Genetic Mosaicism vs Church Teaching

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noorez

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Hello again,

Teachings of the church:
  1. is that marriage can only occur between one man and one woman.
  2. only men can become priests.
  3. gender reassignment surgery is immoral
What is the teaching of the church in light of knowledge of genetic abnormalities (genetic mosaicism in this case)

In science we say that a man normally chromosomal XY and a woman XX. Easy.

But what about in genetic abnormalities such as genetic mosaicism in which both sets of chromosomes are present? Some of the cells are male and some are female. This can lead to manifestations such as ambiguous genitalia.
  1. So what happens in the case of marriage. Who is this person allowed to marry?
  2. Can we simply say that this person is a man and allow him to be a preiest?
3)In the case of the genitalia, doctors will usually recommend the parents to ‘choose either boy or girl’ and have the genitalia fixed to match that choice. This is usually done to avoid the high potential of complications that he will face in the future. What is the response to this?
 
As far as I know, the Church hasn’t officially commented on any of these types of scenarios. It’s probably wise to give science time to sort out what is going on here before evaluating the situations.

My inclination is that such people would be called to live lives of chastity (as are we all) which for them would mean celibacy. I cannot see admitting such a person to the priesthood without some pretty substantial science backing up that these individuals are definitely male.
 
According to Church teaching, sexual reassignment surgery can take place under special circumstances, and authorized case by case by the bishop. The person can never receive the sacraments of Matrimony or Holy Orders after the surgery (when done later in life.) In the case you are discussing, it would be necessary to speak to the Bishop about whether the surgery would be an impediment in later life to Matrimony and Holy Orders.
 
Joe_5859 said:
As far as I know, the Church hasn’t officially commented on any of these types of scenarios. It’s probably wise to give science time to sort out what is going on here before evaluating the situations.

My inclination is that such people would be called to live lives of chastity (as are we all) which for them would mean celibacy. I cannot see admitting such a person to the priesthood without some pretty substantial science backing up that these individuals are definitely male.
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Hmm. So to clarify, how does the Church differentiate between what is male and female? There are many biological and psychological scientists that insist that things are not quite as clear cut as XY and XX as would have been previously thought.

For example, a certain disorder can cause a male (XY) to become immune to testosterone and only produce estrogen. This results in body/brain development to develop only female characteristics (such as genitalia). What is the response to this?
 
Hi noorez

There is obviously a range of these inter-sex conditions and chromosomal abnormalities. I pray the Church increasingly welcomes all those who have discerned a vocation to the priesthood.
 
Hi, noorez.

You identify yourself as a Muslim. Most forms of the Muslim faith have a stronger differentiation between men and women than the Catholic faith (what to wear, who they can be with in public, forms of education, etc). In the Catholic faith, there are few teachings that apply to women but not to men (or the other way around), so (I presume) gender identity is not as important to Catholics as it would be to Muslims (which might account for the scarcity of official Catholic teaching in this regard).

Out of curiosity, how does the Muslim faith (which has many more gender-specific teachings) deal with this issue?
 
Michael_Allen said:
Hi noorez

There is obviously a range of these inter-sex conditions and chromosomal abnormalities. I pray the Church increasingly welcomes all those who have discerned a vocation to the priesthood.
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The important distinction to make here is that it is the CHURCH which discerns vocations, not the individual. The individual may respond to a call that he feels exists, but it is the Church which discerns the vocation.
 
I may be a dunderhead, but here goes:
  1. You need a Y-chromosome to be male. Period. Right?
  2. These conditions are rare. I would think that a male with XYY or XXY or XXYY who met the qualification for the priesthood would be considered on a case by case basis. After all, until genetic testing, who knew the difference?
Otherwise this topic is fruitless. Jesus was male. Fact. Priest are male. Fact. Women, like me, have other shoes to fill. The world needs mothers and spiritual mothers.
 
It’s not quite that simple because maternal hormone levels can significantly alter a baby’s sexual development in utero as well.

Sometimes people, even children, have enormous burdens to carry. Christ and his Catholic Church greets everyone with love, whether they are male, female, or somewhere in between.

How does the Muslim world treat these people? How about homosexuals? Oh…that’s right…often the same way they treat girls who want to get an education, women who want to leave the house alone, or soccer players.
 
I’m still interested in hearing how the OP’s Muslim faith deals with this question.

Muslim faiths typically have teachings and rules that apply only to women, or only to men (such teachings and rules are comparatively rare in the Catholic faith - offhand, I cannot think of any other than the male-only priesthood).

There have been a few Catholic gender-specific historic rules (no longer in place) which were defined (and repealed) long before the term “genetic mosaicism” was even invented or imagined. But the Muslim faiths typically have quite a lot of rules about the appropriate conduct of women and men. If, for example, a Muslim defines what a woman ought to wear, he ought to be able to say what a woman actually is. If he cannot define what a “woman” is, he cannot define what a “woman” ought to wear.

In day-to-day life, the distinction between “woman” and “man” is MUCH more relevant to Muslims than it is to Catholics. So, I suppose, the Muslims ought to be at the forefront of theological opinion in this matter (at least, in their own way).

So, again, I ask the OP - what is the Muslim position on this? Maybe we Catholics can learn something from our Muslim cousins.
 
Hello!

I apologies for the late reply. I am just trying to come up with a suitable answer for this forum. See, I belong to a branch of Islam called the ‘Shia Nizari Ismaili’. Check out links below:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nizari
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aga_Khan_IV

Since we have a much more esoteric interpretation of the faith than the Sunni or the Athnā’ashariyyah Shia (Twelver Shia) my answer might be different than they would give. Therefore I’d like to submit one which reflects not only my own opinion but perhaps the popular ones as well as Sunni Islam is the largest branch by number of people.
 
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