Gay Rights speaker at my Catholic college?

[rwoehmke]

When I attended College and University this kind of problem would never happen. Of course once out in society at that time such things were never discussed either. Now that society is permeated with such ideas, it may not be a bad thing to expose students to the reality of life “off campus.” A lot would depend on how the College or University treats such matters in its curriculum. Do they mislead students into believing such behavior is a legitimate life style or not. The problem is they probably don’t go very far to proclaim or enforce good moral values on campus.

 

[Exalt]

There are so many things wrong with this article that I don’t even know where to begin. Irrational is the only adjective that can be accuately applied to Mr. Corvino.

Irrational? That article is hardly irrational. It’s extremely rational, calm, and well put together. There is nothing inaccurate about it in the least.

In fact, I think I’m going to ask one of our long term professors of religious studies if we can invite this guy to our Catholic university.

 

[holdencaulfield]

Honestly, Free speech. What a joke.

 

[blessedtoo]

From the speaker’s own website:

Although some people would describe me as a fallen Catholic, they’re wrong: I didn’t fall; I leapt.

Ratzinger (as head of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, which enforces Church orthodoxy) wrote that “It is deplorable that homosexual persons have been and are the object of violent malice in speech or in action. Such treatment deserves condemnation from the church’s pastors wherever it occurs. It reveals a kind of disregard for others which endangers the most fundamental principles of a healthy society.”

But he followed this admirable admonition with a more equivocal one: “But…when civil legislation is introduced to protect behavior to which no one has any conceivable right, neither the church nor society at large should be surprised when other distorted notions and practices gain ground, and irrational and violent reactions increase.”

In other words, when gays demand civil rights, we should expect people to beat them up. While Ratzinger’s wording was more nuanced than many critics admit, it is hard not to detect a “blame the victim” element in it. Similar blame-shifting appeared in some of his comments on the priestly sex-abuse scandal.
johncorvino.com/col105hp.html

I would be very alarmed.

 

[East_and_West]

Irrational? That article is hardly irrational. It’s extremely rational, calm, and well put together. There is nothing inaccurate about it in the least.

In fact, I think I’m going to ask one of our long term professors of religious studies if we can invite this guy to our Catholic university.

Birds of a feather…

 

[Dale_M]

It doesn’t look like I’m going to prevent him. What else can I do?

edit: I am most definitely writing an article to the school newspaper, and probably also to the president of the college and the Bishop of the Diocese.

You should probably first find out whether college or student fees were used to sponsor him. This is important information, even for the letters you plan to write.

If such funding did occur, you might want to prevent similar occurrences in the future… perhaps by getting the student government involved, or at least pressuring them with a petition.

You will want assistance for such a project. Does your college have any Catholic student clubs which might get involved? If the club as a whole won’t get on board, maybe individual members would be interested in helping you. Be alert to any sympathetic alumni who might be able to help - the threat of losing alumni contributions often gets the notice of the administration.

 

[buffalo]

When I attended College and University this kind of problem would never happen. Of course once out in society at that time such things were never discussed either. Now that society is permeated with such ideas, it may not be a bad thing to expose students to the reality of life “off campus.” A lot would depend on how the College or University treats such matters in its curriculum. Do they mislead students into believing such behavior is a legitimate life style or not. The problem is they probably don’t go very far to proclaim or enforce good moral values on campus.

In a diverse college setting do you think all students would receive the other argument after he leaves? Unlikely. That is precisely the problem. Now in the classroom setting one was invited to make his case and a debate or followup was done that would be different. It’s the unchallenged platform that becomes the issue.

 

[Maxply]

You know what I would do?

I would write a letter to the president of the college, and thoughtfully point out why this is a bad thing for the college: its students, its public reputation.

I might also write a letter to the student newspaper pointing out some of these things, and working to persuade fellow students to simply not attend.

 

[hamburglar]

You should probably first find out whether college or student fees were used to sponsor him. This is important information, even for the letters you plan to write.

Our clubs are given funding by the college. So if a club or clubs is putting this on, would that mean the college is funding it?

Also, I will go to this event, tape record his presentation, and take some notes. Should I say anything when it is time for questions and discussion?

 

[Joe_5859]

Our clubs are given funding by the college. So if a club or clubs is putting this on, would that mean the college is funding it?

Also, I will go to this event, tape record his presentation, and take some notes. Should I say anything when it is time for questions and discussion?

I would say you definitely need to say something when it is time for Q&A. Obviously, it is too late to stop this event (and any attempt to do so previously may have just garnered more publicity for it anyway), but the event should not pass by without anyone so much has raising a whimper of protest. Complaints should be made to the College president and whoever else will listen!

I whole-heartedly disagree with some of the previous posters’ sentiments that such speakers are all part of a well-rounded liberal arts education. If you want such rubbish to be part of your “education”, go to a state school. It’s much cheaper. But if you’re going to a Catholic school, you absolutely have a right to expect that a Catholic worldview will be taught and lived in every aspect of campus life.

Are they inviting this speaker to the college in order to debate his point of view and present Catholic teaching right along side it? Probably not. If they were, perhaps that would be okay, but it seems highly unlikely that this would be the case. And if you are only hearing his side of the debate, that’s not called academic freedom, it’s called propaganda.

 

[Dale_M]

Also, I will go to this event, tape record his presentation, and take some notes. Should I say anything when it is time for questions and discussion?

Tape recording and notes are a good idea, and will be useful in the future.

As for speaking up, personally, I would want to be very prepared to counter what he says and to ask incisive questions. I would want to study what he has written so I could anticipate both his speech and his responses.

I would also want to be ready to take some heat. Asking challenging questions or disagreeing with the speaker may provoke some reaction from his supporters. Ideally, I would have some of my own supporters spread around the audience, armed with a list of questions that you all have prepared in advance, allowing you each to take turns asking those questions.

But I guess it comes down to how comfortable do you feel making a public stand tonight?

 

[hamburglar]

Mysteriously there is this message posted on my school’s webpage:

The "What’s Morally Wrong with Homosexuality?"event scheduled for tonight at 10:30pm has been postponed to a later date in April to allow adequate time for the college to prepare a reflection of the Catholic perspective.

More Details to come soon.

Questions or Concerns, please contact Sara Frees @ freessar@aquinas.edu

I never told anyone that I was going to object to this event, so it looks like their must be others that are concerned like I am.

btw, if anyone would like to know, I go to Aquinas College in Grand Rapids, Michigan.
aquinas.edu

 

[Polaris]

I went and read quite a few of his columns. He seems very level headed and reasonable, which for a gay advocate is a rare find indeed. He seems not to be an extremist, has no problem with exgays except in some of there practices, critics things wrong in the gay community and is willing to debate without falling into the usual the enemy is full of hate. I have to say If I was going to invite anyone it would be him.

 

[PetersKeys]

No, you should not be concerened.

Catholic colleges and universities teach a liberal arts education, which is a diverse and broad curriculum. You can go and question, but this is in line with the educational missions of the school.

Of course he/she be conerned. Secondly gay rights has nothing to do with college education, espessially at a Catholic University. The Church has infallibly condemned modernism and moral relativism. Thats why parents send their children to a Catholic school, so they get education in line with Catholic teaching. Many parents don’t want their children to be taught these things when they are sending them to a Catholic College. This is a disservice to the parents who pay for their children to have a good Catholic education. If the parents want their children bombared with gay “rights” then they would send them to a secular college.

This man on johncorvino would be described properly as a heretic, a dissenter and a moral relativist. All things the Church has condemed infallibly. In fact the declaration of people who are moral relativists cannot be really considered Catholic in the first place.

John corvino he says that he lept. Yea, lept into heresy

 

[PetersKeys]

Heres are some other Catholic universitys that he went to spread his filth at

¶ March 27: St. Ambrose Univ. (Davenport, IA) 8 pm, Rogalski Center
¶ April 3: Aquinas College (Grand Rapids, MI) 10:30 pm, Carriage House, Moose Cafe

 

[Exalt]

Of course he/she be conerned. Secondly gay rights has nothing to do with college education, espessially at a Catholic University. The Church has infallibly condemned modernism and moral relativism. Thats why parents send their children to a Catholic school, so they get education in line with Catholic teaching. Many parents don’t want their children to be taught these things when they are sending them to a Catholic College. This is a disservice to the parents who pay for their children to have a good Catholic education. If the parents want their children bombared with gay “rights” then they would send them to a secular college.

So basically you want to send them to a really expensive Catecheism school? You can get that at your parish for a much less expensive price, and send your kid to a community college. It would be pretty much the same thing.

Universities are places of debate. They are places of learning, yes, but that learning involves criticism. Criticism involves taking a close look at a vareity of suppositions and beliefs and examining them closely. It also means being open to the possibility that you just might be wrong about one of your positions.

Kids come from High School with a bunch of solid notions - how to write a paper, for example. But they discover in college that there’s much more to writing a paper than a simple five part “report” style essay. Research papers aren’t reports, they discover, they are theses. Ways to express a point: a point, that, at times, can be highly controversial. I remember back when I was a freshman and stayed firmly in the box with the first couple of papers I wrote. I got bad grades. Why? I didn’t challenge any of my beliefs or the preconcieved beliefs of the subject I was writing about (as well as not going outside the box of standard research papers). So I actually did step outside the box. I started bursting into fiction in the middle of papers. I started looking for ideas that seemed stale and examined them for their flaws. I came up with radical ideas - some good, some bad. My gades improved dramatically. My papers started getting recognized by my teachers. Some teachers even changed the way the class was taught to incorporate some of my ideas. But most importantly: I learned how to think critically.

That sort of stepping-outside-the-box is the bedrock of our society. It includes the evolution of Christian thinking - all the way back to the incorporation of gentiles into the Christian community in the 40’s and 50’s. All the way back to the theological evolution of Jesus, moving from Messiah to Lord and then to God. It took the Chrisitan community three centuries to really get at what that meant, by the way.

The Church is not immune to evolution. It is not immune to growth. It is not a stagnant pool that festers and doesn’t change - it’s a river. Unfortunately, the sort of college you advocate would indeed be a stagnant pool. And colleges like that (and I can go into this further) don’t survive very long. They pop up, claiming to be pillars of orthodoxy - and then they die.

I’ll repeat my point from before; if a parent wants his kid to go to a really expensive catecheism class, send him to Steubenville. If he wants a real education, send him to a college that isn’t afraid to expose students to challenging points of view - and isn’t afraid to encourage it’s students to take a close look at the world around them (including their church) and look at it critically.

 

[holdencaulfield]

You know what I would do?

I would write a letter to the president of the college, and thoughtfully point out why this is a bad thing for the college: its students, its public reputation.

I might also write a letter to the student newspaper pointing out some of these things, and working to persuade fellow students to simply not attend.

I actually think that is a very good idea. Maybe even a protest.

 

[holdencaulfield]

I would also want to be ready to take some heat. Asking challenging questions or disagreeing with the speaker may provoke some reaction from his supporters. Ideally, I would have some of my own supporters spread around the audience, armed with a list of questions that you all have prepared in advance, allowing you each to take turns asking those questions.

Have some friends there as well. Most liberals act like they know the only way that things are right. Get some conservapals to join you.

 

[holdencaulfield]

I would bring up the fact that God Himself told us that homosexuality is wrong and that God does not change His mind with the liberal trends of modern society. Also this is the same thing that the Catholic Magisterium has taught for almost 2000 years.

 

[Joe_5859]

I’ll repeat my point from before; if a parent wants his kid to go to a really expensive catecheism class, send him to Steubenville. If he wants a real education, send him to a college that isn’t afraid to expose students to challenging points of view - and isn’t afraid to encourage it’s students to take a close look at the world around them (including their church) and look at it critically.

So have you actually attended Franciscan University of Steubenville, or are you just tossing about baseless accusations? My guess is that the latter is correct, not the former.

Had you ever actually been to Steubenville or taken classes there, you would realize that this is not the case. Yes, FUS is fiercely orthodox, but that doesn’t mean they only look at things in a one-dimensional way. How can you refute an error if you don’t look at the error? I find your caricature of FUS to be grossly misinformed and highly offensive.

If one wants an environment where all point of views are considered equal, why not go to a (much less expensive) state school? Why even bother with a “Catholic” college if one doesn’t even care about approaching things from a Catholic perspective?

Simply approaching all things from a Catholic vantage point does not make a school a glorified Catechism class (as much as you seem to want to believe that). The Church has far more to offer than “Catholicism 101”, which is pretty much as in-depth as you can get in most parishes.