Funeral Question

[ALLFORHIM]

Hi All,

I was wondering if there are any rules that the CC has that would cause a refusal of someone not being able to have a catholic funeral?

Thanks

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

Hi All,

I was wondering if there are any rules that the CC has that would cause a refusal of someone not being able to have a catholic funeral?

Thanks

Some pastors will refuse a Catholic funeral to anyone who is/was not a registered member of their parish. (Therefore they know nothing about the person.) A person who was a known Catholic but not practicing, Married outside the Church, Etc is sometimes an issue.

 

[ALLFORHIM]

Some pastors will refuse a Catholic funeral to anyone who is/was not a registered member of their parish. (Therefore they know nothing about the person.) A person who was a known Catholic but not practicing, Married outside the Church, Etc is sometimes an issue.

Do you think if someone was baptized in that parish but has not returned since he was 18 and is now 53–do you think he would be able to have a funeral service?

He also plows their driveway in the winter I think he has a good relationship with the priest even though he doesnt go to church.

 

[Tantum_ergo]

Are there ever any cases in a Protestant denomination where a Protestant of that denomination can be denied a burial in his/her church?

What about former members? Shunned members (Witnesses, Amish, Mennonite, etc.?) Members who were found to be ‘witches’? Members found guilty of capital crimes?

I have heard that Churches (not ‘just’ Catholic but Prostestant as well) in times past also refused burials to people who had committed suicide.

And there are Protestant and Catholic churches which refuse to perform baptisms for certain people, or weddings. . .

It is my understanding that a group or organization has a right to make its own rules, and to insist that members abide by the rules.

I do not think that the Catholic Church (or those Protestant churches I spoke of above) somehow “DENIED PEOPLE THEIR RIGHTS”.

If the intent of the question is just to learn how much Catholic churches and Protestant churches are similar, in that both groups do have their ‘own’ rules–yes, even those churches that claim to be ‘all inclusive’. . .they may ‘take you in’ but disobey the rules and you will be shown the door, so to speak. . .more in sorrow than in anger, but still shown the door. . . that’s fine.

But I do TRUST that it won’t become another Atemi (I mean, opportunity) to Catholic bash a la , “You mean your Church would DENY SOME POOR SOUL the opportunity for XXXX?”

 

[Tantum_ergo]

I’d encourage him to talk to his family and the priest, so that there are people who know his wishes. God bless.

 

[ALLFORHIM]

I’d encourage him to talk to his family and the priest, so that there are people who know his wishes. God bless.

That is easier said then done. He is a very difficult person to talk to. Most people are afraid of him. His wife may or may not know. They dont really ever talk.

Im just hoping that the church he grew up in will allow a funeral for him. It would be a traumatic heartbreak for his parents if their church (which they have been attending for over 55 years)rejected their son.

Honestly, it would throw me into a tailspin as well.

That is why I was wondering so I could prepare myself if it should happen.

 

[LilyM]

That is easier said then done. He is a very difficult person to talk to. Most people are afraid of him. His wife may or may not know. They dont really ever talk.

Im just hoping that the church he grew up in will allow a funeral for him. It would be a traumatic heartbreak for his parents if their church (which they have been attending for over 55 years)rejected their son.

Honestly, it would throw me into a tailspin as well.

That is why I was wondering so I could prepare myself if it should happen.

Perhaps the parents or the wife could talk to the priest about the possibility at least, then they could consider how to discuss it with him if the priest says it’s OK. For their sake at least he may well be willing to do so.

Does anyone know his wishes though? If HE is against having a Catholic funeral that’s a different matter - it’d be him rejecting the church, not them rejecting him.

Is the question arising because he is ill and likely to die soon? If not, most likely the parents will go before him in any event.

 

[ALLFORHIM]

Perhaps the parents or the wife could talk to the priest about the possibility at least, then they could consider how to discuss it with him if the priest says it’s OK. For their sake at least he may well be willing to do so.

Does anyone know his wishes though? If HE is against having a Catholic funeral that’s a different matter - it’d be him rejecting the church, not them rejecting him.

Is the question arising because he is ill and likely to die soon? If not, most likely the parents will go before him in any event.

Hi,

Actually he probably expects a catholic funeral because that is the only church he has ever known.

His parents may have spoken with the priest Im not sure. No one really wants to talk about it,

He has cancer and will be undergoing a stem cell transplant that could kill him. Apparently the procedure itself is very dangerous He told me today he may not be coming out of the hospital.

His 2 brothers seem to be the closest match(one is my hubby) and have been retested to see which one will be the donor.

He has been on chemo for 4 years straight and honestly I think he wants to die. He has just had it. Im just not feeling very positive about the situation. I believe he goes into the hospital in 3 weeks for the procedure. Please pray for him and his family.

 

[LilyM]

Hi,

Actually he probably expects a catholic funeral because that is the only church he has ever known.

His parents may have spoken with the priest Im not sure. No one really wants to talk about it,

He has cancer and will be undergoing a stem cell transplant that could kill him. Apparently the procedure itself is very dangerous He told me today he may not be coming out of the hospital.

His 2 brothers seem to be the closest match(one is my hubby) and have been retested to see which one will be the donor.

He has been on chemo for 4 years straight and honestly I think he wants to die. He has just had it. Im just not feeling very positive about the situation. I believe he goes into the hospital in 3 weeks for the procedure. Please pray for him and his family.

Absolutely, everyone involved has my prayers

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

Do you think if someone was baptized in that parish but has not returned since he was 18 and is now 53–do you think he would be able to have a funeral service?

He also plows their driveway in the winter I think he has a good relationship with the priest even though he doesnt go to church.

God would probably prefer him to come inside, instead of remaining outside plowing the driveway.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

That is easier said then done. He is a very difficult person to talk to. Most people are afraid of him. His wife may or may not know. They dont really ever talk.

Im just hoping that the church he grew up in will allow a funeral for him. It would be a traumatic heartbreak for his parents if their church (which they have been attending for over 55 years)rejected their son.

Honestly, it would throw me into a tailspin as well.

That is why I was wondering so I could prepare myself if it should happen.

Remember that the Funeral Rites and Mass if celebrated not only benefit the soul of the person who has died, but also helps the family. I’m sure if his parents requested the funeral Rites, and his parents are active Catholics in the parish, I don’t see the pastor saying no.

 

[ALLFORHIM]

God would probably prefer him to come inside, instead of remaining outside plowing the driveway.

 

[ALLFORHIM]

Remember that the Funeral Rites and Mass if celebrated not only benefit the soul of the person who has died, but also helps the family. I’m sure if his parents requested the funeral Rites, and his parents are active Catholics in the parish, I don’t see the pastor saying no.

Yes they are active so Im hoping it will be fine if needed. Hoefully God’s Will is to have him survive this so he can give his life over to Christ before he dies. That has been my prayer anyway.

 

[rciadan]

Are you referring to a Funeral Mass or a Memorial Service? The two are quite different.

You cannnot have a funeral Mass if the remains have been cremated.

If your friend has a good relationship with the priest it would be a good thing to encourage him to speak with his friend about these end of life issues.

I know that my pastor gets quite frustrated at times because he is often the last to be informed when a parishioner has passed. There are certian Canonical restrictions to having a funeral Mass. Very often the funeral home, in the interest of getting the job done quickly with as few “man hours”, as possible convinces the family to allow things that they later find are obstacles to the deceased receiving a funeral Mass.

This could be the 2X4 God is using to get your friend to come out of the cold and into the warm fires of His all consuming Love…

 

[ALLFORHIM]

Are you referring to a Funeral Mass or a Memorial Service? The two are quite different.

I agree. I just hope it is God’s will that he survives.

 

[PhilotheaZ]

You cannnot have a funeral Mass if the remains have been cremated.

This rule has been changed. Cremation is allowed by the Church now, and a Mass of Christian burial is encouraged.

Catechism #2301: “The Church permits cremation, provided that it does not demonstrate a denial of faith in the resurrection of the body.”

Parishes (or dioceses) differ in their policies as to whether the cremains may be present at the funeral Mass. I have attended several Catholic funeral Masses with cremains present.

 

[1ke]

According to Canon Law, it seems he would not be denied a funeral in his parish church. Here are the relevant canons from Canon Law:

ECCLESIASTICAL FUNERALS (Cann. 1176 - 1185)

Can. 1176 §1. Deceased members of the Christian faithful must be given ecclesiastical funerals according to the norm of law.

§2. Ecclesiastical funerals, by which the Church seeks spiritual support for the deceased, honors their bodies, and at the same time brings the solace of hope to the living, must be celebrated according to the norm of the liturgical laws.

§3. The Church earnestly recommends that the pious custom of burying the bodies of the deceased be observed; nevertheless, the Church does not prohibit cremation unless it was chosen for reasons contrary to Christian doctrine.

THE CELEBRATION OF FUNERALS

Can. 1177 §1. A funeral for any deceased member of the faithful must generally be celebrated in his or her parish church.

§2. Any member of the faithful or those competent to take care of the funeral of a deceased member of the faithful are permitted to choose another church for the funeral rite with the consent of the person who governs it and after no-tification of the proper pastor of the deceased.

§3. If a death occurred outside the person’s own parish, and the body was not transferred to it nor another church legitimately chosen for the funeral rite, the funeral is to be celebrated in the church of the parish where the death occurred unless particular law has designated another church.

Can. 1178 The funeral of a diocesan bishop is to be celebrated in his own cathedral church unless he has chosen another church.

Can. 1179 The funerals of religious or members of a society of apostolic life are generally to be celebrated in their own church or oratory by the superior if the institute or society is clerical; otherwise by the chaplain.

Can. 1180 §1. If a parish has its own cemetery, the deceased members of the faithful must be buried in it unless the deceased or those competent to take care of the burial of the deceased have chosen another cemetery legitimately.§2. Everyone, however, is permitted to choose the cemetery of burial unless prohibited by law.

Can. 1181 Regarding offerings on the occasion of funeral rites, the prescripts of can. 1264 are to be observed, with the caution, however, that there is to be no favoritism toward persons in funerals and that the poor are not deprived of fitting funerals.

Can. 1182 When the burial has been completed, a record is to be made in the register of deaths according to the norm of particular law.

THOSE TO WHOM ECCLESIASTICAL FUNERALS MUST BE GRANTED OR DENIED

Can. 1183 §1. When it concerns funerals, catechumens must be counted among the Christian faithful.

§2. The local ordinary can permit children whom the parents intended to baptize but who died before baptism to be given ecclesiastical funerals.

§3. In the prudent judgment of the local ordinary, ecclesiastical funerals can be granted to baptized persons who are enrolled in a non-Catholic Church or ecclesial community unless their intention is evidently to the contrary and provided that their own minister is not available.

Can. 1184 §1. Unless they gave some signs of repentance before death, the following must be deprived of ecclesiastical funerals:

1/ notorious apostates, heretics, and schismatics;

2/ those who chose the cremation of their bodies for reasons contrary to Christian faith;

3/ other manifest sinners who cannot be granted ecclesiastical funerals without public scandal of the faithful.

§2. If any doubt occurs, the local ordinary is to be consulted, and his judgment must be followed.

Can. 1185 Any funeral Mass must also be denied a person who is excluded from ecclesiastical funerals.

 

[ALLFORHIM]

According to Canon Law, it seems he would not be denied a funeral in his parish church. Here are the relevant canons from Canon Law:

ECCLESIASTICAL FUNERALS (Cann. 1176 - 1185)

Can. 1176 §1. Deceased members of the Christian faithful must be given ecclesiastical funerals according to the norm of law.

§2. Ecclesiastical funerals, by which the Church seeks spiritual support for the deceased, honors their bodies, and at the same time brings the solace of hope to the living, must be celebrated according to the norm of the liturgical laws.

§3. The Church earnestly recommends that the pious custom of burying the bodies of the deceased be observed; nevertheless, the Church does not prohibit cremation unless it was chosen for reasons contrary to Christian doctrine.

THE CELEBRATION OF FUNERALS

Can. 1177 §1. A funeral for any deceased member of the faithful must generally be celebrated in his or her parish church.

§2. Any member of the faithful or those competent to take care of the funeral of a deceased member of the faithful are permitted to choose another church for the funeral rite with the consent of the person who governs it and after no-tification of the proper pastor of the deceased.

§3. If a death occurred outside the person’s own parish, and the body was not transferred to it nor another church legitimately chosen for the funeral rite, the funeral is to be celebrated in the church of the parish where the death occurred unless particular law has designated another church.

Can. 1178 The funeral of a diocesan bishop is to be celebrated in his own cathedral church unless he has chosen another church.

Can. 1179 The funerals of religious or members of a society of apostolic life are generally to be celebrated in their own church or oratory by the superior if the institute or society is clerical; otherwise by the chaplain.

Can. 1180 §1. If a parish has its own cemetery, the deceased members of the faithful must be buried in it unless the deceased or those competent to take care of the burial of the deceased have chosen another cemetery legitimately.§2. Everyone, however, is permitted to choose the cemetery of burial unless prohibited by law.

Can. 1181 Regarding offerings on the occasion of funeral rites, the prescripts of can. 1264 are to be observed, with the caution, however, that there is to be no favoritism toward persons in funerals and that the poor are not deprived of fitting funerals.

Can. 1182 When the burial has been completed, a record is to be made in the register of deaths according to the norm of particular law.

THOSE TO WHOM ECCLESIASTICAL FUNERALS MUST BE GRANTED OR DENIED

Can. 1183 §1. When it concerns funerals, catechumens must be counted among the Christian faithful.

§2. The local ordinary can permit children whom the parents intended to baptize but who died before baptism to be given ecclesiastical funerals.

§3. In the prudent judgment of the local ordinary, ecclesiastical funerals can be granted to baptized persons who are enrolled in a non-Catholic Church or ecclesial community unless their intention is evidently to the contrary and provided that their own minister is not available.

Can. 1184 §1. Unless they gave some signs of repentance before death, the following must be deprived of ecclesiastical funerals:

1/ notorious apostates, heretics, and schismatics;

2/ those who chose the cremation of their bodies for reasons contrary to Christian faith;

3/ other manifest sinners who cannot be granted ecclesiastical funerals without public scandal of the faithful.

§2. If any doubt occurs, the local ordinary is to be consulted, and his judgment must be followed.

Can. 1185 Any funeral Mass must also be denied a person who is excluded from ecclesiastical funerals.

Thank you:thumbsup: I feel much better now–well except for the fact that my BIL might not make it.

 

[rciadan]

This rule has been changed. Cremation is allowed by the Church now, and a Mass of Christian burial is encouraged.

Catechism #2301: “The Church permits cremation, provided that it does not demonstrate a denial of faith in the resurrection of the body.”

Parishes (or dioceses) differ in their policies as to whether the cremains may be present at the funeral Mass. I have attended several Catholic funeral Masses with cremains present.

A recent statement has clarified this and cremated remains may not eceive a funeral Mass.

 

[ALLFORHIM]

A recent statement has clarified this and cremated remains may not eceive a funeral Mass.

Why?