German catholics must pay 8/9 percent tax on their income, otherwise they are excluded from the sacraments

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Upon further research I can understand and appreciate the German way of doing things. However, there is NO biblical basis for denying a Catholic the sacraments because he or she refuses to tithe (pay his taxes as a registered church member). The whole thing smacks of extortion.

A German professor went to court over this issue. He is a faithful catholic but refuses to pay the required tax. Not sure if there’s s decision in his case yet.
 
Upon further research I can understand and appreciate the German way of doing things. However, there is NO biblical basis for denying a Catholic the sacraments because he or she refuses to tithe (pay his taxes as a registered church member). The whole thing smacks of extortion.
As has been explained, however, the Sacraments are being denied due to rescinding membership in the Church. If I publicly renounce my Catholicism, I cannot expect to be afforded the Sacraments.

Although, in a way, there’s a similar thing occurring here in the States. I’m officially registerred with a parish that will allow me to marry in that church for free, and their choirs will sing at my Nuptial Mass at a highly discounted rate by virtue of my membership in the associated parish. Just so happens that this church is a very big, very beautiful church with professional chant and polyphony choirs, and so naturally there are lots of individuals who are not members of our parish who wish to get married there. In order to get married there, they must pay for “using the church” and the choirs provide them with no discount. If I were to rescind my membership at this parish should I insist on being afforded a members-rate if I’m to ever get married there in the future?
A German professor went to court over this issue. He is a faithful catholic but refuses to pay the required tax. Not sure if there’s s decision in his case yet.
That’s interesting. I suspect that should he win, the issue of apostasy will be resolved and the German Bishops would reverse their decision.
 
Upon further research I can understand and appreciate the German way of doing things. However, there is NO biblical basis for denying a Catholic the sacraments because he or she refuses to tithe (pay his taxes as a registered church member). The whole thing smacks of extortion.

A German professor went to court over this issue. He is a faithful catholic but refuses to pay the required tax. Not sure if there’s s decision in his case yet.
Again, the issue isn’t “refusing to pay the tax.” The issue is apostasy/schism.
 
Just to add a little context here, as well, here are some fine examples of who the German Bishops’ had in mind when they enacted this:

foxnews.com/world/2012/09/28/germany-enforces-pay-to-pray-decree-no-taxes-no-sacraments/
With rising prices and economic uncertainty, however, more and more Catholics and Protestants are opting to save their money and declare to tax authorities they are no longer church members, even if they still consider themselves believers.
**“I quit the church already in 2007,” Manfred Gonschor, a Munich-based IT-consultant, said. “It was when I got a bonus payment and realized that I could have paid myself a nice holiday alone on the amount of church tax that I was paying on it.”
Gonschor added he was also “really fed up with the institution and its failures.”**
Such defections have hit the Catholic Church especially hard – it has lost about 181,000 tax-paying members in 2010 and 126,000 a year later, according to official figures. Protestants, who number about 24 million nationwide, lost 145,000 registered members in Germany in 2010, the most recent year from which figures are available.
But the figures include some people who still want to baptize their children, take communion on major religious holidays, marry in a religious ceremony and receive Christian burials.
The group We are Church, which claims to represent tens of thousands of grassroots Catholics, said many Germans stop paying the tax because they disagree with the church’s policies or simply want to save money – not because they have lost their faith.
"I haven’t quit because I still think that I might want to get married in a church one day, even though I know that’s absurd," said Anna Ainsley, a 31-old-year banker and a Protestant from Frankfurt. "But when I see my tax declaration, then I think every year that I should finally quit."
People who have decided to officially renounce their Catholicism so they could go on a nice vacation, attend Mass only frequently enough to receive Communion on Holidays, get married, have their children baptized, and receive a Christian burial, all the while “disagree[ing] with the church’s policies” (and we all know what that’s code for).

Not exactly the sin of simony here.
 
Remember the woman in the Temple treasury who gave two mites (a few cents)?
Jesus said that this woman gave more than all who had out of their wealth.

I was bothered by this months ago, but Pope Benedict XVI was reigning at the time and he is German. He didn’t try to stop it, as far as I know.

Do children get the sacraments, even though they don’t pay taxes?
Is it just the apostasy to save money that causes it?

I remember a statement from the German Bishops on this saying, basically, that Germans need to have “Solidarity” on the subject. So they support this system, as far as I can tell.
Here is a link detailing the issue: ncronline.

I don’t like it, but I’m an American.
 
I was bothered by this months ago, but Pope Benedict XVI was reigning at the time and he is German. He didn’t try to stop it, as far as I know.

I don’t like it, but I’m an American.
Apparently, the Vatican (including the Pope?) approved it. Oh well, I guess I’m wrong to dislike it.
 
=blaskoman;10725707]I was appalled when I heard about this. Does anyone know more details about this?
I CAN TELL YOU MOST ASSUREIDLY THAT THIS IS NOT [EVEN IF ITS TRUE:shrug:] APPROVED BY THE POPE AND MAGISTERIUM.

Some German bishops are doing there own thing; there OWN way:o
 
Remember the woman in the Temple treasury who gave two mites (a few cents)?
Jesus said that this woman gave more than all who had out of their wealth.
I suggest you reread the relevant passages. The widow only had 2 mites and so in essence gave 100% of what she had while the ostensibly wealthy Scribes gave a significantly smaller proportion of their income. If you read the verses directly preceding them (Mark 12:38-39 and Luke 21 (where we find the parable) you’ll see that Jesus condemns them for seeking after honor for their own sake, and feigning piety. These passage have nothing at all to do with tithing, church donations (in and of themselves), nor the levying of church taxes.

And even if the passages were relevant, the exact opposite is occurring in Germany as they have a (very) progressive tax system. The 8%-9% value assessed is multiplied by the tax bracket a German finds herself. This means that those in higher tax income brackets are actually paying a higher proportion of their income to the Church than the poor are. This is what likely gives rise to gentlemen like the one quoted in the Fox news article I cited a few posts up who is a wealthy IT guy and realized that he could fund a really cool vacation if he would just drop out of the Church! Furthermore, just as here in US, there are the incredibly poor who pay no income tax whatsoever!
I was bothered by this months ago, but Pope Benedict XVI was reigning at the time and he is German. He didn’t try to stop it, as far as I know.

Irrelevant.
Do children get the sacraments, even though they don’t pay taxes?

I would suppose the practice is no different than it is here. Children of practicing Catholics are welcome to be baptized, and once baptized are full members of the Catholic Church. They, just like all other Germans, will continue having access to the Sacraments as so long as they don’t leave the Faith.
I don’t like it, but I’m an American.
I can understand that, well. Our sympathies will obviously be colored, at least a bit, by our own cultural values. Americans value the 1st Amendment and our government’s inherent secularism (well at least most Americans do). 😃
 
When they officially defects from the faith they do so in writing and the parish is notified. This defection is entered into their baptismal records – even if they were baptized in North America. Our parish received such notification several years ago about a man who had been baptized in Canada.
 
This sort of arrangement is common in Europe, or at least was so traditionally. It is indeed a practice sanctioned by the Magesterium. Indeed, historically, the United States was the exception, not the rule in not having church taxes (though some states in the early Republic levied taxes to support the established Protestant Churches). France, for example, levied a 10% income tax, the proceeds used to pay the salaries of the clergy before the Revolution.

As for the case of Germany, historically the secular government was in charge of maintaining the churches, It would be part of the state budget, just as, say, defense spending would. In the nineteenth century, eventually, German state governments (since 1871 with the exception of Communist East Germany, Germany has been a federal state, even if the Nazis subverted its federal nature in practice) transferred the responsibility of upkeep of churches and paying clergymen to the Church itself; however, the state government continued to collect the funds on behalf of the Church, which they then paid in a lump sum. In fact this practice is guarranteed in the German Basic Law (de facto the Constitution).

Of course, the problem lies in the fact that the tax in Germany is rather high - 9% of their income tax bill (except Bavaria and Baden-Wuerttemberg, which has it as 8% of the income tax). Italy, by contrast, has the rate at 0.8% of their income tax bill.

Note that this is 9% of your income tax bill, not 9% of your income. So, for example, Gerd has an annual income of €50,000. His income tax rate is 20%, so his income tax is €10,000. Gerd is Catholic and lives in the state of North Rhine-Westphalia, so the 9% church tax is applied to him. That means that 9% of that €10,000, that is, €900, will go to Church. That €900 (about $1,100 at present exchange rates) amounts to 1.8% of his income.

Honestly, the bishops are right on this one. Are you really willing to apostatize from the Church for the sake of a thousand bucks? If you are, that says something about you.
 
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