his own; he’s lost, unable and unwilling to move himself towards God. God establishes cooperation now, with the New Covenant, by grace. But He still won’t override man’s will; that’s never been His purpose. Instead He offers us salvation but we can always refuse, we can reject His offer.

In Calvinism, man cannot refuse; he’s eternally elected and predestined to heaven if he’s saved, to hell if he’s not. Salvation comes first, and is a done deal, with perseverance guaranteed; everything is done by God, all to Christ I owe. They put the cart squarely ahead of the horse. Anyway, it’s a dull and ridiculous and dangerous little theology.
 
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fhansen said:
The above excerpt is, for all practical purposes, a denial of free will for fallen man. In Catholicism fallen man is not free to reach or approach God on his own; he’s lost, unable and unwilling to move himself towards God. God establishes cooperation now, with the New Covenant, by grace. But He still won’t override man’s will; that’s never been His purpose. Instead He offers us salvation but we can always refuse, we can reject His offer.

In Calvinism, man cannot refuse; he’s eternally elected and predestined to heaven if he’s saved, to hell if he’s not. Salvation comes first, and is a done deal, with perseverance guaranteed; everything is done by God, all to Christ I owe. They put the cart squarely ahead of the horse. Anyway, it’s a dull and ridiculous and dangerous little theology.
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Kinda nasty there, don’t you know?
 
Yes, a bit. It’s the “Christian” theology I tend to detest the most.
 
fhansen said:
Yes, a bit. It’s the “Christian” theology I tend to detest the most.
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The ‘nasty’’ is your statement in comparison to the idea of respecting the beliefs of others.

People are taking the opportunity to insult Calvinism, rather than to be informed. Sad.
 
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I do not need to respect beliefs that compromise the gospel, based on a faulty understanding of the nature and will of God. Fortunately most Protestants, regardless of their Church’s theological persuasion, live as if they’re calling and election are not so sure.
 
fhansen said:
I do not need to respect beliefs that compromise the gospel, based on a faulty understanding of the nature and will of God. Fortunately most Protestants, regardless of their Church’s theological persuasion, live as if they’re calling and election are not so sure.
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Actually you do. Have you read any of the ecumenical literature written by the Vatican?
 
Of course. Nowhere does it say we must like bad theology. Hate the theology, love the theologian.
 
Everything, from all Vat II docs including Unitatis Redintegratio, several times, to all of the catechism. I affirm it all, firmly believing in ecumenism. Part of that effort is in honestly knowing/ recognizing the differences.
 
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fhansen said:
Everything, from all Vat II docs including Unitatis Redintegratio, several times, to all of the catechism. I affirm it all, firmly believing in ecumenism. Part of that effort is in honestly knowing/ recognizing the differences.
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It does not seem to have done you any good in terms of how you post.
 
Not my normal way -Calvinism seems to bring the worst out of me I guess. I really do not like it.
 
fhansen said:
Not my normal way -Calvinism seems to bring the worst out of me I guess. I really do not like it.
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Then it is probably good for you to work on improving your ecumenical skills by discussing Calvinism with a Calvinist or one of its sympathizers. 😀

I have found two errors with Catholics regarding Calvinism. One is that they attack something Calvinists believe that the Catholic Church actually believes. The second is that they attack hyper-Calvinism, which is sort of like Calvinism’s evil little sister.

Now, lie on the couch and look at the ceiling and tell me exactly what it is you hate about Calvinism.
“Plays soothing music.”
 
Thanks, gotta go to my anger management class now tho-all because Calvin et al messed around with religion. 😏 When I get back I’ll take your advice. Maybe I’ll even become Presbyterian or Reformed Baptist or something just to try it. Why not?- I was AOG Pentecostal for quite some time. Later. PS: Jesus maybe could’ve used some anger reducing techniques too I suppose; some things just seemed to really set Him off. 😀
 
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