Friends

[salve_maria_1]

I promise this isn’t a vent thread. It’s more of a thinking thread. If anyone has any ideas, insight, etc., please chime in!

So, I’ve not been very successful in the friend department. I can count all the people I have ever considered friends on one hand, and even then, it’s not too clear-cut, because of circumstances. I’m in college, but was homeschooled throughout grades 1-12. I was not allowed to make friends then, and I’m sort of at a loss now. To complicate things further, I have Aspergers (or mild autism) and it can make socializing very difficult at times.

Part of it is I think I have a stricter definition of friend than most people. I feel like most people’s friends are, in reality, acquaintances, good ones perhaps, but acquaintances nonetheless. And I have many of those.

Friendship, in my mind, is a relationship in which both parties wish for the very best for each other and would not do anything to take advantage of each other in a bad way. There is, too, a meeting of minds and some kind of emotional connection. I can’t explain really how I feel about my friends, but they have my heart. They have my mind, my soul, and my heart. I have a lot of trouble feeling things like affection for most people, but the tiny selection of friends I have, has my heart.

I just feel like as much as I care about these people, they are so busy and we rarely have time to talk or do anything. I think they care about me, and perhaps very, very much so. And the people that tend to be included among my friends are like me in many ways, and very intelligent and very busy, and perhaps prone to social burnout like I am (I know my two closest friends are that way, at least). So I am afraid to initiate anything because I am sensitive to their busyness and their social exhaustion. The rare times we do talk, it’s wonderful, dynamic, and very rewarding, so I do not think they are avoiding me at all.

I am very involved with clubs on campus and activities outside of college. I know a lot of people, work, volunteer. I am friendly and kind to everyone, even if I am bit awkward, and people tend to see me as trustworthy. So it’s not like I am avoiding people. I just do not normally ever meet anyone that I can connect with at the friend level. I know so well how it feels to be incredibly lonely in a group of people. I wonder how normal this is, but I think it will always be a problem for me.

Discussion of friends, friendship, and anything else related welcome!

 

[Annie39]

I promise this isn’t a vent thread. It’s more of a thinking thread. If anyone has any ideas, insight, etc., please chime in!

So, I’ve not been very successful in the friend department. I can count all the people I have ever considered friends on one hand, and even then, it’s not too clear-cut, because of circumstances. I’m in college, but was homeschooled throughout grades 1-12. I was not allowed to make friends then, and I’m sort of at a loss now. To complicate things further, I have Aspergers (or mild autism) and it can make socializing very difficult at times.

Part of it is I think I have a stricter definition of friend than most people. I feel like most people’s friends are, in reality, acquaintances, good ones perhaps, but acquaintances nonetheless. And I have many of those.

Friendship, in my mind, is a relationship in which both parties wish for the very best for each other and would not do anything to take advantage of each other in a bad way. There is, too, a meeting of minds and some kind of emotional connection. I can’t explain really how I feel about my friends, but they have my heart. They have my mind, my soul, and my heart. I have a lot of trouble feeling things like affection for most people, but the tiny selection of friends I have, has my heart.

I just feel like as much as I care about these people, they are so busy and we rarely have time to talk or do anything. I think they care about me, and perhaps very, very much so. And the people that tend to be included among my friends are like me in many ways, and very intelligent and very busy, and perhaps prone to social burnout like I am (I know my two closest friends are that way, at least). So I am afraid to initiate anything because I am sensitive to their busyness and their social exhaustion. The rare times we do talk, it’s wonderful, dynamic, and very rewarding, so I do not think they are avoiding me at all.

I am very involved with clubs on campus and activities outside of college. I know a lot of people, work, volunteer. I am friendly and kind to everyone, even if I am bit awkward, and people tend to see me as trustworthy. So it’s not like I am avoiding people. I just do not normally ever meet anyone that I can connect with at the friend level. I know so well how it feels to be incredibly lonely in a group of people. I wonder how normal this is, but I think it will always be a problem for me.

Discussion of friends, friendship, and anything else related welcome!

You mentioned that we could discuss anything else so I have a question about Aspergers. I would be interested in how you were diagnosed and what are the symptoms?

Annie

 

[salve_maria_1]

You mentioned that we could discuss anything else so I have a question about Aspergers. I would be interested in how you were diagnosed and what are the symptoms?

Annie

Sure.

I was diagnosed after neuropsychological and psychiatric examinations, which included the use of the Autism Quotient (AQ) test score. I’d rather not share mine but it ended up on the higher end of things. These examinations look into a variety of traits that can be commonly symptomatic of the condition. One of the problems is that I am female, and was diagnosed much later than many boys would have been.

The symptoms depend on the individual, but I can share some of my symptoms which tend to be classic. I have extreme obsessive interests in usually esoteric areas, some which last but a day and others which have been with me for my whole life. My knowledge base in some of these areas has shocked professors that I have worked with or was a student under. I also require a schedule and must stick to it, and experience very high anxiety about many things, from social experiences to a due paper, or my schedule getting out of whack. I engage in repetitive behaviors like stimming (for me, constantly tapping my foot, rocking a little, rubbing my chin, and biting my nails) or listening to the same song played literally all day every day for months. I have trouble sleeping. I tend to get very lost in thought or talk way too much about things that fascinate me. I have zero interest in clothes and I hate being noticed and especially photographed, so I end up dressing as plainly and inconspiciously as possible. I get along far better with people older than me and even as a small child I had the vocabulary of a very well-educated adult. I read like a fiend and was hyperlexic. I have terrible trouble with following directions to get someplace, am clumsy, and have a slightly unusual, bouncy gait. I can engage a professor about the genetics of a complex trait with absolute ease but try social formalities with someone my own age and it’s very tough. I tend to be very literal and have a dry, dark sense of humor when I do make jokes. I hate small talk and things like that. I like to sit in dark rooms by myself.

Not everything will be found in every person with the condition, and I am sure I left things out, but a good many of those symptoms are rather classic.

 

[pensmama87]

salve_maria,

You are definitely not alone! I am familiar with a lot of the feelings you describe. I am not on the autism spectrum, but I do have social anxiety and am definitely an introvert.

One of the things that has helped me is, with the people you have close connections with, to regularly schedule time to see them. That helps with feeling overwhelmed by making the connection, because it’s just there. For example, on the last Wednesday of every month, Jane or Bobby comes over for dinner. It’s just something that is done, nobody has to ask, and you have the time to reconnect.

I think you are doing many of the right things. I am guessing you are in your 20s since you mention college. I’m 27 and I think with the rise of social media many people in our generation do not really know how to authentically communicate with others. Many of us don’t know how to properly introduce each other, how to talk face-to-face, because it’s not something we do very much. But if you’re aware that’s something you’re lacking in, you’re further ahead than many people, who flounder but refuse to learn “the rules” because “the rules are stupid.” They are there to help facilitate communication. So you might have a little trouble with your age group anyway in terms of anything more than friendliness, except for a few other people. I actually get along much better with people who are a bit older than me (part of that is my station in life, too - married with kids, when a lot of people my age aren’t even close to that.)

 

[Xantippe]

I think the number of close friends you’ve had is actually pretty normal.

 

[Xantippe]

“In this age of Facebook and Twitter, we are all supposed to have hundreds of friends.
But in fact most of us have just two people we would consider to be close friends – down from an average of three 25 years ago, a study claims.”

dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2058281/So-Facebook-Most-people-TWO-close-friends.html

So, you are normal, it’s just that normal isn’t that great.

 

[Annie39]

Sure.

I was diagnosed after neuropsychological and psychiatric examinations, which included the use of the Autism Quotient (AQ) test score. I’d rather not share mine but it ended up on the higher end of things. These examinations look into a variety of traits that can be commonly symptomatic of the condition. One of the problems is that I am female, and was diagnosed much later than many boys would have been.

The symptoms depend on the individual, but I can share some of my symptoms which tend to be classic. I have extreme obsessive interests in usually esoteric areas, some which last but a day and others which have been with me for my whole life. My knowledge base in some of these areas has shocked professors that I have worked with or was a student under. I also require a schedule and must stick to it, and experience very high anxiety about many things, from social experiences to a due paper, or my schedule getting out of whack. I engage in repetitive behaviors like stimming (for me, constantly tapping my foot, rocking a little, rubbing my chin, and biting my nails) or listening to the same song played literally all day every day for months. I have trouble sleeping. I tend to get very lost in thought or talk way too much about things that fascinate me. I have zero interest in clothes and I hate being noticed and especially photographed, so I end up dressing as plainly and inconspiciously as possible. I get along far better with people older than me and even as a small child I had the vocabulary of a very well-educated adult. I read like a fiend and was hyperlexic. I have terrible trouble with following directions to get someplace, am clumsy, and have a slightly unusual, bouncy gait. I can engage a professor about the genetics of a complex trait with absolute ease but try social formalities with someone my own age and it’s very tough. I tend to be very literal and have a dry, dark sense of humor when I do make jokes. I hate small talk and things like that. I like to sit in dark rooms by myself.

Not everything will be found in every person with the condition, and I am sure I left things out, but a good many of those symptoms are rather classic.

Thanks for the information. I asked the question because my grand-daughter is severely autistic. Recently a niece’s son was diagnosed with aspersers syndrome or so my niece says. It is my opinion the syndrome is over diagnosed. The boy in question has none of the symptoms that I can see. He is, however, a troubled child and if he doesn’t end up in jail at some point I will be surprised but I see this stemming from his horrible home life.

I do recognize the high functioning autism in your explanation.

Annie

 

[Sailor_Kenshin]

I promise this isn’t a vent thread. It’s more of a thinking thread. If anyone has any ideas, insight, etc., please chime in!

So, I’ve not been very successful in the friend department. I can count all the people I have ever considered friends on one hand, and even then, it’s not too clear-cut, because of circumstances. I’m in college, but was homeschooled throughout grades 1-12. I was not allowed to make friends then, and I’m sort of at a loss now. To complicate things further, I have Aspergers (or mild autism) and it can make socializing very difficult at times.

Part of it is I think I have a stricter definition of friend than most people. I feel like most people’s friends are, in reality, acquaintances, good ones perhaps, but acquaintances nonetheless. And I have many of those.

Friendship, in my mind, is a relationship in which both parties wish for the very best for each other and would not do anything to take advantage of each other in a bad way. There is, too, a meeting of minds and some kind of emotional connection. I can’t explain really how I feel about my friends, but they have my heart. They have my mind, my soul, and my heart. I have a lot of trouble feeling things like affection for most people, but the tiny selection of friends I have, has my heart.

I just feel like as much as I care about these people, they are so busy and we rarely have time to talk or do anything. I think they care about me, and perhaps very, very much so. And the people that tend to be included among my friends are like me in many ways, and very intelligent and very busy, and perhaps prone to social burnout like I am (I know my two closest friends are that way, at least). So I am afraid to initiate anything because I am sensitive to their busyness and their social exhaustion. The rare times we do talk, it’s wonderful, dynamic, and very rewarding, so I do not think they are avoiding me at all.

I am very involved with clubs on campus and activities outside of college. I know a lot of people, work, volunteer. I am friendly and kind to everyone, even if I am bit awkward, and people tend to see me as trustworthy. So it’s not like I am avoiding people. I just do not normally ever meet anyone that I can connect with at the friend level. I know so well how it feels to be incredibly lonely in a group of people. I wonder how normal this is, but I think it will always be a problem for me.

Discussion of friends, friendship, and anything else related welcome!

I think a lot of people feel the same way. I sorta do.

Real friends (and your defintion hits the mark) are rare.

 

[EasterJoy]

As nearly as I can tell, what you’re describing is more common than not. I have heard a priest say that if you have two or three people in your life in whom you can place your trust, you are doing well. That is within a* lifetime!* There are not a few men who do not have this kind of a friend except in their brothers and wives.

I would say that we need to be careful not to look for a person to fill the void that can only be filled by God. Other people can bring grace into our lives, but they, too, are only limited human beings, and few of us are saints. That means we have a rather substantial crust of self-concern keeping us from being the great friends that others need us to be. The solution for that, too, is a relationship with God, who as you know spends a great deal of time at the door knocking, waiting to be allowed in, and a great deal of time forgiving. Be merciful in how you look at your friends, then. Their limitations are only what we all need to have forgiven in ourselves. We will be the friends we need to be for each other when we have been made into finished saints. Until then, we’re going to fail on a rather regular basis. That is part of what makes this a vale of tears; ask for help to get through it, and be a help to others to get through it. If we are faithful, this won’t last forever!

 

[tawny]

Praying for you. Finding true friendship in today’s world can be very difficult. Reach out, there is someone out there seeking true friendship. And when you do find it; do your best to hold on to it. A true friend is a valuable gift. They are loyal and always there for you.

 

[getysbg]

So, you are normal, it’s just that normal isn’t that great.

So true! as an only child, I learned early on to function by myself. The only concern I spotted in your initial post was concerning loneliness. It’s true, most friends are really just acquaintences,so treasure those you have. But even casual connections can be rewarding.

 

[EasterJoy]

Praying for you. Finding true friendship in today’s world can be very difficult. Reach out, there is someone out there seeking true friendship. And when you do find it; do your best to hold on to it. A true friend is a valuable gift. They are loyal and always there for you.

As the psalmist put it, it is better to “Put no trust in princes, in children of Adam powerless to save.” (Ps. 146:3)

People screw up. We know this, because we ourselves screw up. We fail others who ought to be able to count on us. We wish we never did, but from time to time we do. So while it is true that a friend is like gold, we need to remember that other people are just as fallible as we are. We will not be so hard on our friends if we are realistic about the “always” part in “always there for you.”

There is a rule of three; never keep a friend who has seriously let you down on three occasions. This protects us from false friends, because there are people we cannot count on to any degree. Expect, however, that the one time is probably going to come, even from good friends. It can happen. Be ready to forgive that fall without falling into despair that you will never find a “true” friend when it comes.

When my true friends have fallen short–and it happens only very rarely–God has seen to it that someone else is there for me. It also help to not lay too much on one or two friends. In this, too, it is better to rely on God.

 

[salve_maria_1]

I’m sorry that I haven’t had the time to reply until now, as I’ve been busy with classes. Thanks to all for their advice, prayers, and general comments.

Generally, at least with me, it’s not so much a disappointment with people, or something that they do, that seems to impede true friendship. It’s just that most people lack something that makes a benevolent acquaintance a true friend. Some people talk about “chemistry” with regards to dating, and in a way, I think that might best describe it even for platonic relationships. I’ve met people and “hit it off” almost instantly, and others I had to get to know for awhile before I could see that. I am, of course, conscious of the fact that I must myself be a good and true friend, and am constantly working on developing this.

When I do make a friend, I am exceedingly loyal and forgiving, but honestly I haven’t really needed to be that forgiving as the issues that they sometimes have that bother me are simply either out of their control (i.e. busyness) or simple human error, and I can’t be offended by either. It takes a calculated offense to cause me pain. I do try, as much as possible, to give as much of myself as I can for them without expecting anything in return. With the close friends that I have, I can do this without fear of “being used”. So for example, if they are going through a difficult time, I try to console them, listen to them, and be there for them without talking much at all about my own problems. They do the same for me.

As for the “three-strikes” rule, I had an acquaintance I was on friendly terms with, but he had a strong tendency to be rather dismissive of me, while I was always supportive of him (and by supportive, that does not exclude telling in charity when I think they are making a bad choice, etc.). It was very one-sided, and I eventually reduced contact considerably with him. The final straw for me is when he started insulting the intelligence and piety of my very dear close friend, out of jealousy, I presume (it was all platonic, and very clearly so). This offended me so much that I told him that I would be ceasing contact with him, that I would keep him in my prayers, but that his behavior was way out of line. He never apologized for anything. I think this was the best choice.

 

[Petaro]

A friend is a person who knows all about you but still likes you. You are perfectly normal in having a handful of real friends, and they will change throughout your life, as true friendship takes time and effort and we often have little of both.
You are doing all the right things to remain open to friendships despite being an introvert. Nothing wrong with that, as reserve is a very seductive trait. You are right in giving of yourself. Even if people disappoint, there is always a diamond in the dirt. God bless you in all your endeavours.

 

[dedo]

This is an interesting thread. I am not very good in this area either.

The few friends I have had were under the umbrella of a common interest / sport / life situation.

For example, we played the same sport, worked on the same project, or were school mates.

I think that is the soil in which friendships thrive – a common interest.

I don’t know what the “social media” revolution will do with friendships. It seems that people can form support groups / alliances that exist only in a certain forum / context. Again though, the context provides the framework that a common interest provides. Interestingly, this forum has cruises etc. where people can actually meet. Nevertheless, I don’t think people in social media really get to know each other unless a common interest emerges that makes it legitimate for them to meet in real life toward some purpose.

Also, guys are different about friendships than girls. One thing guys are better at is realizing that others have their own lives / challenges, and so they connect when they can. If a guy does not see a friend for 5 years, they can still reconnect down the road almost as if there was no gap. I am not sure that is true with girls. Sometimes guys are quiet not because they don’t want / need friends, but because they need to accomplish something that no one can do for them.

So I would say to develop a real friendship, decide what interests you most, and put the time into that activity. The friendships will grow out of that.

Good luck.

 

[retire_early]

I just watched some videos about Susan Boyle on YouTube yesterday. Pretty interesting.
She has Ausberger’s syndrome and functions pretty well (international singer and recording star) but the anxiety thing trips her up a lot. She also, I get the impression, only has a very few close friends.

Maybe don’t worry about it so much. Like the one commenter said, perhaps you can schedule time with friends, so you are not left in limbo so much as to when you can share time together. Plan an activity every few weeks for a particular day, something agreeable to both of you.

Just curious…do you have any siblings? If so, are you close to them?

 

[VivienneJ]

I can count all the people I have ever considered friends on one hand,

With 6 decades of life behind me, at all stages in my life I have been in the same situation (not always the same people I count on my hand either).

Part of it is I think I have a stricter definition of friend than most people. I feel like most people’s friends are, in reality, acquaintances, good ones perhaps, but acquaintances nonetheless. And I have many of those.

Very true. The people you work or study with, or play sport with, or volunteer with provide a rich source of acquaintances, some of whom become ‘friends’ yet when you move, for example, most of these connections do not transfer with you and you have to make new ones.

Friendship, in my mind, is a relationship in which both parties wish for the very best for each other and would not do anything to take advantage of each other in a bad way. There is, too, a meeting of minds and some kind of emotional connection.

Mmm, I agree with you, however, there are some friends who will take advantage of you at some stage.

I just feel like as much as I care about these people, they are so busy and we rarely have time to talk or do anything. I think they care about me, and perhaps very, very much so. And the people that tend to be included among my friends are like me in many ways, and very intelligent and very busy, and perhaps prone to social burnout like I am (I know my two closest friends are that way, at least). So I am afraid to initiate anything because I am sensitive to their busyness and their social exhaustion. The rare times we do talk, it’s wonderful, dynamic, and very rewarding, so I do not think they are avoiding me at all.

Sadly many of us have such ‘busy’ lives that we just don’t have or make time for friends. ‘Social burnout/exhaustion’ is the affliction of the introvert who needs times of quiet to recharge, but friends are important too. I like this suggestion to counteract this:

One of the things that has helped me is, with the people you have close connections with, to regularly schedule time to see them. That helps with feeling overwhelmed by making the connection, because it’s just there. For example, on the last Wednesday of every month, Jane or Bobby comes over for dinner. It’s just something that is done, nobody has to ask, and you have the time to reconnect. :

A friend is a person who knows all about you but still likes you. You are perfectly normal in having a handful of real friends, and they will change throughout your life, as true friendship takes time and effort and we often have little of both.
You are doing all the right things to remain open to friendships despite being an introvert. Nothing wrong with that, as reserve is a very seductive trait. You are right in giving of yourself. Even if people disappoint, there is always a diamond in the dirt. God bless you in all your endeavours.

^^So true, especially the words I bolded. Sometimes you make a friend who remains a friend throughout your life. More often there are real friends, who are very real friends, but circumstances change, yours or theirs, and the friendship does not last, or becomes more of an acquaintance type of friendship.

Treasure the friends you have at each stage of life and find ways to spend time with them.