Gay Marriage (A Different Perspective)

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SHW said:
I think that the “ordinary American citizen” as being God-fearing is now “past tense.” I think that more than 50% of American citizens are no longer concerned with pleasing God instead of self.

Most persons are but “sheeple” and follow the “cultural elite” in whatever they “preach.” These cultural elite own the media and therefore preach to Americans every day and most people do not think for themselves so they are easily fooled by this false teaching.

How many of those persons, who claimed to be “Catholic” when polled by Gallop and Pew, etc. and also voted for Obama, are actually “true” Catholics who follow the pope and magisterium in its teachings? I would guess “very few.” I do not think that our country is predominately Christian any longer. Otherwise, they would not be watching TV shows such as “Desperate Housewives” and “Two and a Half Men.” :rolleyes:
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It is appropriate to mention that profoundly dysfunctional and immoral chracters fill the media. It would be a good idea for Catholics to realize that your television is no longer a worthwhile guest in your home.

Even in newspapers, there are those that promote an agenda by telling people they are “narrow-minded” if they do not approve of certain alternative lifestyles.

Look to Jesus Christ for your role model and have faith and hope. Encourage each other.

Peace,
Ed
 
Alisa said:
Just for the record, I am a Roman Catholic, my husband is a Roman Catholic, and our children and grandchildren are. We live by Catholic principles and guidelines, and there are lots of us in our family.

If others in this country or others view things differently – then it is up to us to live even more as Catholic Christians, in the hope that we might be of help to others who disagree with us.

I think the problem is that those of us who post on CAF disagree on the most effective methods of attracting others to our faith. I’ve found that our way – that of living the best lives we can according to God’s directions – is very effective indeed. For example, recently my husband and I were having lunch in a restaurant with one of our sons, his wife, and their children. When we joined our hands around the table and thanked God for the food we were about to eat, several people expressed interest and asked what religion we were. A tiny step in attracting others – but a step nonetheless.

Alisa
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There are many ways to reach people for Christ. There are those who stand in front of abortion clinics, those who engage people on the street, usually with booklets explaining the faith. I work in the media and it currently favors the pagan, the immoral and especially perverted (non-family) sexuality.

I would point out that the ‘popular culture’ of the 1960s was not like this. I liked and could relate to the characters I saw on TV shows. It was possible to go to a dinner and a movie, without the movie offending your Catholic sensibilities. So it was the media that slowly poisoned Christian culture in America. It took 40 years but now we are seeing the fruit of it.

America has also seen great revivals. Be a part of it.

Peace,
Ed
 
was not harvey milk murdered by his own kind he asks with trepidation…hate crime. What is a second class citizen…why maybe its a Christian who is treated with hate and distain in movies and teevee sitcoms…how many homosexual/lesbian sitcoms and flicks do we see…Hitler was a homosexual but also a vegetarian and a dog lover…so what,that does not make him a mat.idol in itself…he also had a weird stach and walk! Who cares if people who have a mommy or daddy complex.live together…we saw that in the odd couple…Felix was the stero female…weird,did the cooking,a clean freak,temper tantums,Oscar was the typical hollweird male,dirty,sports ,sloppy etc…so what…but if by legalizing marriage does it mean now homosexuals must be allowed to be boyscoutmasters…how utterly charming…this will of course destroy the scout movement which is what the aclu and the above want…we cant ,simply cant have an organization started by the great Teddy Roosevelt to exist anylonger…we are in a brave new world of paganism…ie.consumerism…if a hetero goes to a whore and picks up VD etc…let him pay for the half cure…and if a Homo picks up Aids …let him pay for it…etc etc…sure let whomever live together…but will we now have to listen to the mormons and have two,three or more wifes…gawd the nylon stockings hanging in the bathroom…and what about love…how about marryin a plant or animal…dont smirk…if person can be changed from the amendment outlawing slavery to now meaning,not a devoloping baby…anything is possible with these dysfunctional elitists who control our media…all the best…forget the above and lets wave the flag and shop early…
 
FromTheCrossroa said:
This is NOT the same thing as people born different who want to be left alone and do the best they can with the cards they were dealt.
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I don’t know how many of my posts you’ve read, but in one I stated that I had heard that argument 40 years ago. If all that you want is to be left alone, where did homosexuality in children’s literature for public schools come from? [Of course, courts, ever so eager to implement academia’s latest cause célèbre, prohibited parents from opting their children out of homosexual indoctrination. How is that for leaving people alone?] And, why are we arguing homosexual “marriage”? Did these things just drop from the sky? No. They are a result of political activity by a few homosexuals bent on forcing their ideas on everyone else. If all you wanted was to be left alone, no one would have a problem. The problem is you want more than “to be left alone”; you want the souls of those in society who are refusing to bow to this outrageous demand.

As far as “doing the best they can with the cards they were dealt,” homosexuals are not complaining about being denied the right to vote, nor the right to own property, nor to be able to live together, nor being forced into ghettos; they have a higher level of education than average Americans; and they have a higher level of income than average. Sounds like they are doing a lot better than most people.

BTW, monogamy among sodomites is a myth.
 
sedonaman said:
Ever notice that this question never gets asked of the secularist such as Corvino] who is trying to force his ideas on society? He even admits it! Can you imagine the uproar if a Catholic ever said something like that?

We must realized that in the end, all laws are someone’s imposition on society what his beliefs of right and wrong are. That’s why politicians work so hard to get elected and write laws.
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True, and since when does the minority rule? When the protected class clause goes into effect?
 
Nino said:
…and what about love…how about marryin a plant or animal…dont smirk…anything is possible with these dysfunctional elitists who control our media…all the best…
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Last year [don’t laugh] the TV showed a woman in Canada who married herself !!! [Apparently, it’s legal there.] She was all decked out in a bridal dress. She said she was even going on a honeymoon [alone, of course] to “get in touch with herself.” I leave to you to figure that out.
 
Alisa said:
“Tyranny” – Fix, do you mean that when our nation votes on an issue and the vote goes against our beliefs as Catholics, that it actually could be given a term like that? I thought the process of voting on an issue was called “Democracy in action”?
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By tyranny I mean that of relativism and I mean that which fails to protect innocent babies from destruction and that which fails to protect marriage. If that is not a tyranny I do not know what is.
Or are you speaking of the tyranny of “the devil” or something along those lines? We are far stronger than that – aren’t we?
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The pope refers to this as the dictatorship of relativism. Not all understanding of truth is equal.
If something is voted in or out, the American people have spoken. We as Catholic Christians are still free to live our lives as we believe God has instructed us to do.
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And the babies? Do they get to live as they desire?
Vote for Catholic principles, absolutely! Hold sit-ins or marches or whatever else – that is our right if we choose to go that route.
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I’ve always felt that non-Christians will know us by our example rather than by our proselytizing – just my opinion. I find it’s worked in my own long life, and I believe that’s why our own four adult children are now raising their little ones in a very similar fashion. It’s because they’ve had a lifelong witness to the beliefs my husband and I hold dear to our hearts and have lived out.
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Alisa
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My point is that a big part of living our faith is not only what we do in private but how we act in public that includes voting and law-making.
 
Alisa said:
“Tyranny” – Fix, do you mean that when our nation votes on an issue and the vote goes against our beliefs as Catholics, that it actually could be given a term like that? I thought the process of voting on an issue was called “Democracy in action”?
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Haven’t you ever heard of the “tyranny of the majority”? Just because something has a majority support doesn’t make it moral [Christ was crucified because a majority wanted him dead].

I commend you on your setting a good example, but it doesn’t appear that you recognize that Catholics have an obligation to work to get unjust laws changed. For example, if slavery were legal today, we’d have an obligation to try to get it abolished.
 
sedonaman said:
Haven’t you ever heard of the “tyranny of the majority”? Just because something has a majority support doesn’t make it moral [Christ was crucified because a majority wanted him dead].

I commend you on your setting a good example, but it doesn’t appear that you recognize that Catholics have an obligation to work to get unjust laws changed. For example, if slavery were legal today, we’d have an obligation to try to get it abolished.
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I believe the majority of people do not believe in homosexual marriage.
 
sedonaman said:
…homosexuals are not complaining about being denied the right to vote, nor the right to own property, nor to be able to live together, nor being forced into ghettos; they have a higher level of education than average Americans; and they have a higher level of income than average.
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And this is precisely because (noting the areas of rights sedonaman names) they are entitled to these civil rights, not the “right” of marriage, which is not a civil right.
 
Alisa said:
If something is voted in or out, the American people have spoken. We as Catholic Christians are still free to live our lives as we believe God has instructed us to do.
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The “American” Catholic people may someday soon find that the practice of their religion to be judged illegal in the USA and this can easily be done through the courts by judging that our Bible foments “hate” towards homosexuals(sodomites), adulterers and fornicators by claiming that they will not inherit eternal life/kingdom of God. (1 Corinthians 6:9-10) When and if this happens, then we will no longer be “free” to live our lives as we believe God has instructed us to. Instead, we will be like the early Christians who had to meet secretly in order to avoid imprisonment and death. And we will be “given up” to the “authorities” by former friends and neighbors.
 
Elizabeth502 said:
You are so off-base it’s amazing. There is no civil right called marriage. None.

As to the ramblings about the education system (?) and priestly sexual abuse, those are off-topic.

Children have a natural right to parents of two different genders, just as biology provides for the animal kingdom, of which, actually, humans are members.
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Speaking of “rights”, where is your statement of rights found in civil law? THAT is what we are discussing, civil law. We are not discussing religious law, tradition, or any other family value that has no basis whatsoever in secular laws.
 
ladybri77 said:
True, and since when does the minority rule? When the protected class clause goes into effect?
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Neither “rule” and that is the point I am trying to make. Each side respects the others choice or tradition and the right to choose differently. The use of civil law to enforce a belief, choice or tradition on someone else results in the other person to be deprived of the God given right of to choose. Our country was founded on this singular principle enumerated in the bill of rights within our Constitution. The tenth being most important stating that all other powers (freedoms, rights) are reserved to the individual. This was something that religious and secular educated men once agreed upon.
 
FromTheCrossroa said:
Speaking of “rights”, where is your statement of rights found in civil law? THAT is what we are discussing, civil law. We are not discussing religious law, tradition, or any other family value that has no basis whatsoever in secular laws.
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Where do you thinks rights come from?
 
You sound like a great human being, Ed. I agree – there are many ways to bring people to Christ. I agree with you about movies and TV. We rarely go to movies these days, and when I accidentally watched part of “2-1/2 Men,” or whatever it’s called, the other day, I could not BELIEVE it. I find the best way to have a show discontinued is not to watch it and to boycott whatever products are sponsoring the show.

Don’t you think things will swing back eventually? They usually do, but hopefully in our lifetime!

Alisa
 
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