Getting the EF at my Parish

[JaMc]

After attending my second EF Mass at the FSSP chapel 45 minutes away from me, I have decided to take the bull by the horns, and see about getting an EF at my parish (we have a beautiful Gothic Church built in 1926, which wasn’t changed too much following Vatican II, which would be a beautiful setting for the EF).

However, my question is, what would be the first step? I am not sure if I should contact our pastor (I asked him about getting an EF a while back, and he wasn’t terribly helpful. He was ordained in 1977, and already said he was not trained in the EF), then contact the FSSP Priest to see about getting someone to offer the Mass; or if I should contact the FSSP Priest first, try and get as much sorted out beforehand, then contact our pastor and see about use of the church, etc.

Our pastor’s position is, pretty much, that he won’t stand in the way of getting an EF at our Parish, but he isn’t going to go out of his way to help get one here, either (he strongly prefers the OF, but is very orthodox, and will abide by the Motu Proprio). Basically, the impression I got is, if we do all the footwork, etc., he’ll supply the church. We share our Priest with a neighbouring parish, so it shouldn’t be too hard to find a time to schedule an EF Mass.

 

[michaeldaniels]

I am not sure…I could be wrong and someone correct me if I am, first speak to all the parishioners and see exactly what type of demand there is at your parish…or perhaps if there are a few parishes close to yours, maybe poll all the parishioners to see if they would like a local TLM at your Church and a preferred time for it…I wouldn’t recommend trying to replace an existing Mass, but try to add a new time for It to be celebrated…after that, it would be a matter of logistics…finding both a priest that is 1)trained properly to celebrate, and 2) willing to travel weekly or every other week to celebrate the Mass…not too mention you will need the Pastor’s approval since it his parish…heck, he may even be willing to learn it himself

 

[Joannm]

Another thing to consider is who is going to pick up the costs involved. If a large enough group request it they should shoulder much of the cost instead of the parish, especially if a good number of people outside of the parish are going to be part of the assembly. Are they going to contribute to your parish to offset the costs. Who is going to pay the stipend for the priest? If you can show your pastor that he will not have to lay out all the money and that there will be people supporting the effort, then he may be more open to it.

 

[fabricdragon]

i would say, get all the groundwork done
find out the costs, i think i may even have a site that has how to sew some of the vestments and alter covers!
but get the footwork done, and know what will be involved, then petition your pastor…

but do be careful to put it gently… an awful lot of people (including priests) can get very ruffled if they feel their authority is being stepped on

 

[malphono]

After attending my second EF Mass at the FSSP chapel 45 minutes away from me, I have decided to take the bull by the horns, and see about getting an EF at my parish (we have a beautiful Gothic Church built in 1926, which wasn’t changed too much following Vatican II, which would be a beautiful setting for the EF).

However, my question is, what would be the first step? I am not sure if I should contact our pastor (I asked him about getting an EF a while back, and he wasn’t terribly helpful. He was ordained in 1977, and already said he was not trained in the EF), then contact the FSSP Priest to see about getting someone to offer the Mass; or if I should contact the FSSP Priest first, try and get as much sorted out beforehand, then contact our pastor and see about use of the church, etc.

Our pastor’s position is, pretty much, that he won’t stand in the way of getting an EF at our Parish, but he isn’t going to go out of his way to help get one here, either (he strongly prefers the OF, but is very orthodox, and will abide by the Motu Proprio). Basically, the impression I got is, if we do all the footwork, etc., he’ll supply the church. We share our Priest with a neighbouring parish, so it shouldn’t be too hard to find a time to schedule an EF Mass.

My suggestion is the second approach: get your ducks in a row and make the presentation. The pastor might even surprise you by wanting to learn the EF. (Yeah, it’s a longshot but I’ve heard of it happening. Particularly if the priest is orthodox and has the opportunity to learn it first-hand on-site, if only by observation at first.)

Another thing to consider is who is going to pick up the costs involved. If a large enough group request it they should shoulder much of the cost instead of the parish, especially if a good number of people outside of the parish are going to be part of the assembly. Are they going to contribute to your parish to offset the costs. Who is going to pay the stipend for the priest? If you can show your pastor that he will not have to lay out all the money and that there will be people supporting the effort, then he may be more open to it.

Assuming that there would be reasonable attendance, costs should not be an issue. The EF Mass would be sponsored by the host parish which means that a collection would be taken. The stipend for the priest would logically come from that, and any residuals would accrue to the parish coffer.

 

[JRKH]

Good answers here.

Here is a link to the
"Apostolic Letter “Summorum Pontificum” issued Motu Proprio Benedict XVI"

It states in part:
Art. 5. § 1 In parishes, where there is a stable group of faithful who adhere to the earlier liturgical tradition, the pastor should willingly accept their requests to celebrate the Mass according to the rite of the Roman Missal published in 1962, and ensure that the welfare of these faithful harmonises with the ordinary pastoral care of the parish, under the guidance of the bishop in accordance with canon 392, avoiding discord and favouring the unity of the whole Church.

Art. 7. If a group of lay faithful, as mentioned in art. 5 õ 1, has not obtained satisfaction to their requests from the pastor, they should inform the diocesan bishop. The bishop is strongly requested to satisfy their wishes. If he cannot arrange for such celebration to take place, the matter should be referred to the Pontifical Commission “Ecclesia Dei”.

So your pastor has complied by not opposing you but, like most pastors, he is not going to actively help either. This is not at all uncommon.
Certainly you are going to have to ask around to see if there are at least a few others who would like to have the EF celebrated. Maybe not every week but at least periodically.
Then approach your pastor again and ask if he might know of any other priests that might be qualified (retired, or religious priests possibly). He likely won’t but do this in order to “keep him in the loop”.
The next step then would be to contact the bishopric to ask what can be done. Don’t do this to “circumvent” your pastor, but rather to not add to his, “already heavy load of” pastoral duties.
I’m not sure what you would do after that. I suppose it will depend on the answers you get.

Perhaps you should contact the people at the EF parish and see if they can help steer you.

Peace and Good Luck
James

 

[malphono]

Good answers here. …

So your pastor has complied by not opposing you but, like most pastors, he is not going to actively help either. This is not at all uncommon.
Certainly you are going to have to ask around to see if there are at least a few others who would like to have the EF celebrated. Maybe not every week but at least periodically.
Then approach your pastor again and ask if he might know of any other priests that might be qualified (retired, or religious priests possibly). He likely won’t but do this in order to “keep him in the loop”.
The next step then would be to contact the bishopric to ask what can be done. Don’t do this to “circumvent” your pastor, but rather to not add to his, “already heavy load of” pastoral duties.
I’m not sure what you would do after that. I suppose it will depend on the answers you get.

Perhaps you should contact the people at the EF parish and see if they can help steer you.

The impression I get from the OP is that the only problem in arranging the EF is a celebrant.

Article 7 of SP would seem to apply in cases where the pastor is obstructing the EF, not where he is (a) merely unschooled in it and (b) otherwise has no objection. True, he may not be willing to do the leg-work to get it going, but I would not suggest involving the Chancery unless absolutely necessary. It seems to me that would give more of an impression of circumvention than would simply contacting the FSSP and laying the ground work.

 

[JRKH]

The impression I get from the OP is that the only problem in arranging the EF is a celebrant.

Article 7 of SP would seem to apply in cases where the pastor is obstructing the EF, not where he is (a) merely unschooled in it and (b) otherwise has no objection. True, he may not be willing to do the leg-work to get it going, but I would not suggest involving the Chancery unless absolutely necessary. It seems to me that would give more of an impression of circumvention than would simply contacting the FSSP and laying the ground work.

You may well be right.
My thought in contacting the chancery would be for information and help in getting a celebrant since the past is, at present, unqualified.
My only concern about contacting the FSSP before the chancery is that, I believe, a religious order priest must have the permission of the Bishop to celebrate mass at a diocesan church. Again - I could be wrong.

That is why I suggested contacting people involved at the EF parish he mentioned in the OP. These folks MUST know.

Peace
James

 

[corsair]

Here is a the latest information from PCED.

"Latin Mass OK anytime, anywhere: Vatican rules
Published Date: February 18, 2010

In a series of responses to questions from a Polish diocese, the Pontifical Commission Ecclesia Dei has ruled that parishes may replace a normal Sunday Mass with one celebrated in the ‘Extraordinary’ or Tridentine form.

The questions from the diocese of Rzeszow, Poland concerned the application of the motu proprio Summorum Pontificum, New Liturgical Movement reports.

The answers, however, are applicable generally, NLM says.

NLM summarizes the answers to the questions as follows:

“1. If there is no other possibility, because for instance in all churches of a diocese the liturgies of the Sacred Triduum are already being celebrated in the Ordinary Form, the liturgies of the Sacred Triduum may, in the same church in which they are already celebrated in the Ordinary Form, be additionally celebrated in the Extraordinary Form, if the local ordinary allows.

“2. A Mass in the usus antiquior may replace a regularly scheduled Mass in the Ordinary Form. The question contextualizes that in many churches Sunday Masses are more or less scheduled continually, leaving free only very inconvenient mid afternoon slots, but this is merely context, the question posed being general. The answer leaves the matter to the prudent judgement of the parish priest, and emphasises the right of a stable group to assist at Mass in the Extraordinary Form.

“3. A parish priest may schedule a public Mass in the Extraordinary Form on his own accord (i.e. without the request of a group of faithful) for the benefit of the faithful including those unfamiliar with the usus antiquior. The response of the Commission here is identical to no. 2.

“4. The calendar, readings or prefaces of the 1970 Missale Romanum may not be substituted for those of the 1962 Missale Romanum in Masses in the Extraordinary Form.

“5. While the liturgical readings (Epistle and Gospel) themselves have to be read by the priest (or deacon/subdeacon) as foreseen by the rubrics, a translation to the vernacular may afterwards be read also by a layman.”

The effect of these responses is that priests may “celebrate Mass in the Extraordinary Form whenever they choose”, Telegraph writer Damian Thompson says.

SOURCE

Important Clarifications from Ecclesia Dei(New Liturgical Movement)"

You’ll still need to find and train Altar boys (not girls). If you can find a priest nearby to come in to say Mass, he’ll probably have his own vestments. If not you may find a “cache” of them in the basement of your own parish. Getting a matching set of candle holders is VERY expensive and can run up to several thousand dollars. Or do as we did , buy a set of “knock offs” from England for $550.00. Be sure and find out what size candles they hold.

Our Archdiocese requires that we pay round trip mileage and a stipend of $50 to the priest so we were looking at about $150.00 for each Mass. Its easy to collect that much as long as folks show up. When attendance lags, as it will on ocassion, somebody has to dig into the pockets a little deeper.

Its best to form a Latin Mass group and assign a PR committee, cleanup, Sacristan, Altar boy training, getting the little red missalettes. We have been doing this for almost a year and a half now. Sometimes thing work great and other times things fall apart. (like when the men that do the collection don’t show up and no one notices in time) Or when the PR committee forgets to notify the newspaper. All you can do is trust God and go with the flow.

Good luck

 

[malphono]

You may well be right.
My thought in contacting the chancery would be for information and help in getting a celebrant since the past is, at present, unqualified.
My only concern about contacting the FSSP before the chancery is that, I believe, a religious order priest must have the permission of the Bishop to celebrate mass at a diocesan church. Again - I could be wrong.

True, but what you’re thinking of seems to be the case of a religious house of Pontifical Right where the clergy may or may not have faculties to offer Mass publicly elsewhere. Parishes in the charge of the FSSP are public and constituted within a diocese, so the priest(s) certainly have faculties to offer Mass publicly.

 

[JaMc]

The impression I get from the OP is that the only problem in arranging the EF is a celebrant.
. . . .

Right - getting the celebrant is the main issue. I believe there is a retired FSSP priest at their chapel (which is, actually, associated with a Diocesan parish), so I was thinking maybe he would be an option, as he still fills in there once in a while. The only other choices I can think of who would have been trained in the EF near my area are: (1) a retired Redemptorist priest, who is 80 years old, physically infirm and unable to get around much anymore (he, actually, was involved in getting the “indult” before the Summorum Pontificum, and attends the EF from time to time); and (2) a retired diocesan priest who is involved in the Charismatic Movement.