Gay marriage is a civil right

  • Thread starter Thread starter Magnanimity
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
All those other countries made their move toward gay marriage about the same time this country made its. If you are going to argue that the past practice of the human race is not a model we should follow, then neither can you argue by your own logic that the current practice of other nations can be a model, right?
I argued nothing, I merely posed the question. Looking at most cultures worldwide, polygamy seems to be the most common form of marriage, followed by monogamy (whether serial or not) and then polyandry.
So we are back to the fundamental question: Isn’t homosexual marriage a type of criminal lunacy that, as Plato and Jefferson would have argued, deserves to be punished rather than to be accorded civil legitimacy?
I doubt it. Here in the UK, Civil Partnerships were a one day wonder and disappeared from the headlines very quickly. They only reappear if a celebrity or an MP is involved.

rossum
 
That’s not what the founders of the USA thought:

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that **they are endowed by their Creator **with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.

One of the rights men are endowed by their Creator (God) with is not the right to marry someone of the same gender. Western Civilization is built on a Judeo-Christian moral framework. Atheists and homosexuals (often the same people) want to deny that, and in the process tear down the moral framework of Western Civilization. They want to remove God, because as Dostoevski had Ivan Karamazov claim, “If there is no God, everything is permitted.”

That a thing so perverse as homosexual marriage is even being publicly discussed shows just how far we have fallen as a culture.
The founders of the USA ( Deists at best, not Christians) wouldn’t be too pleased if they knew that their ideas would be used to discriminate and alienate a minority group of persons.

The only people who insist that America is a Christian nation, are the Christians. :rolleyes:
 
The founders of the USA ( Deists at best, not Christians) wouldn’t be too pleased if they knew that their ideas would be used to discriminate and alienate a minority group of persons.

The only people who insist that America is a Christian nation, are the Christians. :rolleyes:
America is hardly a Christian nation. Let’s see…legalized abortion…euthanasia…gay marriage…etc etc.

See…we agree.
 
It’s not a legal secular crime and shouldn’t be. It’s a crime against God. And that’s what counts.
That is what I have been trying to get across; thank you
It’s not a legal secular crime and shouldn’t be. It’s a crime against God. And that’s what counts.
I agree; however I agree simply because I am Catholic. But an Atheist who does not believe in God and therefore couldn’t possibly take the Bible as anything more entertaining as Harry Potters next adventure with the sky fairies wearing a cloak of invisibility, couldn’t care less

People, look outside the window; you won’t see camels in the sand but great big metal birds hurtling into space at speeds greater than your imagination, seeking other intelligent life; and the Catholics didn’t build these for we were far too busy squabbling about the homosexuals
 
Alexia

And which ‘society’ should be framing these laws? The 6% Catholic ‘society’ or 100% of the society?

Obviously, we are not talking about laws at all. We are talking about institutionalizing gay marriage (what would have been regarded 50 years ago as a laughable form of lunacy) as a civil right.

I don’t think lunacies should enjoy civil rights. I don’t think Catholics are the only people who think this way. While I am not for criminalizing such lunacies, I am also not for honoring them in the civil law. I think most people agree, and religion has nothing to do with it.

Please stop trying to make the Catholic Church the villain. Neither Plato nor Jefferson were Catholics, and they believed sodomy was a punishable crime against nature. How many times does this have to be pointed out to you before you see your straw man fallacy? 😃

I agree; however I agree simply because I am Catholic. But an Atheist who does not believe in God and therefore couldn’t possibly take the Bible as anything more entertaining as Harry Potters next adventure with the sky fairies wearing a cloak of invisibility, couldn’t care less

Why don’t you see that in all probability the atheist could see the absurdity of homosexual marriage just as much as the Catholic? Many atheists have morals and
common sense.
 
If a society does decide to legalize Gay marriage then so be it, but while the debate rages we can certainly have our opinions on it, and we can fight it all we want to. Like i have said before we can gather as much testimony as we want to show that homosexuality is not right. We have God for if he exists (which he does) he designed marriage to be a union between a male and female, Second we have Nature we are designed by nature to be heterosexual, think about this a little more, two men together having sex means that a man is penetrating the opening designed by nature to expel feces or in other words the opening made to expel death and decay from the body and this produces unhealthy results and many times death, but when a man and a women have proper sexual relations a child is born or the result is life. Obviously this is what nature intended, unless you believe in evolution then maybe homosexual men’s anuses might be evolving into vaginas then we could say it is within the scope of nature. (sorry for being gross i am not trying to be crass) but don’t take my word on whether or not nature has designed it this way (and remember that God really created and designed nature but if you are atheist then you stop at nature but if he did exist we could see his will in this matter through what has been designed) take a gander at what medical professionals say

“From a medical standpoint anal intercourse, in contrast to vaginal intercourse, poses serious risk to its participants. The rectum differs from the vagina with respect to suitability for penetration by a penis, limb or inanimate object (Agnew, 1985; Diggs, 2002; Koop, 1990). The vagina is designed to expand, is supported by a network of muscles and produces natural lubricants. It is composed of a mucus membrane with a multi-stratified squamous epithelium that allows it to endure friction without damage. The anus, in contrast, is designed to allow passage of fecal material out of the body. It is composed of small muscles and significantly more delicate tissues. Consequently, anal intercourse often results in anorectal trauma, hemorrhoids and anal fissures. With repeated trauma, friction and stretching, the anal sphincter loses its tone. Chronic leakage of fecal material has been known to develop from penile/anal intercourse alone; for those engaging in fisting this is a more common problem (Agnew, 1985; Diggs, 2002; Wolfe, 2000).”

So we have God and Nature’s design as being against the homosexual position as defined by these medical professionals. We also have the history of man-kind which even in societies such as Greece or Rome who had homosexual practices and it was widely accepted, still defined marriage as between a man and a woman. So the most homosexually saturated societies still defined marriage as between a man and a woman and any other sexual practices were in addition to marriage i.e pederasty sodomy and orgies. Common sense tells us these truths. We have to commit our reason to the toilet in order to accept homosexuality as being proper. The behavior of homosexual persons in general gives evidence that they themselves are insecure in their decision to be gay (see previous post #86). Man’s traditional concept of morality does include restrictions on certain sexual behavior and in general all systems of morality except hedonism are against homosexuality and most religions agree.

So here is all that has to bow down to to this redefinition of marriage, God, Religion, Nature, Morality, Commonsense, History, and the majority of Mankind all so that a few people can chafe away at the traditional and accepted standard of marriage so that they can feel better about themselves in their homosexuality.

Look at the fruits of Homosexuality and other Sexual perversions. The fruits have been WIDESPREAD death and sickness! they used to call AIDS GRIDS for Gay Related Immunity Deficiency Syndrome! because nearly all the population that had this disease were homosexuals! When i volunteered to work at Life Long Aids Alliance in Seattle nearly all the people that we served who had AIDS were gay men! Many think that AIDS started through these perverse acts whether it was homosexuality or those practicing bestiality. The list of utterly disgusting behaviors that often accompany homosexual behavior is long and fowl, and time would fail us to discuss them all. Lets just say i don’t envy doctors who have to waste their time fishing out barbie doll heads and other objects out gay men’s anuses or treating men who have ruptures in there anuses and intestines from fisting each other just because they were “born” with those tendencies and can’t control themselves. Please forgive me for being gross i am simply trying to point out that these behaviors are unnatural and are the product of perverse minds. Surely driving one’s fist and forearm up the anus of anyone is a crime against nature and is damaging to the individuals who practices it. Homosexuality or any sexually deviant behavior has produced nothing good for society historically whether in recent history or ancient history. Governments should be more astute in there observations, if they were they would recognize that it is in societies best interest as a whole to stick within the normal scope of marriage and sexuality.
 
One of the rights men are endowed by their Creator (God) with is not the right to marry someone of the same gender.
No, but the “persuit of happiness” is. And to some, that means marrying a partner of the same gender!
They want to remove God, because as Dostoevski had Ivan Karamazov claim, “If there is no God, everything is permitted.”
That’s not true. If you base your morals on an aincent text of unreliable sources, you are in for a lot of trouble. Take God out of the picture, and everything does not fall apart.
We (athiests, or most athiests) base our ethics on the potential harm (or lack thereof) that arises from a particular action or lack of action. Simplicity at it’s finest. Not everything is permitted - things that cause harm are not permitted in a legal system based on those ethics. Since gay marriage causes no harm, it is permitted.
If they meet this Deity, a prediction that at best is highly improbable.
And you base your supposition on?

The fact that the evidence to suggest that there is a God is flakey at best. Christians themselves cannot even agree on what the Bible really says. God is just a figment of the imagination that has been passed down through the centuries through a campaign of brainwashing to try to force people to fall in line. Only now, more people are starting to realise this fact, and start to actually ask questions and put this superstition to test. And those that do completely open their eyes and their minds come to the realization that a belief in a supernatural all-powerful entity is simply foolish.
Here you are telling me about your version of God, but on the other hand I have Muslims, Jews, Mormons, and a whole plathora of other ‘religions’ trying to tell me that their God (or Gods) is or are the right one(s) and that their aincent text is the more reliable of all the given options. So how do you answer that? How can you convince me that the God you talk about exists and why I should denounce all other ‘proof’ of other Gods? And even the proof that God doesn’t exist? How do you answer the unanswerable questions? Why does God not help amputees? There have been claims that prayre has cured cancer, and that we should accept this as “proof” that prayre works. But if we all, every single one of us went home tonight and asked through prayre for God to heal an amputee, that person’s limb will NOT grow back, now matter how hard we pray.
And the answer “God works in mysterious ways” or “God has a plan for all of us” or variations thereof are simply not good enough. Some of us need proof. Rock solid, hard evidence. Why should I ‘have faith’ that God is going to punish me for ‘sinning’ and not have faith that the Invisible Pink Unicorn on my shoulder is not going to whoop your *** for speaking against gay marriage?
“That that can be asserted without proof can be dismissed without proof”
Second we have Nature we are designed by nature to be heterosexual, think about this a little more, two men together having sex means that a man is penetrating the opening designed by nature to expel feces or in other words the opening made to expel death and decay from the body and this produces unhealthy results and many times death
How do you KNOW that nature intended us all to be heterosexual? Does that mean that the fact that homosexuals exist demonstrates a fallacy in nature? Can you really claim to know enough about nature to know for sure that homosexuals don’t exist for some other purpose? Nature has a wonderful way of balancing itself. Heterosexual sex creates life. Should we create as much life as possible? Are there not enough people in the world? Are we under populated? Do we have more than enough resources to cope with these extra people? No. So how do you know nature is not using homosexuality to balance the population crisis we are suffering, or some other similar hypothesis?
Also, were you unaware that many gay men practice other forms of sex besides anal? Were you unaware that anal sex is not limited to just gay men? What about gay women? Does anal sex -always- produce ‘unhealthy’ results? What if the partners practise safe sex?
Common sense tells us these truths. We have to commit our reason to the toilet in order to accept homosexuality as being proper
You obviously lack the common sense to realise that the “truths” are not truths at all, just narrow-minded assumptions!
The behavior of homosexual persons in general gives evidence that they themselves are insecure in their decision to be gay
This has nothing to do with a result of being gay - it is to do with the fact that society is hostile towards homosexuals.
 
The fruits have been WIDESPREAD death and sickness! they used to call AIDS GRIDS for Gay Related Immunity Deficiency Syndrome! because nearly all the population that had this disease were homosexuals!
But they don’t any more. Why? Because straight people suffer from AIDS too! By the way, did you take into account that in the past, it has been difficult, if not impossible for gay men and lesbians to seek proper medical care? Homosexuality was illegal in most places up until the 70s. Try looking at the bigger picture, not just at the WHAT but also at the WHY.
Lets just say i don’t envy doctors who have to waste their time fishing out barbie doll heads and other objects out gay men’s anuses or treating men who have ruptures in there anuses and intestines from fisting each other just because they were “born” with those tendencies and can’t control themselves
It may come as a surprise but straight men (and women!) do this sort of thing too. It’s not limited to Homogays!

Your entire post demonstrates the narrow mindedness of those who are opposed to homosexuality. “EWWW! BUM SEX! GROSS!”. It’s the kind of hogwash you would expect from kids in the playground. Not once have you considered that many gay men do not practise anal sex, or do so in a safe way that does not result in the things you have discribed. Not once have you considered the fact that anal sex is not restricted to gay men. Not once have you considered that lesbians also exist, and obviously there is no penile/anal intercourse there!
 
How do you KNOW that nature intended us all to be heterosexual? Does that mean that the fact that homosexuals exist demonstrates a fallacy in nature? Can you really claim to know enough about nature to know for sure that homosexuals don’t exist for some other purpose? Nature has a wonderful way of balancing itself. Heterosexual sex creates life. Should we create as much life as possible? Are there not enough people in the world? Are we under populated?..
Wait, you have tried this argument before. A man penetrating a woman has a true cause – to generate life. But what SPECIFIC result may arise that benefits nature by a man penetrating a man? I mean, when simply biology is being denied, this is getting ridiculous…
 
Wait, you have tried this argument before. A man penetrating a woman has a true cause – to generate life. But what SPECIFIC result may arise that benefits nature by a man penetrating a man? I mean, when simply biology is being denied, this is getting ridiculous…
Because biology is NOT simple! Wait, are you one of those people that still believes that there are only two genders (male and female) and two sets of chromosomes (XX and XY)?
Why does this have to be about what happens (or doesn’t happen) when a man penetrates a man? What about women? Hey, what about intersex people, to throw a spanner in the works?
Biology and nature are just not as simple as you make them out to be - it is naieve to assume that just because when a man and a women have sex it creates a baby, that that is the ONLY thing that nature intended and everything else is somehow a ‘crime’.
 
Ashley42

It may come as a surprise but straight men (and women!) do this sort of thing too. It’s not limited to Homogays!

Do anal sex? I fail to see your point. It doesn’t matter who does it; it’s still perverse, ugly, and not the least bit sanitary, don’t you imagine?

What homosexuals want is to defy the law of Nature and of Nature’s God.

When you can honestly say that the male organ was made for anal sex with members of either gender, I will refer you to an Anatomy 101 text that will set you straight. 👍

Until then, I think Anatomy 101 clearly cannot be used to support the absurd notion of gay marriage.

Again, we don’t need the Bible on this one; but for those who need reassurance, Paul to the Romans is instructive. Likewise the story of Sodom & Gomorrah.

Leave it and don’t look back.
 
Wait – you’re one of those people who think that there are more than two genders?:rolleyes:

(Yes, that’s right; we must use the PC terminology. Sex is body parts, and gender is “who I am inside.”)

Ashley – we have already discussed aberrations. We are talking about design (your post from today even harped on what NATURE intended).

So if a male and a female were designed to go together in order to create new life, what were these other supposed “genders” designed for?
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top