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mariannalee
Guest
I would attend for my son or I think I would regret it.
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CompSciGuy
Guest
God bless you, man. That is a tough situation indeed. I pray that you have the strength to follow your conscience. I hope that should I ever face the situation I should have the wisdom and fortitude to do the right thing.
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hansard
Guest
My opinion exactly. There are no stronger connections than family.
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Nixbits
Guest
This ceremony may not be what you wish for your son, but he is old enough to make his own choices. The most important thing is that show your love for your son and that you do nothing to risk damaging the loving relationship that you have with him. I advise that you go to the ceremony to demonstrate that love.
B
Bookcat
Guest
For any who think they might regret not going - one does not judge the morality or the loving thing to do - from such possible emotion.
I understand it is a very difficult situation - there is real suffering involved. It hurts.
We do lots of things as parents that does not ‘feel’ good - but we do it for the good of our children. For their* true good.*
And we can never choose to do some evil (like celebrating an attempted homosexual wedding - or approving such by our attendance - together with the scandal involved). The ends do not justify the means. Truth and love must go together. Great love yes -but truthful love. Without truth it is not love.
Such would be actually contrary to love.
B
Bookcat
Guest
If ones son was celebrating his getting away with cheating on his wife would you go?
If ones son was celebrating a successful kidnapping of a stolen baby would you go?
If ones son was celebrating his joining the Nazi party would you go?
No.
I use such examples to make a point here.
I understand it is very very difficult - especially in this cultural climate - but love must be together with truth.
Love - yes.
Affirm or celebrate that which is gravely and objectively disordered? No.
They call it “celebrating a wedding” - “attending a wedding celebration” etc… Attending is of the order of participating in and of approving and of celebrating the “event”.
Truth with love - great love.
Catechism:
1868 Sin is a personal act. Moreover, we have a responsibility for the sins committed by others when we cooperate in them:
Catechism:
2357 Homosexuality refers to relations between men or between women who experience an exclusive or predominant sexual attraction toward persons of the same sex. It has taken a great variety of forms through the centuries and in different cultures. Its psychological genesis remains largely unexplained. Basing itself on Sacred Scripture, which presents homosexual acts as acts of grave depravity,141 tradition has always declared that "homosexual acts are intrinsically disordered."142 They are contrary to the natural law. They close the sexual act to the gift of life. They do not proceed from a genuine affective and sexual complementarity. Under no circumstances can they be approved.
scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a6.htm#IV
Attending an “attempted wedding” celebration can be said to be quite of the order of approving - of “celebrating” what is happening. As is “giving a gift” for such.
If ones son was celebrating a successful kidnapping of a stolen baby would you go?
If ones son was celebrating his joining the Nazi party would you go?
No.
I use such examples to make a point here.
I understand it is very very difficult - especially in this cultural climate - but love must be together with truth.
Love - yes.
Affirm or celebrate that which is gravely and objectively disordered? No.
They call it “celebrating a wedding” - “attending a wedding celebration” etc… Attending is of the order of participating in and of approving and of celebrating the “event”.
Truth with love - great love.
Catechism:
1868 Sin is a personal act. Moreover, we have a responsibility for the sins committed by others when we cooperate in them:
- by participating directly and voluntarily in them;
- by ordering, advising, praising, or approving them;
- by not disclosing or not hindering them when we have an obligation to do so;
- by protecting evil-doers.
Catechism:
2357 Homosexuality refers to relations between men or between women who experience an exclusive or predominant sexual attraction toward persons of the same sex. It has taken a great variety of forms through the centuries and in different cultures. Its psychological genesis remains largely unexplained. Basing itself on Sacred Scripture, which presents homosexual acts as acts of grave depravity,141 tradition has always declared that "homosexual acts are intrinsically disordered."142 They are contrary to the natural law. They close the sexual act to the gift of life. They do not proceed from a genuine affective and sexual complementarity. Under no circumstances can they be approved.
scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a6.htm#IV
Attending an “attempted wedding” celebration can be said to be quite of the order of approving - of “celebrating” what is happening. As is “giving a gift” for such.
K
Kay_Cee
Guest
Shouldn’t our connection to God be stronger than that to family?
Aren’t we supposed to put God first?
You might want to take a look at Luke 14:26.
O
OraLabora
Guest
No, you are the voice of sanity.
O
Oneofthewomen
Guest
C
commenter
Guest
Yes, our connection to God should be stronger. But in this case our “connection” to family - or rather, our connection for family - would also lead us to stay away. Your son plans to make a near occasion of sin, permanent. Your presence at this “wedding” will make it a little more difficult for him down the road to pull out from this near occasion of sin.
There will likely be nieces, nephews, younger people at this “wedding”. Some of them will know you and respect you. They may be considering abandoning Christianity either on this, or some other issue. Your presence at this wedding communicates to them that abandoning Christ isn’t that big a deal.
To put it another way, your decision to absent yourself from this “wedding”, but also to continue loving and supporting your son, is a kind of blessing, or evangelism for genuine marriage.
B
Bookcat
Guest
B
Bookcat
Guest
B
Bookcat
Guest
Our surrounding culture can effect us in ways we do not realize --effecting our judgment --where we think we are doing the right thing by doing X. We can think it is the friendly or loving way…we need to good care in this regard.
A splendid quote:
"Only in truth does charity shine forth, only in truth can charity be authentically lived.
Without truth, charity degenerates into sentimentality. Love becomes an empty shell, to be filled in an arbitrary way. In a culture without truth, this is the fatal risk facing love. It falls prey to contingent subjective emotions and opinions, the word “love” is abused and distorted, to the point where it comes to mean the opposite."
~ Pope Benedict XVI
CARITAS IN VERITATE
A splendid quote:
"Only in truth does charity shine forth, only in truth can charity be authentically lived.
Without truth, charity degenerates into sentimentality. Love becomes an empty shell, to be filled in an arbitrary way. In a culture without truth, this is the fatal risk facing love. It falls prey to contingent subjective emotions and opinions, the word “love” is abused and distorted, to the point where it comes to mean the opposite."
~ Pope Benedict XVI
CARITAS IN VERITATE
O
OraLabora
Guest
You don’t have to quote the Catechism to me. I’ve read it front to back and back to front many, many times.
I’m speaking as a parent who would have to make a “pastoral” decision, not from a doctrinal position. I know full well the doctrine.
That said I have no interest in arguing the point. Arguing here is one thing I’ve given up for Lent. And no argument here would change what I would do as a father should I ever find myself in the same predicament as the OP. A father who wants to be in a position to continue influencing his sons who are all adults, not estranged from them on a point of principle.
B
Bookcat
Guest
Read again what I quoted above…and my other posts
The ends does not justify the means. It is not pastoral to celebrate grave sin. Which is what attending a “wedding”. Approving it, celebrating it - that is why it is called “celebrating”.
This is a “homosexual wedding” (attempt at such rather).
See what the CCC also notes under homosexuality above: “Under no circumstances can they be approved.”
Truth with great love.
As a* Father* - I must love my son - and it has to be love that is together with truth - or it is not loving him. But is acting against him. Against his true good.
So your son wants to join a Satanist group - and wants you to attend the ceremony?
No one does not attend.
One loves ones son and ones son already knows from so many many years with you that you love him. So no question there.
We must love and love and love. With prudence and gentleness and truth.
Yes love ones children with great love -but without truth it is not love.
If I go and attend a gay wedding - I am acting against love.
B
Bookcat
Guest
Our surrounding culture can effect us in ways we do not realize --effecting our judgment --where we think we are doing the right thing by doing X. We can think it is the friendly or loving way…we need to good care in this regard.
A splendid quote:
"Only in truth does charity shine forth, only in truth can charity be authentically lived.
Without truth, charity degenerates into sentimentality. Love becomes an empty shell, to be filled in an arbitrary way. In a culture without truth, this is the fatal risk facing love. It falls prey to contingent subjective emotions and opinions, the word “love” is abused and distorted, to the point where it comes to mean the opposite."
~ Pope Benedict XVI
CARITAS IN VERITATE
A splendid quote:
"Only in truth does charity shine forth, only in truth can charity be authentically lived.
Without truth, charity degenerates into sentimentality. Love becomes an empty shell, to be filled in an arbitrary way. In a culture without truth, this is the fatal risk facing love. It falls prey to contingent subjective emotions and opinions, the word “love” is abused and distorted, to the point where it comes to mean the opposite."
~ Pope Benedict XVI
CARITAS IN VERITATE
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OraLabora
Guest
Please re-read what I wrote and tell me where you can find that I would “approve” of their decision.
I would on the other hand accept it, because it’s not mine to make and I have no control over it. What I do have control over is my own behaviour and approach. Acceptance does not mean approval.
I would attend. My son would know why I don’t believe in same-sex “marriage”, but he would also know I that I love him unconditionally. I wouldn’t be there to “celebrate”, but I would be there as a gesture of unconditional love and support for him, and I would welcome both of them as if Christ Himself were present. Because regardless of what flaws we have or wrong-headed decisions we make, we carry His imprint on hour hearts. And that sir is sound Benedictine theology.
And please stop bombarding me with Catechism quotes. As I already mentioned, I know the Catechism rather well. It’s very patronizing. I’m not here to argue, I am stating what I as a parent would do and why I would do it.
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Bookcat
Guest
Attending an attempted wedding celebration of a homosexual couple - is approving.
And by definition it is ‘celebrating’.
I will continue to quote the Catechism for your not the only reader.
B
Bookcat
Guest
Attendance yes shows approval - and one is attending the ‘celebration’ and causing grave scandal. It is to act against the love of ones Son.
One cannot not support a person in sinning as the CCC clearly notes.
B
Bookcat
Guest
As Father - my children will know I love them and will continue to love them. And that I will not show up - will not approve of gravely sinful events - if such would occur. That I am loving them -and I will explain that I will continue to love them. But I must love them in truth. And if I attended such would be contrary to my love for them.
Would not only scandal to them and others but be an offense against them - an act contrary to my love for them and above all my Lord.
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