Getting two different versions of the same girl.

[Ophelia23]

I know this is basically just backing up what everyone else has said, but my advice is:

1. Call her, ask her if she would like to go out for some coffee. If you’re uncomfortable, invite a couple of friends first and then ask if she would like to join. There is nothing shameful in group gatherings to get to know one individual better.
2. Call her, ask if she would like to go out for some coffee. Same as number one, but that’s really the first and only step. To get to know someone, you have to arrange a chance for that to happen! It’s the bottom line! And if she is taken, it will come up. You don’t want to be that guy who steals another guy’s girl, but you also don’t want to be that guy who never asks.

*You can of course substitute coffee with anything. Go out for a drink, go for a walk, go for a quick lunch… do NOT ask to go to the movies. There is no talking and getting to know somebody at a movie.

 

[Xantippe]

Being boyfriend and girlfriend is not being “taken.” This woman is not the property of whoever she’s dating right now. If they were serious, they’d already be married or engaged.

Guys with iffy social skills can date and marry (it happens all the time), but it helps to be sweet, fun, a good listener, reasonably neat and hygienic, and professionally successful. The following characteristics doom men of your basic type:

1. stinginess
2. rigidity
3. obsessiveness
4. creepiness
5. poor hygiene

Good luck! Don’t be creepy! Ask her out, but if she says no, move on!

 

[JackieMom]

Being boyfriend and girlfriend is not being “taken.” This woman is not the property of whoever she’s dating right now. If they were serious, they’d already be married or engaged.

Guys with iffy social skills can date and marry (it happens all the time), but it helps to be sweet, fun, a good listener, reasonably neat and hygienic, and professionally successful. The following characteristics doom men of your basic type:

1. stinginess
2. rigidity
3. obsessiveness
4. creepiness
5. poor hygiene

Good luck! Don’t be creepy! Ask her out, but if she says no, move on!

Agree 1000% You can’t “steal” a girlfriend, as she is not property and has made no vows. May the best man win!

 

[Anglewannabe]

For a while now, I’ve had people coming to me about my standards and how either should lower them or if there’s anything they can do to help. Seeing as I’m doing whatever it takes now, I told them there were free to find someone who at least met over 60-70% of my specifications…

Why are other people finding you dates? Shouldn’t you seek God’s guidance

One day, one of them said they found a passer …

It is not nice to call potential dates ‘passers’

Now to make matters worse, I kind of heard that she may already have a guy. My real problem though is that the friend who told me has this other friend. This Other Friend doesn’t seem to think I was given the right picture and that I oughta give up on her.

I don’t know what to do. On one hand, I’ve got people telling me she’s an angel but on the other, I’ve got this one lady who says she’s a silent vixen or something (that’s my reforming her words politely mind you).

It doesn’t matter whether I end up giving up or going for it, I just can’t make a decision without more information. What do I do!? DX

P.S.

Please refrain from making any comments that tell me to slow down or think about dating/marriage some other time cuz I’m ‘still young.’ Frankly, I am tired of that. Not in the mood for it and would appreciate any other advice that deals with the above situation. Thank you.

I don’t think you are too young, but I do think your approach is immature. Asking a friend to introduce you is one thing, but asking friends info to get to know her is immature

 

[Lost_Wanderer]

Why are other people finding you dates? Shouldn’t you seek God’s guidance

I’ve been seeking ‘God’s guidance’ since high school. The fact that I’ve never had a girl should tell you what ‘God’s guidance’ is telling me I shouldn’t be lounging about anymore.

And no, do NOT tell me to consider the priesthood. I’ve had enough discernment to reject that calling. It’s not mine. Period.

It is not nice to call potential dates ‘passers’

Irrelevant.

I don’t think you are too young, but I do think your approach is immature. Asking a friend to introduce you is one thing, but asking friends info to get to know her is immature

I work in marketing. We use whatever it takes to know someone to help our salespeople strike a deal. That includes both direct interaction and what their friends/associates say.

And no, just because I ask her friends doesn’t mean I’m not doing anything myself. I’m just currently stuck right now upon hearing that she’s got a boyfriend.

As Zekariya pointed out, I don’t like to do something as break up a couple. Unfortunately, posters like you seem to think that’s either selfish or being too high-standard.

 

[Ellen_Mary]

The part that got me was the 60%-70% of your specifications.

She’s not an employee who’s resume you can request; maybe if you stop looking at women as just potential mates, and instead as people and friends - not a list to be checked off; you’d have better luck.

~ PetiteFoi

P.s. Since you brought it up, how young are you? I was married at 21 (hubby 24) and we were considered “young”

Yup

 

[Lost_Wanderer]

To those who tell me to basically just ask her out for coffee: Thanks. I’ll think about that. I’ve been asking advice from friends and family on what else to talk to her about. (Every time I get a chance to talk with her, there have been moments where I ‘run out of ammo’ so to speak. >_< )

Other pieces of advice are good too and thanks also to those who understand why I don’t like going for girls that are already dating other guys. I may not have a knight’s sense of honor but I still have my own brand. This brand tells me to not mess with other people’s love lives as a general rule of thumb (lest karma comes to nip my own).

Why not just ask her if she’s available?

Straight to the point eh? I’m considering that too. Any advice though to keep me from doing it like a blind rhino? >_>;;;

I kinda have a record for making my words more pointy when I’m at my most blunt if you know what I mean.

She’s not an employee who’s resume you can request; maybe if you stop looking at women as just potential mates, and instead as people and friends - not a list to be checked off; you’d have better luck.

Who says I’m not going the friendship route? I just don’t know how to keep going at this route. It’s not like I’m going to stop being friends with this girl just in case she doesn’t turn out the way I hoped.

I’m just currently lost at a crossroads right now. And about that resume bit, come on. Someone here already pointed out reasons for that and you oughta be glad I’m open to those who fit my description 60%-70%.

I don’t know if you buy Freudian psychology but I am NOT a guy who wants to marry/date a personality copy of his own mother (who, unfortunately, represent a majority of Filipino girls I’ve met).

P.S.

And yes, I’m very close to the age you got married. Very close.

And despite the fact that you indicate that others have declared your values out of synch you persisit.

No, I’m just tired of my own culture denying something about its own women: More tropical birds than doves that’ll give me peace and quiet.

Unfortunately, seems all the doves are more found in other countries.

 

[Xantippe]

“And about that resume bit, come on. Someone here already pointed out reasons for that and you oughta be glad I’m open to those who fit my description 60%-70%.”

I don’t know what you’re like in real life, but here you sound like a weird combination of 1) entitled 2) passive and 3) immature. That’s a killer combination if that’s how you come across in real life.

This is also kind of weird:

"No, I’m just tired of my own culture denying something about its own women: More tropical birds than doves that’ll give me peace and quiet.

“Unfortunately, seems all the doves are more found in other countries.”

If a country with a population of nearly 100,000,000 doesn’t have even one suitable single young woman for you, I don’t even know what to say. It’s possible there’s a terrible temperamental mismatch between you and your countrywomen, but in that case, get out of the Philippines and go elsewhere! (By the way, I think you won’t like Japan as much as you think you will.)

Again, dating is not married. It’s not even engaged. If she doesn’t have a ring on her finger, she is free.

 

[Lost_Wanderer]

I don’t know what you’re like in real life, but here you sound like a weird combination of 1) entitled 2) passive and 3) immature. That’s a killer combination if that’s how you come across in real life.

Entitled? How so? I don’t live on government handouts. Do you think I care if I rub some newbie poster who makes jabs like you do just because they don’t like the way I talk on the internet?

Newsflash: When you say you don’t know someone in real life and then just blatantly call them immature for what they put on an online forum, it says a lot more about YOUR maturity than it does about mine.

If a country with a population of nearly 100,000,000 doesn’t have even one suitable single young woman for you, I don’t even know what to say.

I take it you never assume anything about a person outside their online profiles. Typical. Let’s ignore the fact that even an entire country’s population is not immune to it cultural identities.

And by the way? Was that Japan comment really necessary? Stop lecturing me on maturity if you’re just going to be just another snide side-commentator. I’ve had my fill of presumptive people like you already on these boards.

 

[Kamaduck]

Entitled? How so? I don’t live on government handouts. Do you think I care if I rub some newbie poster who makes jabs like you do just because they don’t like the way I talk on the internet?

I’m pretty sure insults are against the rules, and the rules apply to everyone! :tsktsk:

Anyway. I don’t know what you’re like in real life, of course, but your attitude does seem a bit… off. I’m not quite sure how to put it. It could just be the way you word things, I’m not sure.

Perhaps the most unsettling thing is that your words don’t suggest that you think of this girl as a whole person- more like a challenge or a city to be conquered. I’ve read enough of your posts to know that you just talk in metaphoric or “battle” terms sometimes. It doesn’t change the fact that they sound strange (and a bit problematic) when applied to a woman. I don’t want to be too picky about your word choice, but in a forum, words are all we have to go on!

As far as how your actually proceeding, you sound like you’re doing OK. Ask her about her likes and dislikes. If you share an interest, it’ll be a lot easier to keep conversation going.

 

[Xantippe]

“Entitled? How so? I don’t live on government handouts.”

“Entitled” has a broader meaning.

Here, I mean that it sounds like you think that you can pick out a wife like a pair of shoes. Maybe you aren’t that way in real life, but that’s what your check list sounds like.

I know you hate what I said, but do you want to be right or do you want to be happy? What is the point of posting questions if you won’t listen to the answers?

I’m a 37-year-old married lady. I’m married to a REALLY geeky guy and I know a lot of happily married geeky guys. I don’t know the Philippines or you personally, but I do know how you get from point A to point B, and it’s not by snivelling in a corner and wishing girls were nicer to you. That brings out the worst in us.

I know this hurts, but it’s the only way.

 

[PatriceA]

I’m beginning to wonder if its a cultural difference. There’s another poster from the same part of the world that often states how hard it is to date in their culture. I’ve always found Lost Wanderer though to be very articulate in his other posts, I don’t think he’s immature. I think he’s struggling in this area, as I did at one time myself. I’m sure the dating world has change vastly since I was single 16 odd years ago. Can’t imagine what it must be like let alone in another culture.

 

[Anglewannabe]

I’ve been seeking ‘God’s guidance’ since high school. The fact that I’ve never had a girl should tell you what ‘God’s guidance’ is telling me I shouldn’t be lounging about anymore…

I can’t say what God’s guidance is for you since that is between you and God. However, praying to God about this girl would be better than asking friends.

And no, do NOT tell me to consider the priesthood. I’ve had enough discernment to reject that calling. It’s not mine. Period…

I NEVER said that. What makes you think I did

Irrelevant…

Calling a girl a ‘passer’ is very relevant. It turns women off and lessens your chances of a date

I work in marketing. We use whatever it takes to know someone to help our salespeople strike a deal. That includes both direct interaction and what their friends/associates say…

yes, but women are people not sales. I am simply trying to help you see how you come across to women. But if you don’t want my comments, just say so and I will quit posting

And no, just because I ask her friends doesn’t mean I’m not doing anything myself. I’m just currently stuck right now upon hearing that she’s got a boyfriend.

As Zekariya pointed out, I don’t like to do something as break up a couple. Unfortunately, posters like you seem to think that’s either selfish or being too high-standard.

I NEVER said you should break up a couple. Again, what makes you think I said that?

 

[Zekariya]

If a country with a population of nearly 100,000,000 doesn’t have even one suitable single young woman for you, I don’t even know what to say. It’s possible there’s a terrible temperamental mismatch between you and your countrywomen, but in that case, get out of the Philippines and go elsewhere!

It is an important decision to choose a just woman to walk in the Catholic Faith with. And, this is besides personality compatibility and general attractiveness. I am a 25 year old male and already feel like there are no women in my 40 mile radius that are compatible with me.

I think these are wise verses:

**Proverbs 31:10 Who shall find a valiant woman? far, and from the uttermost coasts is the price of her.
**
Proverbs 21:19 It is better to dwell in a wilderness, than with a quarrelsome and passionate woman.

Ecclesiasticus 25:23 And there is no anger above the anger of a woman. It will be more agreeable to abide with a lion and a dragon, than to dwell with a wicked woman.

2 Corinthians 6:14 Bear not the yoke with unbelievers. For what participation hath justice with injustice? Or what fellowship hath light with darkness?

 

[Lost_Wanderer]

Perhaps the most unsettling thing is that your words don’t suggest that you think of this girl as a whole person- more like a challenge or a city to be conquered.

Frankly, I’ve found it better on my emotional/spiritual/mental health to stop apologizing for being misinterpreted. It’s how I always end up on the losing side of bullying and doesn’t help my esteem to always give into people who don’t try just a teensy bit harder to see the bigger point. (Not you though.)

The fact is I don’t see this girl as an object at all (no matter how others somehow twist it that way from raw text). It’s not like I’m asking for a cheat code. I just want to learn. I just want facts. In this case, there are times when I run out of ideas on how I can get to know her more.

As far as how your actually proceeding, you sound like you’re doing OK. Ask her about her likes and dislikes. If you share an interest, it’ll be a lot easier to keep conversation going.

Actually, I was in the process of doing just this morning! HAHA! Yay! Still not sure if I can ask her about the whole boyfriend issue but threads like this are just part of my entire schem-I mean uh, thing I got going to find out. Yeah.

 

[Lost_Wanderer]

Here, I mean that it sounds like you think that you can pick out a wife like a pair of shoes. Maybe you aren’t that way in real life, but that’s what your check list sounds like.

Really? I don’t remember you even knowing what it is I’m looking for. How many more assumptions are you going to make me waste my time disproving here?

I know you hate what I said, but do you want to be right or do you want to be happy? What is the point of posting questions if you won’t listen to the answers?

Uh, I’ve pretty much listened (and acted upon) a lot of answers here… just not yours. If you’ve got a problem with that, well, your problem.

I’m a 37-year-old married lady. I’m married to a REALLY geeky guy and I know a lot of happily married geeky guys.

You are aware that the cultural gap between generations also applies to geeks?

I don’t know the Philippines or you personally, but I do know how you get from point A to point B, and it’s not by snivelling in a corner and wishing girls were nicer to you. That brings out the worst in us.

I don’t do that. Please. Just. Stop.

The closest thing you’ll get to what you just so ridiculously described is me grumbling and mentally doing this: :banghead: while simultaneously wondering what I screwed up. I don’t snivel. I don’t cry in corners. And I’m sooner prone to blaming myself than the female party.

I can’t say what God’s guidance is for you since that is between you and God. However, praying to God about this girl would be better than asking friends.

Oh rest assured, God’s in the mix here. Thanks for the reminder but I already know that one, anythin’ else?

I NEVER said that. What makes you think I did

I never said you did. It’s a safeguard statement/warning. I got those silly ‘consider the priesthood’ comments in the past as well.

-]Calling a girl a ‘passer’ is very relevant. It turns women off and lessens your chances of a date/-]

Ignoring this.

yes, but women are people not sales. I am simply trying to help you see how you come across to women. But if you don’t want my comments, just say so and I will quit posting

Missing the point. Stop assuming the way I ‘come across to women’ in a thread where I’m just asking about what course of action I need to take in a very specific situation I outlined in my OP.

I NEVER said you should break up a couple. Again, what makes you think I said that?

I’m sure that there are even some Americans who consider attempts to attract one half of a couple for yourself constitutes ‘breaking them up.’

I’m sure the dating world has change vastly since I was single 16 odd years ago. Can’t imagine what it must be like let alone in another culture.

Thank you! Look I may not be a global citizen but from what I observed in my American relatives, local relatives, and perhaps a hint or two from how women in different cultures are depicted in popular media, women here ARE the equivalent to tropical birds.

If American women think they get flak for talking too much, they oughta see the competition they have over here (and perhaps in other parts of South and Southeast Asia too).

 

[Xantippe]

"Really? I don’t remember you even knowing what it is I’m looking for. How many more assumptions are you going to make me waste my time disproving here? "

I think I remember your “want” list from another thread. It was epic, and not in a good way. Your old posts were very…memorable, I think is the right word.

 

[chevalier]

Lost Wanderer, as pal to pal, this is not a jab, you need a vacation, something to destress, a change of climate for a while, an engaging hobby, whatever it takes to chill a bit. I can see myself from several years ago in you. After dealing with a bunch of things, which isn’t really a finished process but anyway, I’ve become a bit less rigid, which is the better way to go here, I think.

As for the angel and the vixen (and yes, I know the significance of a she-fox over yonder but let’s not get there), every woman has both potentials but the one wins which she feeds. Just like the good wolf and bad wolf in us. Hero and villain. Or hero and loser. Don’t be surprised if you get a bit of both. What’s important is which wolf she’s inclined to feed. Also, remember about perspectives. The world considers us to be jerks when we oppose female ordination or gay marriage, or the “right to choose”. Not everyone who is said or taken by others to be a jerk really is one.

Now, as for the missing information, what you do when intel is scarce is recon by fire. (Just make sure you don’t walk into a mine field.) Drop her a line, ask her out. If a more open proposal wouldn’t work, just offer a concrete date and place. A method my friend used was to tell a girl he was going to X place on Y date and if she’d like to join him. Very good (it increases the incentive while at the same time decreasing the pressure) except in order not be lying you actually need to be going to that place even if she doesn’t go with you, I guess (I’m a bit OCD when it comes to the avoidance of lying). At any rate, you need more concrete, specific proposals with people who are busy or otherwise hard to reach. A tentative, “would you be interested in meeting up some day,” will result in a, “yeah, some day.” Very little progress.

If she says ok but after exams, then drop her a line one or two days after the exams, don’t push it. If she declines, come up with a different date or ask her when she expects to be free. You might as well get a reply to the effect that she doesn’t actually expect to be free, which means she’s basically preocuppied with other things and out of the dating (mine) field for a while.

If she keeps dodging your proposals, you want to dodge that girl unless you actually want to fight for every meeting, every conversation etc. (Or unless you can believe her that that’s not going to be the case but there’s a lot of things that people say and believe in what they say but are clueless about.) …Which is the future you get with compulsive date dodgers. I remember a thread here in these forums by a gentleman whose busy (with work or hobby or additional social activities, everything but not him) wouldn’t find five minutes for him in a whole day.

 

[chevalier]

Over coffee, I think asking her any other way would be a bit creepy, say over the internet.

It would be creepy even over coffee.

“I’ve been looking at you like this for a while now…”
“And…”
“And I’ve been wondering.”
“What have you been wondering about?”
“If you’re available.”
“Drop it, chev. Every single girl in this town knows… yadda yadda.”

Or, worse:

“What if I am?” (Wiggles and twirls a curl. Upon which you should run for dear life.)

If she says yes, then take it easy. Have a nice time without any pressure. Definitely don’t start asking questions which make you look like you are desperate to propose marriage, if you catch my drift. That will make you seem creepy, and scare her off.

Plus, if a girl’s not a keeper as a friend, she’s not a keep as a girlfriend. (Minor exception when she claims to be a friend while acting as a girlfriend, which is sort of okay when she does actually want to be your girlfriend but not when she actually really wants to remain just friends permanently.)

We used to call this the Cindy Crawford syndrome. Guys that waited and waited for the perfect lady to come along while all their friends were out having fun dating normal women. : )

It’s even more fun when the person who didn’t date all sorts of vaguely not bad people like others did actually does achieve the dream and find someone special. (Not talking about super model look really, though.)

Just ask her on a date. What do you have to lose? Do you really think that constitutes “girlfriend stealing?” If she’s not married, she’s free to go out with whomever she wants. If my husband had let my boyfriend at the time intimidate him, we might not be happily married today! Stop over-thinking this.

Well, if I had a so called girlfriend (“boy” and “girl” doesn’t sound right for adults), I would be pleased if she went on dates with guys. She could do that of course, but without continuing to be my girlfriend. And I’d probably not be interested in further participation in any capacity anyway barring someone who honestly admitted taking a step too far and asked to take it back, maybe.

Just wanted to say, this does not make you a coward. It makes you quite honorable. Generally (but not in all cases), it is the charitable thing to not steal another man’s girl. I commend you on that.

+1. Besides, don’t destroy something which is working.

Guys with iffy social skills can date and marry (it happens all the time), but it helps to be sweet, fun, a good listener, reasonably neat and hygienic, and professionally successful.

Actually, those are the qualities which make a woman think you’d be great in her friend zone.

Agree 1000% You can’t “steal” a girlfriend, as she is not property and has made no vows. May the best man win!

I take a different perspective—may the woman make her choice. I suppose your perspective is female-centric, while mine is a little in the opposite direction.

Now as for “no vows”, sure, a promise is not a vow, but I wouldn’t marry a woman whom I couldn’t trust with a blank cheque or with Brad Pitt in a dark locked room (or a gun etc.). I’d be understanding if she wanted to make sure (though I’d rather be told that openly), not close herself to meeting someone better etc., that’s all right if I’m afforded the same rights as she claims for herself in this regard (and I’m a bit skeptical as to how you would feel if the tables turned in your example, to be honest, that is if a man did the, “may the best girl win,” kind of thing), but if she actually broke a promise, even an implied one, the prospect would probably be dead even if she decided she were more interested in me than in the other guy. Friends don’t do such things to friends and I wouldn’t cast my lot with a woman who were not a friend I could depend on.

 

[Ophelia23]

I’m beginning to wonder if its a cultural difference. There’s another poster from the same part of the world that often states how hard it is to date in their culture. I’ve always found Lost Wanderer though to be very articulate in his other posts, I don’t think he’s immature. I think he’s struggling in this area, as I did at one time myself. I’m sure the dating world has change vastly since I was single 16 odd years ago. Can’t imagine what it must be like let alone in another culture.

I agree with this, and will also come to Lost Wanderer’s defense. I have never once gotten the impression from him that he is immature–quite the opposite. Articulate and thoughtful, but not immature. And he has made it clear that this is an area he struggles in, and I personally say “go for it, man.”