From Catholic to....

[Felix_Il_Gatto]

I’m a “revert” Catholic, and I’m curious about something. I often hear about “non practicing Catholics”–those who have basically left the church, but aren’t practicing any other faith, and reverts like myself. I’m wondering how many have left Catholicism to go to another faith, and what it is about that faith that drew them.

Please, no debates or Catholic bashing.

I initially left Catholicism for Hinduism because I liked their open attitude toward all religions. However, upon looking into the Church’s position on other religions and the new dialogue that is occuring between the Church and other religions, I have found little reason to leave the religion of my childhood when there is room for having an agape attitude within Catholicism.

 

[michaeldaniels]

I don’t care who this upsets…but it is the pure, unadulterated truth…THE ONLY REASONS any Catholic would ever abandon The Catholic Church, is because either A) They do not fully understand The Church’s teachings and have a very poor catechesis and they are leaving something they don’t even really know to begin with; or B) They truly know and understand all of The Church’s teachings, but out of complete arrogance, selfishness, and hardness of heart, they leave the Church because they want to live a lifestyle not compatible with being a Catholic.

 

[The_Geographer]

I don’t care who this upsets…but it is the pure, unadulterated truth…THE ONLY REASONS any Catholic would ever abandon The Catholic Church, is because either A) They do not fully understand The Church’s teachings and have a very poor catechesis and they are leaving something they don’t even really know to begin with; or B) They truly know and understand all of The Church’s teachings, but out of complete arrogance, selfishness, and hardness of heart, they leave the Church because they want to live a lifestyle not compatible with being a Catholic.

I think this is a fair assessment.

 

[SSTeacher]

SSTeacher;6449889:

Which of the four distinguishing marks did you conclude were no longer evident?

Curiously,
Mick

With certainty, “apostolic” and “holy.” I am wholly convinced of the arguments against both the validity of the new rites of episcopal ordination and the sanctity of the changes to the liturgy.

Perhaps with less certainty, “one.” There has, of course, always been a healthy amount of theological debate within the Church, and this does not corrupt her unity. It’s a little problematic, however, when even the settled points of doctrine become matters of reinterpretation, are robbed of their integrity, or are all but reversed. The Church must be united not only in time, but across time—“yesterday, today, and the same for ever.” In my opinion that aspect of unity has been compromised.

The upside to all this gloom is that, now no longer a Catholic, I am free to take a broader view. I no longer worry myself over whether the Catholic Church is the sole proprietor of the Christian truth—on the contrary, I see the Christian tradition in line with the perennial Truth. As Our Lord said, “I am the vine, and you are the branches.”

I mistook a branch for the vine.

That’s very interesting. Thanks for taking the time to respond.

Appreciatively,
Mick

 

[Madaglan]

We are to show compassion and tolerance to those who have not heard of or reject the teachings. This does not mean that Buddhism is universalism though. It is a fact of life that all* suffer and all go through the cycle of rebirth, whether they realize it or not. Some particularly bad people may even be reborn into hell.

*Except Arhants.

Hi AJTheMan,

Question for you:

I’m reading The Unabridged Dhammapada (Dover Thrift Edition, Max Mueller translation). In chapter IX (on Evil), it is mentioned that “some” people undergo reincarnation, the workers of evil enter into hell, and the workers of good enter into heaven.

In Buddhist belief, is there a hell and heaven where reincarnation continues? Thanks.

 

[SSTeacher]

I don’t care who this upsets…but it is the pure, unadulterated truth…THE ONLY REASONS any Catholic would ever abandon The Catholic Church, is because either A) They do not fully understand The Church’s teachings and have a very poor catechesis and they are leaving something they don’t even really know to begin with; or B) They truly know and understand all of The Church’s teachings, but out of complete arrogance, selfishness, and hardness of heart, they leave the Church because they want to live a lifestyle not compatible with being a Catholic.

How can you be certain that it’s the pure, unadulterated truth? Is what you’ve declared above official Catholic teaching?

Inquiringly,
Mick

 

[SSTeacher]

michaeldaniels;6450819:

I don’t care who this upsets…but it is the pure, unadulterated truth…THE ONLY REASONS any Catholic would ever abandon The Catholic Church, is because either A) They do not fully understand The Church’s teachings and have a very poor catechesis and they are leaving something they don’t even really know to begin with; or B) They truly know and understand all of The Church’s teachings, but out of complete arrogance, selfishness, and hardness of heart, they leave the Church because they want to live a lifestyle not compatible with being a Catholic.

I think this is a fair assessment.

Which part did you think was fair?

Curiously,
Mick

 

[The_Geographer]

Which part did you think was fair?

Curiously,
Mick

I don’t know, pick one.

 

[Student09]

Hi AJTheMan,

Question for you:

I’m reading The Unabridged Dhammapada (Dover Thrift Edition, Max Mueller translation). In chapter IX (on Evil), it is mentioned that “some” people undergo reincarnation, the workers of evil enter into hell, and the workers of good enter into heaven.

In Buddhist belief, is there a hell and heaven where reincarnation continues? Thanks.

I’m not Buddhist anymore but I can answer this question …

Yes.

There are a number of realms where one can be reborn - in order of how much suffering there is: the hell realm, hungry ghosts, animals, human beings, demi-gods (asuras) and gods (devas), however it is important to note that there are problems with the even the highest and most pleasurable of these realms, and the human realm is considered most desirable because it is most conducive to reaching enlightenment and hence freedom from rebirth (enlightenment, and not the god-realm, is the closest equivalent Buddhism has to the Catholic concept of Heaven). One does not remain permanently in the hell/gods realms but may stay there a very very very long time.

 

[Moscati]

My father left Catholicism for the Baptist church (then the CMA, and currently a Calvary Chapel) when he was 19. I’m going the opposite way.

It had less to do with doctrine and more to do with his troubled relationship with his Catholic father, as far as I know. He had a conversion experience at a Billy Graham-type revival in high school, and never looked back, really. OSAS is very important to him, too.

 

[Vile_Servant]

I don’t care who this upsets…but it is the pure, unadulterated truth…THE ONLY REASONS any Catholic would ever abandon The Catholic Church, is because either A) They do not fully understand The Church’s teachings and have a very poor catechesis and they are leaving something they don’t even really know to begin with; or B) They truly know and understand all of The Church’s teachings, but out of complete arrogance, selfishness, and hardness of heart, they leave the Church because they want to live a lifestyle not compatible with being a Catholic.

I think Catholics leave the Catholic Church for the following reasons;

1. Disillusionment resulting from bad examples set by Vatican and/or clergy, e.g. Perceived materialism in the Vatican, reported sex-abuse scandals/coverups etc.
2. The lure of “better news” elsewhere, e.g. the promise of guaranteed salvation, no purgatory, no hell (in some cases), no strict church teachings on contraception etc.
3. Interfaith marriage, e.g. renouncing Catholic faith to marry a Muslim.
4. The quest for truth in the ongoing faith journey, Catholics who are not fully convinced of the truth of their faith may want to join and investigate other religions to arrive at discernment.
5. Disagreement with one or more Church teachings or dogmas, e.g. Mariology.
6. Loss of faith resulting from attacks by Anti-Catholic sources, e.g. Anti-Catholic websites.

 

[cheese_sdc]

I don’t care who this upsets…but it is the pure, unadulterated truth…THE ONLY REASONS any Catholic would ever abandon The Catholic Church, is because either A) They do not fully understand The Church’s teachings and have a very poor catechesis and they are leaving something they don’t even really know to begin with; or B) They truly know and understand all of The Church’s teachings, but out of complete arrogance, selfishness, and hardness of heart, they leave the Church because they want to live a lifestyle not compatible with being a Catholic.

So, do you get a certain sense of satisfaction by anonymous displays of arrogance?

 

[cheese_sdc]

I think Catholics leave the Catholic Church for the following reasons;

1. Disillusionment resulting from bad examples set by Vatican and/or clergy, e.g. Perceived materialism in the Vatican, reported sex-abuse scandals/coverups etc.
2. The lure of “better news” elsewhere, e.g. the promise of guaranteed salvation, no purgatory, no hell (in some cases), no strict church teachings on contraception etc.
3. Interfaith marriage, e.g. renouncing Catholic faith to marry a Muslim.
4. The quest for truth in the ongoing faith journey, Catholics who are not fully convinced of the truth of their faith may want to join and investigate other religions to arrive at discernment.
5. Disagreement with one or more Church teachings or dogmas, e.g. Mariology.
6. Loss of faith resulting from attacks by Anti-Catholic sources, e.g. Anti-Catholic websites.

This is an example of a charitable post. Thanks.

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

Catholic to Trekkie to Padawan Learner back to Trekkie

 

[cyberwolf001]

Catholic to Trekkie to Padawan Learner back to Trekkie

Kirk, Picard or Sisko?

 

[LestWeForget]

I find this a very interesting time period, being the third generation since reformation, because I grew up Catholic along with 95% of my friends and no one knew anything about it. It is rare to find well informed Catholics anywhere in my neck of the woods, which is Texas. 90% percent of my friends and family who are acclaimed Catholics are drunk all the time, cuss, take the Lord’s name in vain. All because they don’t know what It teaches, whatever It is. I didn’t know. I was taught by my parents, not the Catholic faith, morals and standards. Homosexuality was fine, just accepting people as the times changed, everyone was going to Heaven if you didn’t murder or do drugs etc… I never owned a Bible, which is where all Christianity is explained(argued by well informed Catholics), until I was 18 years old. Phew, beg my pardon for spilling. Anyway, I was baffled finding this website and figuring out what the Catholic faith actually believes. Thanks for reading my personal life story, I know that I will have responses that will go along the lines of “these Catholics don’t speak for the Catholic Church”, I agree. I know what the CC teaches. Thanks again, just sharing some experience. I like a church that is to the effect that UT Austin guy said towards the beginning of this thread, I like the Bible.

 

[JRKH]

I find this a very interesting time period, being the third generation since reformation, because I grew up Catholic along with 95% of my friends and no one knew anything about it. It is rare to find well informed Catholics anywhere in my neck of the woods, which is Texas. 90% percent of my friends and family who are acclaimed Catholics are drunk all the time, cuss, take the Lord’s name in vain. All because they don’t know what It teaches, whatever It is. I didn’t know. I was taught by my parents, not the Catholic faith, morals and standards. Homosexuality was fine, just accepting people as the times changed, everyone was going to Heaven if you didn’t murder or do drugs etc… I never owned a Bible, which is where all Christianity is explained(argued by well informed Catholics), until I was 18 years old. Phew, beg my pardon for spilling. Anyway, I was baffled finding this website and figuring out what the Catholic faith actually believes. Thanks for reading my personal life story, I know that I will have responses that will go along the lines of “these Catholics don’t speak for the Catholic Church”, I agree. I know what the CC teaches. Thanks again, just sharing some experience. I like a church that is to the effect that UT Austin guy said towards the beginning of this thread, I like the Bible.

Good to hear your story and glad you are here getting answers.

Peace
James

 

[JRKH]

Catholic to Druid

The more I learned the less I liked. The constant excuses for wrongs the Church did, the arrogance to non-Catholics.

The fact that almost every Catholic argument came down to A) An appeal to authority fallacy or B) An appeal to blind faith on pain of eternal torment. I mean seriously it is a mortal sign to doubt and question according to one of the booklets Tan puts out that has those two things in Latin them. Imprimatur and Nhil Obstate I think but probably mutilated the spelling.

The anti-life teachings (remember folks I am pro-life anti-abortion) an example being impotent people are barred from marriages even though Josephite Marriages [in which the couple swears to be celibate] are considered the holiest of marriages. On a side note that just leaves me perplexed: I’ve been told abstaining from sex on the anywhere from your first to your first three nights of marriage or even the entire honeymoon is considered an especially holy way to start a marriage, it’s like the Catholics really are anti-sex.

The constant hammering of the message that if your not suffering and are very happy with no problems your doing something wrong and are on the way to hell. Plus the fact that many Saints writings (again with those two bits of Latin saying nothing contradicts the faith in the writing) saying souls go to hell through no fault of there own (Saint Faustina I want to say it was).

I finally return to Paganism and have been better for it ever sense.

Please not the above is not up for debate in this thread given the OPs request.

I respect your desire not to debate these points but -
I would be curious to know where the bolded sections are found in offcial Catholic teaching. Books containing the imprimatur may not “contradict” anything in the faith, but that does not mean they are 100 percent inerrant either.

I ask this, not to convince you or to debate you, but simply to ensure that you are not passing on, even innocently, false information about the Church.

Peace
James

 

[SSTeacher]

The Geographer;6450909:

michaeldaniels;6450819:

I don’t care who this upsets…but it is the pure, unadulterated truth…THE ONLY REASONS any Catholic would ever abandon The Catholic Church, is because either A) They do not fully understand The Church’s teachings and have a very poor catechesis and they are leaving something they don’t even really know to begin with; or B) They truly know and understand all of The Church’s teachings, but out of complete arrogance, selfishness, and hardness of heart, they leave the Church because they want to live a lifestyle not compatible with being a Catholic.

I think this is a fair assessment.Which part did you think was fair?

Curiously,
Mick

SSTeacher;6451075:

Which part did you think was fair?

Curiously,
Mick

I don’t know, pick one.

I thought the period (full stop) at the end of the final sentence was fairly placed.

Grammatically,
Mick

 

[cyberwolf001]

I’ll see if I can track them down. Keep in mind most of my Catholic stuff is long out of my possession so it’ll be hard to track down. You can google Josephite marriage to find some information.

The suffering part comes from “One True Faith” a show praised for it’s Catholic orthodoxy.