Gay Parents

[Mamamull]

We are in the process of adopting a little boy lived with two foster dads prior to coming to us.

He called one of the men “dad” and the other “daddy”.

I have to say that they weren’t parent material. The things the little guy has told us are just awful. They also – probably inadvertently – sexualized him. No four year old should know about sexual (especially homosexual) penetration. He does.

We have had to help straighten out his gender idea that boys are always boys and don’t change into girls at will.

We have had to institute many late night sessions to helping the little guy learn to fall asleep in a bed. It used to take two to five hours of patiently waiting for him to sleep. He now can fall asleep in less than hour.

Usually fear of bed has something to do sexual abuse. However, we think that he has had problems with wetting the bed and they threatened him with horror movie characters being the closet and ready to cut him up and eat him.

The best part – sarcasm – is that they had him watch the horror movies first and then threatened him with the bad guys.

We are busy with therapeutic parenting, taking him to a counselor and enrolled him in a special preschool. We thank God for holy water and have blessed his closet doors, the corners of his bed, etc to offer protection. He also loves to say “Hail Mary’s” and is getting his own Rosary for his birthday this weekend.

We have also had to work to disassociate “daddy” from the previous foster parent – when I would say “daddy is on his way home” the child would become very afraid.

 

[Werner]

AndyF:

Jesus warned he had not come for peace but to sow discord between mother and child, etc…

This passage sends the message that political correctness will be placed aside, and deception will be unhidden.

Our mandate is similar, and as it applies to children it is a disservice and deceptive to lie about a situation they find themselves in, further compounding the situation to the benefit of satan. The situation was agreed to by two individuals who because of that fact live in mortal sin. The child should know this and taught to offer the respect that is owed to adults and to receive the good they can provide, as is normal for our day to day relationship to our mothers in Christ,father,brother and sisters.

They should be taught they are guiltless concerning the relationship, but they should view their caretakers as simply this, and not accorded the distinction that the Church assigns to couples who have God’s sanction. They could be taught to pray for them and to assist them by being obedient to occasions that are not sinful.

The sad thing is that the adults will be found further accountable for their actions beyond the culpability of the sin itself, as child rearing insists the child be provided with nurturing by true mothers and fathers for their inspiration and forming of true character and spirit. This will be sorely lacking in this arrangement, that was really meant to provide for a convenience to satiate deviant sexual practices.

The child should call them by their names. No doubt he will coaxed relentlessly to do otherwise, only one of many sad situations he will find himself in has he tries to do God’s will. It is unfortunate he must fend off these misdirecting lessons, let alone fend off the added burden of satan’s temptations. His chances for coming out of this hell are not good without the added graces he will require from God, assistance by Our Blessed Mother and St. Michael.

Andy

So you are calling for destroying other people’s families?
Do you also call for kids of Non-Catholic parents to be taught their parents are heretics, infidels, will burn in hell, are damned for ever?
If you don’t why do you want to single out just gay parents?

Werner

 

[TheGarg]

Mamamull:

We are in the process of adopting a little boy lived with two foster dads prior to coming to us…

This is just a scary thought that a gay couple could be come foster parents. I pray for the end of gay adoption. The whole thought if this makes me very sad.

 

[Amie]

Werner,
I understand your desire for the homosexual lifestyle to be accepted. Everyone wants who they are and what they do to be accepted by society, so that they can live without fear of reprisal and essentially, “fit-in.” But, what I must say to you in love, and I hope you catch the love, is that the homosexual lifestyle IS sinful. Being a homosexual, in itself, is not. But, because you have a partner, I would have to say that you are most likely in mortal sin, and your soul is faced with dire consequences at this point. To not tell you this would be wrong on my part. I also cannot stand idly by and tell you that I “respect” your disbelief of the fact of homosexuality being a mortal sin either. That “respect” could lead to a very horrible eternity. Finally, also understand that it is not I who tells you so, but God himself, through His word in the bible, and His church. I am just reiterating what He said first. And God doesn’t change his opinions or viewpoints with popular opinion, and there is no other God to go to for a different answer.

God bless,
-Amy

 

[AndyF]

Werner:

So you are calling for destroying other people’s families?
Do you also call for kids of Non-Catholic parents to be taught their parents are heretics, infidels, will burn in hell, are damned for ever?
If you don’t why do you want to single out just gay parents?

Werner

*Single out *- The case presented to me was one of HS parents. If the case presented to me was of 2 thieves taking care of children, my context would be appropriate for that case.

gay parents - the world “gay” is a label and unfairly used by society. It is uninspiring and conveys hopelessness. It is a signification that it is an unchanging condition, not a changable affliction, which it is. The word parent in this context begs for further scrutiny as well.

HS is one, if not the most intense and devious temptations satan can muster and is difficult but not impossible to cure. It is made worse in the fact the afflicted is made to believe this is the way he is in his natural state. On the brighter side, it is cured by devotion to the Blessed Mother thru the Rosary, prayers to St. Michael, confession and communion and obligation to the Church. It is true that few will take the Blessed Mother up on her offer, even for the sake of giving benefit of the doubt. After all, for them this is exciting,sensual and comforting giving a false contentment. So it was for those in Sodom as well.

damned for ever? - The parents are alive because God sees hope for them. He is biding His time on lives bargained for by Christ. Anyone alive today is not damned.

Before this couple decided to stay togeather in sin it was predicted the side effects of choosing an evil life would present itself, this is not new. Jesus taught this would occur. And so this is the first of many. Step 1/ the children are restricted from stating or forced to ignore the truth. Satan does not like the truth being revealed and the child will be reprimanded. This is abnormal in a Sanctioned marriage where this is not a concern at all.

What other “side effect” do you object to? I predicted and so did everyone else who knows the compounding effect of sin.

Deja Vue.

Andy

 

[Esmeraldavale]

Werner, I’m with you. Obviously, homosexuality is not evil, or a sin, or a “disorder,” (a definition found posted by a priest elsewhere on this website!).

So many of the statements attributed to God in the bible are so contradictory, it’s easy to pull out anything you want to defend any position you want. In Exodus, we are also strictly enjoined to kill our children, if they turn away from the faith!! Welcome to fundamentalist Islam!!

The “moderate” Catholics today are just those who pick and choose what parts of the bible to expound, and what parts to ignore. It’s unfortunately still socially acceptable to bash gays, although in 20-30 years, our children will look back on homosexual discrimination as a crime of ignorance, like we now look back on racial discrimination. It won’t be long, now!

 

[Genesis315]

Esmeraldavale:

Werner, I’m with you. Obviously, homosexuality is not evil, or a sin, or a “disorder,” (a definition found posted by a priest elsewhere on this website!).

The Catechism of the Catholic Church
**
2357 Homosexuality refers to relations between men or between women who experience an exclusive or predominant sexual attraction toward persons of the same sex. It has taken a great variety of forms through the centuries and in different cultures. Its psychological genesis remains largely unexplained. Basing itself on Sacred Scripture, which presents homosexual acts as acts of grave depravity [1], tradition has always declared that “homosexual acts are intrinsically disordered [2].” They are contrary to the natural law. They close the sexual act to the gift of life. They do not proceed from a genuine affective and sexual complementarity. Under no circumstance can they be approved.

The “moderate” Catholics today are just those who pick and choose what parts of the bible to expound, and what parts to ignore.

Actually, those would be called “cafeteria” Catholics. The Church does not ignore any of the Bible. Its interpretation of it just might be different than your personal one.

It won’t be long, now!

I’m not sure if this was about society in general or the Church. If it was about the Church, it’ll never happen. The Church cannot (not just will not) change the deposit of faith and morals.**

 

[Genesis315]

On the bright side:

Catechism of the Catholic Church:

**

2358

The number of men and women who have deep-seated homosexual tendencies is not negligible.This inclination, which is objectively disordered, constitutes for most of them a trial. They must be accepted with respect, compassion, and sensitivity. Every sign of unjust discrimination in their regard should be avoided. These persons are called to fulfill God’s will in their lives and, if they are Christians, to unite to the sacrifice of the Lord’s Cross the difficulties they may encounter from their condition.
2359 Homosexual persons are called to chastity. By the virtues of self-mastery that teach them inner freedom, at times by the support of disinterested friendship, by prayer and sacramental grace, they can and should gradually and resolutely approach Christian perfection.
**

 

[Esmeraldavale]

Are you arguing with me, or just reinforcing what I said? The Catholics believe homosexuality is a disorder - much as back in biblical times, it was thought that epileptics were possessed by the devil!

And I meant that the social acceptance of prejudice against homosexuality will soon be coming to an end, as reason prevails over fear and misunderstanding.

 

[Genesis315]

Esmeraldavale:

Are you arguing with me, or just reinforcing what I said? The Catholics believe homosexuality is a disorder - And I meant that the social acceptance of prejudice against homosexuality will soon be coming to an end, as reason prevails over fear and misunderstanding.

Oh, I thought you were saying it was not a sin. According to the Church it is a sin.

back in biblical times, it was thought that epileptics were possessed by the devil!

source please.

And I meant that the social acceptance of prejudice against homosexuality will soon be coming to an end, as reason prevails over fear and misunderstanding

I think you forgot to read my post about the bright side. Who said anything about fear?

 

[SeeksTruth]

Abominations? Leviticus states that eating shellfish is an abomination. Why are we not advocating laws in the US banning the eating of shrimp? Are there different levels of abominations?

 

[km112482]

Catholic90:

Yes, Jesus taught us to love our neighbor as ourselves. However, He also told the sinners that they not only were forgiven, but to Go and Sin No More. “Being” a homosexual (a person with feelings of attraction to a same sex person) may not be wrong, but ACTING on those feelings IS a sin. The Bible says so. Period.

Ok I don’t get why I am being told off just because I said we shouldnt judge others. I know that it is wrong and once you are forgiven you should sin no more. I am just pointing out that I have no right to judge a homosexual for that matter anyone who sins. I do not mind telling them that I dont agree with their lifestyle, but I cant decided for them what they should do with their life. Therefor, I have no right to judge them. I surely would not want anyone to judge me so I dont get why I am being told off for this.

Can someone please explain to me what it is I did that was so wrong by saying we shouldnt judge others.

Kerri

 

[dawnicamar]

There are hundreds of bible verses about love, and only a few about homosexuality.

Love is the important one. Whether we think people are sinning or not is not the defining point of religion. Learning to love one another is.

 

[Genesis315]

km112482:

Ok I don’t get why I am being told off just because I said we shouldnt judge others. I know that it is wrong and once you are forgiven you should sin no more. I am just pointing out that I have no right to judge a homosexual for that matter anyone who sins. I do not mind telling them that I dont agree with their lifestyle, but I cant decided for them what they should do with their life. Therefor, I have no right to judge them. I surely would not want anyone to judge me so I dont get why I am being told off for this.

Can someone please explain to me what it is I did that was so wrong by saying we shouldnt judge others.

Kerri

Well, don’t just say you do not agree with their lifestyle. God doesn’t agree with their lifestyle, that’s what matters.

Judging whether something is a grave sin is pretty objective. Sodomy is a grave sin. Whether it is a mortal sin or not depends on knowledge and consent and only God can judge that.

 

[Genesis315]

dawnicamar:

There are hundreds of bible verses about love, and only a few about homosexuality.

Love is the important one. Whether we think people are sinning or not is not the defining point of religion. Learning to love one another is.

Excellent point. We need to still love the sinner and help them to stop sinning. Being indifferent to someone putting their eternal soul in jeopardy is not love. You wouldn’t want a loved one to hurt themselves. “oh, (insert siblings name), I love you so much, I want you to do whatever you want, even if I know what you are doing is eternally destructive.” This is not love.

 

[carol_marie]

Esmeraldavale:

Werner, I’m with you. Obviously, homosexuality is not evil, or a sin, or a “disorder,” (a definition found posted by a priest elsewhere on this website!).

The “moderate” Catholics today are just those who pick and choose what parts of the bible to expound, and what parts to ignore. It’s unfortunately still socially acceptable to bash gays, although in 20-30 years, our children will look back on homosexual discrimination as a crime of ignorance, like we now look back on racial discrimination. It won’t be long, now!

OK, so in your opinion a person who engages in homosexeual activity is not sinning? What about my brother and his live in girlfriend, are they sinning when they engage in sex outside the bounds of marriage?

 

[Tantum_ergo]

Esmerelda, you said,

Obviously, homosexuality is not evil, or a sin, or a “disorder,” (a definition found posted by a priest elsewhere on this website!)

These are Catholic forums, Esmerelda, and while it may be quite true that a secular group or ideology, for example, the APA, does not consider homosexuality a “disorder” or an evil, Catholic teaching most definitely does teach that homosexual actions are intrinsically disordered. The reference for that, from the Catechism of the Catholic Church, has already been posted for you. People with SSA (same sex attraction) who do not act on this are not evil; the actions are evil.

If you have a quarrel with the teachings of the Church, and you aren’t a Catholic yourself, kindly extend to us the courtesy you would ask for us to extend to you. Coming on to a particular site and posting snide, unsupported statements which contradict the teachings of the place which has hosted you (the forums) is churlish behavior indeed. You might ask WHY Catholics have this teaching, and state that your opinion differs, rather than attempting to imply that not only are Catholics wrong, but their attitude is hateful, and their understanding deficient.

If you are a Catholic, may I suggest that you “get with the program” and learn just what your faith really teaches. Then, if you somehow “just can’t accept” a particular teaching, you can at least have the moral fiber to say that, while a Catholic, you are a dissenter on topic (s) X (Y, Z). Not only will you have the satisfaction of being completely truthful (rather than obfuscating or otherwise not dealing with your dissent), the rest of us will be able to consider the source, so to speak, and winnow the chaff from the wheat (if any).

 

[caroljm36]

carol marie:

OK, so in your opinion a person who engages in homosexeual activity is not sinning? What about my brother and his live in girlfriend, are they sinning when they engage in sex outside the bounds of marriage?

Yep! Next question?

 

[Riley259]

Werner:

I know heterosexual copules where the kids say “dad” and “mum”, i know others where they say “father” and “mother” and i know others where they say “John” and “Kerry”.
I suppose it will be similar with homosexual couples.

None of my nephews and nieces calls me “uncle” nor do they call my partner “uncle”, they just call us by our first names, as they do with the other uncles and aunts.

But when my sister’s kids talked with their friends recently about their uncles and aunts they counted me and my partner as two of their uncles (my sister by chance heard the conversation), and they don’t even know the word homosexuality, they are too young.

They just saw that we belong together, just like my brother and his wife belong together and just like my sister in law and her husband belong together, for them it is something completely natural.

This will change a bit of course as soon as they meet classmates who have been indoctrinated by fanatics to tell them that their uncles are bad people and abominators.

I 'm quite sure though they will tell them to shut up with their nonsense.

Werner

Werner,

I’m sure that you and your partner are good-intentioned people but the bottom line is that intimate relations between people of the same-sex is against the natural law and is disordered. I know that the “genie is out of the bottle” and that many same-sex partners have children and truly care for them but if they’re having intimate sexual relations and are living as sexual partners then it is still morally wrong and illicit and ultimately unfair to the children and society in general. Of course, children will be confused about addressing same-sex partners because they instinctively know that it’s not the norm - they still have both a true mother and father regardless of the domestic arrangement. I can’t imagine the difficulty of struggling with same-sex attractions and won’t pretend to but I do know there are some authentic resources out there that explain and offer support. A great book on the subject is Beyond Gay, by David Morrison and, of course, the support group Courage led by Fr. John Harvey. I hope you’ll consider exploring these avenues in your journey with the Lord. I’ll pray for you.

 

[Riley259]

SeeksTruth:

Abominations? Leviticus states that eating shellfish is an abomination. Why are we not advocating laws in the US banning the eating of shrimp? Are there different levels of abominations?

Yes, for a great explantion on how to authentically interpret Leviticus and other passages regarding homosexuality, please read, Homosexuality and the Bible by Richard Gagnon. It is a scholarly work on this critical subject area.