Gene Fadness, ex-Mormon, on Catholic Answers

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Well, that is what they said. They said becoming gods. It is your words against them.

LOL! I am not going anywhere. You can go away if you like.

Sorry, that is what they said—and there are lots of scholars who recognize that.
What is your objective here? Is it to convert, to inform to annoy?

It’s just that when I read your responses I’m always reminded of the phrase that ‘you catch more flies with honey than vinegar’. As an example of Mormon behaviour and attitudes you don’t come across as particularly Christ-like which does you a dis-service.

Also you speak quite authoritatively on Mormon doctrine, which may or may not be your intention. And forgive me because you may have mentioned this elsewhere, but what makes you qualified to speak about mormon beliefs? I know you claim to be LDS from the ‘religion’ field, but what calling do you currently hold or have you previosly held? Are you an RM for example? Or a bishop or whatever. It’s fine if you don’t want to share I’m just curious.
 
That is your invention. It is a figment of your imagination. Mormons believe that men can become gods, and the early Christians believed that men can become gods; and they both meant the same thing by it.
Man’s first sin, to be a god

You really need to study this, its not true at all zerinus, just this would have to make you consider your entire faith. You have to separate the creator from the created in order to understand. God will always be our Creator, we will always have been created by God. Yes, because of what Jesus did we will be like Him in the Christian sense, not in the line of Gods LDS sense. we will never be God as God is. We would not desire this at all. He is our God and we are His people. Your faith has taken what the devil offered mankind and turned it into a good thing, even to the point of having God lie. I believe the fall was necessary because we were not God, we fall in order to know what it is like to be away. The plan of salvation is simply to get back to God and want to stay forever, never to leave again. (Prodigal Son)

Catechism of the Catholic Church - PART 1 SECTION 2 CHAPTER 1 ARTICLE 1 PARAGRAPH 7

397 Man, tempted by the devil, let his trust in his Creator die in his heart and, abusing his freedom, disobeyed God’s command. This is what man’s first sin consisted of.278 All subsequent sin would be disobedience toward God and lack of trust in his goodness.
398 In that sin man *preferred *himself to God and by that very act scorned him. He chose himself over and against God, against the requirements of his creaturely status and therefore against his own good. Constituted in a state of holiness, man was destined to be fully “divinized” by God in glory. Seduced by the devil, he wanted to “be like God”, but “without God, before God, and not in accordance with God”.279
All of it here
Catechism of the Catholic Church - PART 1 SECTION 2 CHAPTER 1 ARTICLE 1 PARAGRAPH 7
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by zerinus forums.catholic-questions.org/images/buttons_khaki/viewpost.gif
That is your invention. It is a figment of your imagination. Mormons believe that men can become gods, and the early Christians believed that men can become gods; and they both meant the same thing by it.

Maybe this will help
Show us in the scriptures where this is said, we will comment using the Church. Sometimes the LDS take Holy Scripture and place other meaning into it. At least I can give the Christian translation. Again it might help you zerinus.

www.utahmission.com
 
The doctrine of theosis is Biblical and apostolic, and is found in Catholicism, with particular emphasis in Eastern Catholicism (and by extension, in the Orthodox Church).

Jordan Vajda, a former Catholic priest who became Mormon, wrote an interesting masters thesis (called “Partakers of the Divine Nature”) comparing and contrasting theosis and exaltation. The Maxwell Institute (a BYU associated Mormon apologetics organization) has reproduced a revised version of it:

mi.byu.edu/publications/papers/?paperID=7

Zerinus, as a sola scriptura Mormon, is attempting to simplify things when the reality is that the doctrine of exaltation, as presented by the writings of various Mormon authorities, as well as official church teaching manuals, is more involved than just “we become gods”. The same goes for theosis. As others have said, theosis and exaltation are very much tied to the nature of man.
 
Hi Gene Fadness.

FYI, to make a “quotation box” you need to keep the begin quote marker and the end quote marker. There must be some text in between or the quote won’t show up.

I have to show you the end quote marker first, and then the begin quote marker, because if you put them in the right order, they make a quotation box and you won’t see the markers.

End quote marker =

Begin quote marker =
40.png
Gene_Fadness:
 
Hi Gene Fadness.

FYI, to make a “quotation box” you need to keep the begin quote marker and the end quote marker. There must be some text in between or the quote won’t show up.

I have to show you the end quote marker first, and then the begin quote marker, because if you put them in the right order, they make a quotation box and you won’t see the markers.

End quote marker =

Begin quote marker =
Gene Fadness;6159640:
Thanks, I’ll try this and see if it works! God bless,
The Apostate
 
People should respect that held secret…a Catholic priest will be excommunicated for breaking the seal of confession.

A person must follow his or her own conscience. If that person’s conscience needs to bear the truth for its sake, and to help the situation in whole to be in truth…then that could be a difficulty for the past association to bear.
 
One of the posters on here (I still haven’t figured out how to highlight a section and respond to it, like all of you do!) said something …
Okay, I will show you how to use the tags. All the text formatting is done using tags that look like these [ABC]whatever you want to put here![/ABC]. That automatically gives the text in between the two tags the kind of formatting represented by [ABC][/ABC]. [ABC] was not a true tag, otherwise it would not have shown up in the text; only the formatting would have showsn up. True tags include the following: B] for bold, I] for italics, U] for underline, INDENT] for indentation, QUOTE] for putting text in “quote” boxes, and so forth. All tags must have a beginning and an endig. The ending tag is always the same as the beginning tag except that it is preceded by a slash /…]. You can “nest” tags inside tags as much as you want, like so: [X][Y]…[/Y][/X], but never like so: [X][Y]…[/X][/Y], or any other arangement apart than the first. You can insert the tags manually; or an easier way is to use the formatting buttons provided at the top of the text editor when you are typing in CAF. If you have used a wordprocessor like Microsoft Word, these buttons will be familiar. They look the same and do the same things. To insert the tags, you highlight a piece of text you want to be formatted, and then click on the approptiate button to achieve the desired formatting. Some tags get sophisticated like URL tags or Image tags. If you hover your mouse pointer over each button, a “tool tip” appears that tells you what it does.

When replying to posts, always you use the “Quote” button shown at the bottom of each post. That automatically wraps up all of the original post in “quote” tags which identifies it and links it back to the original post. If you want to delete part of the quote and reply to only part of it, you can do so provided you don’t delete the beginning or ending tag. In the same way you can breake up a post into smaller quotes by using the “quote” tag and reply to each part separately. The best way to learn how it all works is to try it out. There is a special forum called Sandbox designed specificaly for this purpose. You can go there try things out until you learn how it works. The tags are also know as the “BB Code,” and there are also plenty of tutorials on the Intrnet that tell you how to use them. Here are a few links for you to try:

askdavetaylor.com/what_is_bbcode_and_how_do_i_use_it.html
phpbb.com/community/faq.php?mode=bbcode
bbcode.org/reference.php
 
Well, that is what they said. They said becoming gods. It is your words against them.

Nope. It is you who refuses to recognize the meanings of their words. Theosis, NOT Apotheosis.

LOL! I am not going anywhere. You can go away if you like.

No thank you. I can stop reading your lies if I get too much organic fertilizer.

Sorry, that is what they said—and there are lots of scholars who recognize that.
Nope. Name some real scholars who believe that early Christians believed in Apotheosis. Real scholars, not Mormons or Christian haters.
 
Thank you, Deb. I had read some things after I ran across some materials in their bookstore…I can see their devotion to Christ in some ways that bears the same fruit as ours…but I am divided if I can call them Christians beyond a mutual devotion to Our Lord…and the secrecy…always this makes me suspicious…and also see it as a sign to be most limited in any debates with Mormons now…I do see alot of good in these people, and on a certain level in civil matters trust their good will and compassion.
The Church does not recognise the validity of LDS baptism and so they are not Christians according to the Church (which fact is indisputably apparent from their expressed beliefs about Him)
 
Yes, I know their baptisms are not accepted. For the time I read posts here and others explaining Mormonism, I can see it basically has separate concepts even though at times the same words or names or used.

I believe there are some aspects regarding Christ that we do share common ground with Mormons, but I can’t honestly define its parameters.
 
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