Frustration about oblation

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I’m really frustrated and upset right now because, after discerning for months whether or not to become a Benedictine oblate, I finally became an oblate novice this past May. Since September of 2010 I’ve been to a number of local oblate meetings, where they study the Rule, but I am getting more and more frustrated – for example, at this past Sunday’s meeting, I never heard Jesus’ name mentioned, God was mentioned only once or twice in passing, there was no prayer whatsoever, and the woman who leads the group is a Benedictine sister, but she and I are the only Catholics in the group. The vast majority of oblates are Episcopalian or Methodist. I of course don’t think they should be excluded from what I thought was a Catholic charism, but I feel like a fish out of water. I believe deeply in the teachings of the Catholic Church (the true teachings, not what Protestants think are taught), and I guess I am naive but I honestly don’t understand how other Christians can read the Bible and not see how many Catholic teachings are Bible based; I don’t understand why all Christians aren’t Catholic. I want to shake these other oblates and say, “Don’t you SEE??”

And even the Sister who leads the Benedictine oblate group – she thinks women should be allowed to be priests, among other things. I must be a naive fool but to me the ‘controversial’ Church teachings are logical. Now I’m rethinking whether I should continue as an oblate novice (though I really thought that was God’s desire for me), and I am without a spiritual director now. I don’t know where to turn. I’d like to meet regularly with our parish priest or deacon, but everyone is always too busy, especially our priest. And my scheduling options are limited because I work full time, and drive total two hours a day from home to work and back. And after I get home, my energy level is so low. . . Of course I pray and journal, but I’d like to bounce ideas off other humans sometimes. . . . when I moved to this state two years ago, I tried to find employment with the Archdiocese, but none of that came to pass. Perhaps God in His love wanted me to keep my rose-colored glasses on regarding the Church, and thus kept me away from the hierarchy of it, I don’t know.

I hope I haven’t offended anyone with my conservative stance; perhaps you agree that women should be priests, and agree with same-sex marriage, etc. One of the things that I have admired about the Church is that, to me, it has seemed so understanding of human frailty, not like some Evangelical or Fundamentalist folks I could think of. But since I agree with Church teachings, I admire how the Church has (to my mind) remained faithful to Christ’s teachings for more than 2,000 years – or I guess it’s really 1,981 years (2011 - 30 years, when Christ began his ministry).

I’d like to be a full-time Catholic apologist because I love the Church so much, but (1) I can’t afford it, and (2) I’m no good at debating.

Is anyone else out there feeling this way??
 
Wow, that sounds like a gut-wrenching story and I cannot imagine the frustration you are going through. You have a couple of options:
  1. Stick this out. Think about it, Christ suffered for all of us on the Cross and there was I’m sure many times in His human nature he doubted or was afraid. The garden of Gethsemane is the perfect example when he said “Lord take this cup of suffering away from me.” Furthermore, perhaps you can evangelize to your non-Catholic bretheren of this group. However, seeing as you are set with a feminist leader from the “Magisterium of nuns” it seems, and you have other Christians in the group (I’m more worried about Methodists being more strict vs Episcopalians), you might become a rable rouser and I fear that Sister will take their side being Liberal. Then again you never know, maybe you can be Christ’s “Salt of the Earth, Light of the World” to these pour souls.
  2. Leave now!!! This might seem quite cowardly though and considering you worked so hard and thought so much about the oblates, it would throw a lot of time and energy away. However, these liberal groups are the poison in the Church sucking the spiritual power it has in the name of “Ecumenism”. The Catholic Church, via it’s clergy and leaders, have allowed spiritual sloth to prevail and have given up their Catholic identity and authority in the world by yielding to modernism (which includes all religions being equal in its values), feminism, and liberalism. Maybe Christ is calling you to a vocation with a more traditional parish or community, be it Novus Ordo or Tridentine Latin Mass/EF Mass. Are there any Fraternal Society of St Peter communities or Institute of Christ the King communities nearby, including their churches? Also if you want to stay near the Novus Ordo, Opus Dei sounds like an awesome society to be part of, which is a personal prelature of the late Venerable Pope John Paul II!
In the end it’s up to you, though you might want to make a decision sooner and stick with it, in case the worst happens and you might feel worse than if you make a decision now.
 
There’s nothing wrong with ecumenism, the Church has been clear on that for several years now, with some orders practicing some forms of ecumenism this as far back as just after the reformation if I am not mistaken.

What there is something wrong with is when Catholic teaching gets distorted to suit the needs of others, regardless of their spirituality. In this case that’s obviously happening, as the Sister wants to be a Father, which doesn’t exactly make sense just by looking at the titles I just used.

Do what you feel is right, and what you feel God calling you to do. I’m sure there’s a few good Oblates running around some place. In my city we have two groups of Oblates; one is like what you describe and is to be avoided due to not being in lien with Church teaching. Yet the local Polish Church is run by a different set of Oblates and they are AWESOME.
 
I am truly sorry for your problems with being an Oblate . I don’t know what city you are in , but we have a great and very religious group at the Conception Abbey in Conception ,Missouri , with Fr. Kenneth OSB as our director .We even assit with the visitor program by operating an Office to assit our guest at the Abbey .
 
I learned a long time ago that not everyone who says they are a “Boy Scout” is really a Boy Scout. I found that each group seems to interpret things their own way.

Sounds like your discernment process was not very sound.

Look elsewhere.
 
Dear Friend in our Holy Father St Benedict!

I’m a “long-distance” oblate associated with St Meinrad’s Archabbey.

In recent times, non-Catholic Christians have been drawn to the Rule of St Benedict and Benedictine Monasticism (there are Anglican and Lutheran Benedictine monasteries and other Evangelical groups that take their inspiration from the Rule of Benedict, including Presbyterians).

However, if your group is, in its majority, non-Catholic (with liberal Catholics thrown in for good measure . . .) then that could really pose a problem for you and others (myself included).

You might wish to join another oblate group (or another third order altogether). You may also wish to become a long-distance Oblate and St Meinrad’s Archabbey will be happy to accommodate you (just to their website and write to the Director of Oblates, Fr. Meinrad Brune OSB).

The fact that you would be “long distance” need not pose a problem for you as you could then begin to gather together a group of like-minded associates and create your own long distance oblate group (which is what I’m attempting to do).

And I’m trying to bring together an Eastern Catholic group at that.

I was once on a discussion forum with other oblates and oblate candidates where there were non-Catholic participants. Several disagreements developed, even quite nasty ones. Some of our Protestant brothers and sisters took, shall we say, serious exception to my “constant going on about the invocation of saints.” 🙂

To me, it seems natural to want to invoke St Benedict whose medal/cross one wears . . .

Or am I being silly? 😉

I’ve a lot of time for Methodists, however, as they come from a tradition of disciplined prayer, fasting, Bible-reading etc as per their founder, John Wesley. They also have their own religious Order of St Luke which has a website and which wears red scapulars.

But if you feel that the group you are attending is not “Christ-centred” as you suggest then it is simply missing the point of Benedict’s Rule.

But if you have only attended one meeting, then perhaps you might wish to attend some more to see if there is consistent (bad) pattern.

If the group is talking about the pragmatic aspects of following the Rule - that is a valid approach to begin with. Does it talk about daily prayer, lectio divina, church attendance? If not, I would ask them where these elements of the Benedictine spirituality figure in their estimation.

Perhaps you could connect with a more traditional Benedictine group as has been suggested already.

Alex
 
Frankly, I would have run the other direction the minute your leader said women should be allowed to be priests. You are more tolerant than I would be! 😛

Bring it to prayer. Is this really the group God wishes you to be part of? Maybe He wished you to be a Benedictine, but not neccessarily in that particular group.
 
I think you should go one to be an oblate…but maybe you should talk to the Abbess/Mother Superior of the convent/monastery/etc… of the Sister who’s teaching. Also, you could also find another Nun who’s able to instruct you in private?

Also don’t be afraid to offend someone by preaching the Truth 🙂

God Bless :signofcross::byzsoc:

I’ll pray for your vocation!
 
ksjpublish said:
I’m really frustrated and upset right now because, after discerning for months whether or not to become a Benedictine oblate, I finally became an oblate novice this past May. Since September of 2010 I’ve been to a number of local oblate meetings, where they study the Rule, but I am getting more and more frustrated – for example, at this past Sunday’s meeting, I never heard Jesus’ name mentioned, God was mentioned only once or twice in passing, there was no prayer whatsoever, and the woman who leads the group is a Benedictine sister, but she and I are the only Catholics in the group. The vast majority of oblates are Episcopalian or Methodist. I of course don’t think they should be excluded from what I thought was a Catholic charism, but I feel like a fish out of water.
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I am a Secular Franciscan, and it is in our rule, that to be admitted to the fraternity, one must be a Catholic. I would think the other third orders/oblates would have something similar, as the third orders/oblates are part of a greater religious family made up of monks/brothers, and nuns/sisters. I guess I wonder if this is a true Benedictine Oblate group, and are they Catholic? Protestants interested in a Franciscan Third Order are to seek one of the protestant communities, of which I believe most are Anglican/Episcopalian (Desmond Tutu is a member), and also Lutheran. I’d suggest you find another group, or follow what was suggested about long distance Oblates. What you described doesn’t sound right. Non-Catholics are allowed to be associates in a Franciscan fraternity, but only Catholics may be professed. I helped found a fraternity in my last location, as there were none. We had a minister and his wife come to our meetings, who became associates. But then they both went through RCIA, so they were allowed to attend formation. Shortly after reception into the RCC, they made their profession as Secular Franciscans. The minister left his church, and ministry. He later served as Vice Minister for our fraternity. So, are those Episcopalian and Methodist associates, or are they professed or candidates in formation Oblates? Can somebody quote from the rule/constitutions regarding minimums for membership as an Oblate? If Sister thinks women should be allowed to be priests, she may think protestants can be Oblates, even if the rules/constitutions say otherwise.
 
ClayPots47 said:
I am a Secular Franciscan, and it is in our rule, that to be admitted to the fraternity, one must be a Catholic.
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I think that makes perfect sense. I was very surprised to find out you don’t have to be Catholic to be a Benedictine Oblate. It’s fine to go on retreats if you’re not Catholic, but I thought to be Benedictine was to be Catholic?:confused:
 
TrueLight said:
I think that makes perfect sense. I was very surprised to find out you don’t have to be Catholic to be a Benedictine Oblate. It’s fine to go on retreats if you’re not Catholic, but I thought to be Benedictine was to be Catholic?:confused:
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Not sure about the Benedictines, but I do know the Lay Dominicans accept only Catholics.
 
Good Morning KSJPUBLISH – Apparently for some reason your were drawn to the Benedictine spirituality; and after much discernment you were called to become an Oblate. If possible, try to spend some time in front of the Blessed Sacrament, either in Church or in an Adoration Chapel giving your concerns to Jesus and asking for His help and guidance. It may take quite a few visits for you to become aware of His wishes for you. Also start praying to St. Benedict, again asking for his help. I am in agreement with trying to find another Benedictine group near your area or asking to become a long-distance Oblate. Try to remember once St. Benedict draws you to himself he wants you with him for some reason. Good luck.
 
it is like joining a parish, if those running it are not themselves orthodox you may have to find another place.
bring up your concerns directly with the sister
you won’t get much satisfaction, but you will give her much needed (name removed by moderator)ut when she realizes she is driving away her best people

not all oblate communities are like this, even those like ours who do accept non-Catholics (under certain conditions).
 
It should be pointed out, much as Puzzleannie says, though Benedictines are an “order” but each community is highly autonomous. As such an oblate is not joining the Benedictine order but is rather joining a specific Benedictine community, or abbey (or priory).

I belong to a very Tradtional monastery (note, in the big T sense, that is “orthodox” but not in the "we only do the EF Mass sense; in fact the mass is OF but is in Gregorian chant, and Lauds and Vespers are in Latin Gregorian chant and the Divine Office schema they use is a post-Vatican II office, though on a one week cycle); only Catholics may become oblates; we have an annual oblate retreat as well as twice-yearly regional oblate’s day (our Oblate Master travels to different regions; I live near the abbey and we have ours at the abbey). The abbey did apparently once experiment with having a non-Catholic oblate, a Baptist. It was not a happy experience, imagine a Baptist trying to convert a community of over 100 Catholic oblates. Since then all oblates have been Catholics.

The Oblate Master, at our meetings, preaches to us and instructs us, both in the Rule but also in prayer, the Bible, etc. For example in the past three years he has given talks on each of the synoptic Gospels based on the year we were in (A, B or C in the cycle); he gave a talk on the Eucharist, and this year he has been examining the theology of the Lord’s Prayer with us. In the past he has preached on the Rule, in particular chapter 7 (“On Humility”) and chapter 4 (“what are the instruments of good works”).

Some of the monks are quite liberal on social teaching, others very conservative. They very welcoming to those who are fallen, broken or otherwise in trouble; they are great healers. They see the monastery not as a resort for the righteous, but as a hospital for sinners.

Overall my experience has been very positive as an element to nourish my faith and give direction and a better prayer regimen to my life and faith walk. I remember when my elderly aunt died, my last living relative from the generation above me, how sad I felt about no longer having any “family” (I have no living brothers or sisters). My Oblate Master very kindly and warmly said, “oh yes you do, we (the monastic community) are your family now”. He said it with such gentleness and sincerity it brought tears to my eyes.

Frankly, I would feel uneasy in the OP’s circumstances as well. It seems mostly the US communities that allow non-Catholics to become oblates (read the Cloister Walk by Kathleen Norris, excellent book and one that directed myself to becoming an oblate); some others outside the US will allow members of the liturgical churches (Anglican, Lutheran, etc.) to become oblates. There is nothing fundamentally wrong with a non-Catholic becoming an oblate; but the orientation of the oblates should still be solidly Christian in nature and Benedictine in spirit and nourished from the Bible, the Rule, Tradition, and most importantly, the Eucharist.

Frankly from what I have seen the Benedictine “sisters”, who are not cloistered, can be problematic from the POV of orthodoxy. In my area there is are two communities of cloistered nuns of the Solesmes congregation, and I can assure you they are very orthodox.

I therefore think the issue is not one related to your call to become an oblate but rather to your choice of community, which may not be a good fit for you. I urge you therefore to try to find a monastery that is more orthodox, with an oblate community that is more Catholic. They do exist, take my word for it! My community is an excellent example. I am also close to a monastery in France (the founding abbey of our abbey), and they too are very, very orthodox. We also have several priests and deacons who are oblates.

Good luck and God Bless
 
Hi, and thanks for all your replies. It makes me feel a little better to be able to chat this way, since I’m feeling at the moment like I have no one else to talk to. I will probably go to one more meeting of these oblates, since last meeting was in part a special program with a speaker. And I will check out the St. Meinrad site. I appreciate all your thoughts and prayers so very, very much.

I have another concern now: my husband is a very-much-lapsed Catholic (he says it never ‘took’ with him). The other night I dared to finally tell him that I agreed with all the teachings of the Church, including the ones about women not being priests, and their disapproval of same-sex marriages. Well, he called me a Nazi, said I was intolerant, and that if Jesus were here on earth today he (my husband) could not believe that Jesus would be so intolerant as to say ‘women can’t be priests in my church’ or that Christ would condemn homosexuals for doing what is natural for them.

I feel terrible. I’m no good at debating. I still believe in the Church teachings, but what does one say to someone who insists the Church is intolerant? I’ve given him the reasons for why women can’t be priests, but my husband just sweepingly discounts them (‘that’s just ridiculous, anyone who says someone should be excluded because of what they naturally are, is intolerant’).

I don’t try to force my beliefs on him, nor do I call him intolerant because of his attitude. If I do point out that I don’t call him intolerant because he doesn’t agree with me, he says I’m just making it personal.

Any advice? (don’t tell me to leave him, I am convinced that God put us together)
 
Well, I’m Anglican, and I think the group sounds rather unorthodox.

I guess one question I would ask is, what part do you want this group, or need them, to play in your life? And what part might you have to play in theirs?

But as for feeling frustrated that some do not accept Catholicism: remember that there are many pious, educated, and wise non-Catholic Christians. The claim that all Protestants must be uneducated, or not understand theology, or not know Church history, is simply false. The reason that Christians, or human beings, do not all agree on religion, even when we try, is because we see things darkly and through a veil. So consider that they may have good reasons to come to the conclusions they have, as you have good reasons for your conclusions.
 
ksjpublish said:
Hi, and thanks for all your replies. It makes me feel a little better to be able to chat this way, since I’m feeling at the moment like I have no one else to talk to. I will probably go to one more meeting of these oblates, since last meeting was in part a special program with a speaker. And I will check out the St. Meinrad site. I appreciate all your thoughts and prayers so very, very much.

I have another concern now: my husband is a very-much-lapsed Catholic (he says it never ‘took’ with him). The other night I dared to finally tell him that I agreed with all the teachings of the Church, including the ones about women not being priests, and their disapproval of same-sex marriages. Well, he called me a Nazi, said I was intolerant, and that if Jesus were here on earth today he (my husband) could not believe that Jesus would be so intolerant as to say ‘women can’t be priests in my church’ or that Christ would condemn homosexuals for doing what is natural for them.

I feel terrible. I’m no good at debating. I still believe in the Church teachings, but what does one say to someone who insists the Church is intolerant? I’ve given him the reasons for why women can’t be priests, but my husband just sweepingly discounts them (‘that’s just ridiculous, anyone who says someone should be excluded because of what they naturally are, is intolerant’).

I don’t try to force my beliefs on him, nor do I call him intolerant because of his attitude. If I do point out that I don’t call him intolerant because he doesn’t agree with me, he says I’m just making it personal.

Any advice? (don’t tell me to leave him, I am convinced that God put us together)
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Right now the best thing would be to pray for him. Debating him is not a good option at the moment because it will only make him stubborn and defensive. I cannot remember if you said you were new to the faith or a revert, but if you have recently become devout, it is going to be an adjustment for your husband to get used to the ‘new you.’ Give him time. Some devout and pious husbands or wives have a real cross to bear in an unbelieving spouse who rejects, ridicules, and/or attempts to dissuade them from the Faith. Stay strong and on course, and strike up a prayer relationship to St. Monica. Both her husband and St. Augustine, her son, were unbelievers and she prayed for them for many years until they came back to God. He will draw your husband to him when the time for conversion is right, if it is His will. In the meantime, strengthen your own faith by the Sacraments, prayer and doing God’s will in everyday things. Good luck to you!
 
Roman Catholic runs mixed group…
Group doesn’t seem Christian enough…
Who’s fault is it? Well you take the easy option and blame the protestants rather than the Roman Catholic who leads and guides the group. :rolleyes:

Here’s another example:
Man drives car with four women as passengers.
Car is driven off a cliff.
Who’s fault is it? Well I’m guessing you would blame the women, right?

Yes those of us non-Romans out here realise that a lot of Roman theology is based squarely and truly on the Bible, we know (this is going to blow you mind) and we even AGREE with you guys on a lot (if not the majority of stuff)!!! :eek:

HOWEVER… We don’t agree with everything the Roman Catholic Church teaches and even feel that some of it (small parts though major issues) disagree with the Word of God which we feel trumps tradition and everything else.

Maybe if you would be better objectively looking at the problem with your current group rather than just blaming prods and moving somewhere else.
 
ksjpublish said:
Any advice? (don’t tell me to leave him, I am convinced that God put us together)
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I don’t think anyone on here would DREAM of telling you to leave your husband, marriage is a sacrament after all and indissoluble.

If your husband is going to constantly criticise your faith and generally cause you problems, perhaps you should point out that just as you respect his faith he should respect yours? That doesn’t mean you can’t have disagreements or debates but it does mean neither of you should be going after the other all the time.

As regards proof for the Church’s teachings, may I recommend Scripture Catholic? You can view it here It contains many well thought out arguments defending the Churches doctrines with a long list of authorities that back up these doctrines both from tradition and the bible.

Lastly if I may point out the view that ALL intolerance is wrong, is self-evidently absurd. For example no one is going to argue that we should tolerate criminals and not send them to prison? Or tolerate drug addicts and drunk’s and not try and help them? Also ironically the view that all intolerance is wrong is also intolerant.
 
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