Girl Altar servers in Greek Catholic Church

[BernadetteM]

An Anglican priest made the comment that he has attended Greek Catholic parishes where there were girl altar servers. I was just wondering if this is allowed in Greek Catholic parishes. Are they not part of the Eastern Rite Catholilc Churches?

Yours in the Hearts of Jesus and Mary

Bernadette

 

[Phillip_Rolfes]

An Anglican priest made the comment that he has attended Greek Catholic parishes where there were girl altar servers. I was just wondering if this is allowed in Greek Catholic parishes. Are they not part of the Eastern Rite Catholilc Churches?

Yours in the Hearts of Jesus and Mary

Bernadette

They’re no more a part of any of the Eastern traditions as they are part of the Latin tradition. I do know it happens on rare occasions (I’ve seen photographic evidence, but never seen it in person), but MUCH less so than among Roman Catholics.

 

[Aramis]

An Anglican priest made the comment that he has attended Greek Catholic parishes where there were girl altar servers. I was just wondering if this is allowed in Greek Catholic parishes. Are they not part of the Eastern Rite Catholilc Churches?

Yours in the Hearts of Jesus and Mary

Bernadette

They are explicitly forbidden in the Metropolia of Pittsburg by the particular law.

When there is a new metropolitan, that might change, but I hope not.

 

[ConstantineTG]

They are explicitly forbidden in the Metropolia of Pittsburg by the particular law.

When there is a new metropolitan, that might change, but I hope not.

Does the same law in the Roman Church apply to the Eastern Churches? That a Bishop may allow or disallow female altar servers in their territory?

 

[Aramis]

Does the same law in the Roman Church apply to the Eastern Churches? That a Bishop may allow or disallow female altar servers in their territory?

No. The Ruthenian Particular Law was promulgated by the Metropolitan, on behalf of the hierarchs as a whole. It applies to all parishes and eparchies of the Metropolia. It bans women from all ministries behind the iconostas during liturgies and paraliturgies. (Amongst a number of other things… like what Ruthenian clerics are to wear…)

The Roman permission for women to serve comes from the CDW, as an interpretation of Canon Law. It’s a top down permission situation. For women to be allowed, the Bishop and the Pastor both must agree to it, and the implication is that also the National Conference must agree to it.

In the case of Eastern Churches, their governing council of hierarchs or governing synod may adjust the CCEO without recourse to the National Conferences, provided such adjustments receive approval from Rome.

Since the Metropolia has, though it’s hierarchs, banned women at the altar, and that is in a particular law promulgated with approval, no Ruthenian bishop may allow it, nor pastor, nor priest.

 

[josephdaniel29]

An Anglican priest made the comment that he has attended Greek Catholic parishes where there were girl altar servers. I was just wondering if this is allowed in Greek Catholic parishes. Are they not part of the Eastern Rite Catholilc Churches?

Yours in the Hearts of Jesus and Mary

Bernadette

Is it possible that he saw girls taking part in one of the entrances but not actually serving at the altar? The Greek parish here in town has a number of young girls who dress like acolytes and sit in the first pew but do not serve in the altar. When the Gifts are brought out at the Great Entrance they meet the procession after it has left the sanctuary and lead the way holding little vigil lamps. When the procession makes it’s way back to the ambo the girls peel off and go back to their spot in the first pew.

They are dressed just like the male acolytes so one who is not familiar with the liturgy could mistake them for servers.

In Christ
Joe

 

[Alveus_Lacuna]

Is it possible that he saw girls taking part in one of the entrances but not actually serving at the altar? The Greek parish here in town has a number of young girls who dress like acolytes and sit in the first pew but do not serve in the altar. When the Gifts are brought out at the Great Entrance they meet the procession after it has left the sanctuary and lead the way holding little vigil lamps. When the procession makes it’s way back to the ambo the girls peel off and go back to their spot in the first pew.

They are dressed just like the male acolytes so one who is not familiar with the liturgy could mistake them for servers.

If there is something offensive to some in not letting the girls serve, then to me this seems like an even bigger slap in the face, not a concession.

 

[josephdaniel29]

If there is something offensive to some in not letting the girls serve, then to me this seems like an even bigger slap in the face, not a concession.

I don’t think it has anything to do with being offended, it’s just an attempt to allow the girls to participate in some way. In my home parish the young girls hold the communion cloth, ring the bells for liturgy and receive the tithe. It gives them something to do that’s just for them.

In Christ
Joe

 

[Episc_Priest]

I got an email that this was a “hot topic”, checked it out, and I believe I am the Anglican priest mentioned at the beginning of the thread. I am married to a Greek Catholic and have in the past often attended divine liturgies at her family’s parish. Bernadette-- God bless you for your faithfulness and your calm, reasoned and irenic presence among us Anglicans hoping for unification with the Holy See-- I referred to girl altar servers in Anglo-Catholic parishes and to women reading the Epistle in the Greek Catholic parish. I am sorry if that was unclear. I consider both practices to be “normal” because that is what I have always experienced and have never been taught that it is contrary to Holy Tradition. At this point it is a matter of one’s preference to another’s. My own preference is for you, Bernadette, to read the Epistle and me to read the Gospel. Call me overly influenced by contemporary Catholic worship; I am willing to be schooled in proper liturgical practice. In the future Anglican Catholic Ordinariate I am prepared to follow the direction of the Synod and Ordinary. My only concern is to not exclude women from roles in worship for no good reason.

I wish all my Greek Catholic brothers and sisters God’s blessing and peace.

Fr. Bill

 

[BernadetteM]

I got an email that this was a “hot topic”, checked it out, and I believe I am the Anglican priest mentioned at the beginning of the thread. I am married to a Greek Catholic and have in the past often attended divine liturgies at her family’s parish. Bernadette-- God bless you for your faithfulness and your calm, reasoned and irenic presence among us Anglicans hoping for unification with the Holy See-- I referred to girl altar servers in Anglo-Catholic parishes and to women reading the Epistle in the Greek Catholic parish. I am sorry if that was unclear. I consider both practices to be “normal” because that is what I have always experienced and have never been taught that it is contrary to Holy Tradition. At this point it is a matter of one’s preference to another’s. My own preference is for you, Bernadette, to read the Epistle and me to read the Gospel. Call me overly influenced by contemporary Catholic worship; I am willing to be schooled in proper liturgical practice. In the future Anglican Catholic Ordinariate I am prepared to follow the direction of the Synod and Ordinary. My only concern is to not exclude women from roles in worship for no good reason.

I wish all my Greek Catholic brothers and sisters God’s blessing and peace.

Fr. Bill

From another post I believe that in other Eastern Rite churches girls, woman and even laymen are not allowed past the iconalist (sp). I am aware that some Eastern Rite churches have been latinized to some degree.

As a former Anglo Catholic we never had women or girls serving during the liturgy. Although is has become acceptable in some Anglo Catholic parishes now, as Anglicans in general seem to follow what the Catholic Church is doing, I find it causes problems. I have attended many Catholic masses where the priest and even if he has another priest there, he just sits on the side of the altar and the women and girls take over. Not even one male does the readings or serves. There are plenty of boys and men in the congregation.

This was not what VII specified, but as we all know the liberal priests and Bishops have encouraged this and many other innovations. Our Holy Father is trying to bring back the liturgy to the reverence of yesterday. It reminds me of abortion, it is a slippery slope, once something is allowed, then more and more unorthodox things are implemented.

This is one reason I feel the Pope wants the Ordinariate established, as he has watched the Anglican Use parishes over the years and has seen the beauty and reverence they have.

There are many types of services woman can serve within the Church, maybe it is behind the scenes, but their work is no less important than what male servers do. Our attention should be on Christ during the liturgy and at least to me it is distracting to see woman running around while the priest just sits in a chair.

I attend a traditional parish and none of the girls or woman feel in the least neglected and are very involved in many aspects of parish life. It is the most spiritual parish that I have been in since my conversion. I understand that Catholics are divided about this issue and many others. Hopefully in the future some of what is now accepted as the norm will be recognized as a movement which has taken away the reverence of the past.

I am sure that many Catholics will disagree with me, but most Catholics have never known anything else, but how the liturgy is celebrated today.

This is only my personal opinion and I accept the fact that people have the freedom to choose where they feel comfortable with the liturgy.

I am just wating for an Anglican Use parish where for me I connect very closely with Christ. For others it might be another path.

God Bless

Bernadette

 

[Diak]

The practice of only male servers is mentioned not once but twice in separate articles of the particular law for the Ukrainian Greek Catholic Church in the USA.

Article 278 of the Particular Law for the Ukrainian Greek Catholic Church in the USA:

Art. 278 –

1. Parish priests are obliged to instruct at” train properly as many acolytes (altar servers) as possible in the responses and ceremonies of the Divine Liturgy and other services.
   Only males may be altar servers in the Ukrainian Catholic Church. These servers of whatsoever age shall wear sticharion which shall in length reach down to their ankles
   and the sleeves to their wrists, thereby also replacing the cassocks. The use of any vestments of another sui iuris ritual Church is forbidden.

1. It is the continuous tradition of all Eastern Churches that only clerics are permitted to enter the Sanctuary. Altar servers have traditionally held the rank of sub-deacon. In
   places where this custom has fallen into disuse, boys may act in the stead of the sub-deacon provided the prescriptions of Article 278 are fulfilled. Since the subdiaconate
   is a clerical rank, those designated to act in place of an absent sub-deacon should be of the male gender. Under no circumstances, whatsoever are members of the female gender permitted to act as sub-deacons or altar servers.

Article 462:

Art. 462 - Only priests, deacons, minor clerics and servers (servers act in the role of minor clerics) are allowed in the sanctuary (altar). The laity who do not perform any function relating to the services must not be given a place in the sanctuary (altar). Women are never permitted in the sanctuary (altar) during any services.

 

[OrdinaryMelkite]

The Melkite Church I attend does not allow Women Altar Servers, as far as I know. However, women play a very integral part in our church anyways. For example, our Cantor is Female. And married to one of the Deacons. And their Down Syndrome-afflicted Son is one of the Altar Servers.

The Head of our Publican Prayer Group (which I am a proud member of) is Female.
One of our most active members is a 70ish Nun who is very Devout and very Beloved.
So we basically do not need Female Altar Servers to show our Honor of Women. Half of the Liturgy references and honors the Blessed Theotokos anyway.

 

[Episc_Priest]

OrdinaryMelkite,

My wife’s family is Melkite, though this branch being half-Italian worships in Latin Rite parishes. I have great love for your Church and I and their now departed giddoh taught my own little girls to cross themselves like Melkites and the Arabic expressions for God bless you, Thanks be to God, Thanks be to God at all times and the proper way to say “Amin”. I look forward to being received into the Catholic Church with my children so we can receive communion in both Eastern and Western Catholic churches.

God bless you and all the Melkite Church.

Fr. Bill

 

[OrdinaryMelkite]

OrdinaryMelkite,

My wife’s family is Melkite, though this branch being half-Italian worships in Latin Rite parishes. I have great love for your Church and I and their now departed giddoh taught my own little girls to cross themselves like Melkites and the Arabic expressions for God bless you, Thanks be to God, Thanks be to God at all times and the proper way to say “Amin”. I look forward to being received into the Catholic Church with my children so we can receive communion in both Eastern and Western Catholic churches.

God bless you and all the Melkite Church.

Fr. Bill

God bless you, Fr. Bill. May your welcome into Holy Mother Church come quickly.

 

[bkovacs]

If there is something offensive to some in not letting the girls serve, then to me this seems like an even bigger slap in the face, not a concession.

They can never be priests, so therefore why serve at the Holy Altar. The same reason, which tends to be deliberately ignored by Roman Catholic clergy, and some UGCC clergy with an anti-papal/anti-traditional agenda. Why is it that whenever this is brought up, that the real and truthful reason given is never accepted. And we keep on asking and asking and asking, until another more acceptable reason, which is NOT the reason is pronounced. I guess this is all part of the Western mentality.

 

[Diak]

They can never be priests, so therefore why serve at the Holy Altar. The same reason, which tends to be deliberately ignored by Roman Catholic clergy, and some UGCC clergy with an anti-papal/anti-traditional agenda.

And some Ruthenians, Melkites, Maronites and Armenians have experimented with them as well, as have some Orthodox (Greeks and OCA both have as well as Armenian Apostolic). The bottom line is that anyone is free to break the law when they want.

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

Is the rationale given for why girls shouldn’t be altar servers? They can’t serve because they can never be priests? This is absurd. I know married men at my church who altar serve sometimes. They could never be priests either? Is being an altar server about the potential to someday be a priest or is it about allowing boys and girls to participate in some way in helping the priest to celebrate Mass? This seems so arbitrary rather than backed up by good theology and reasoning? Obviously only a male should and can be a priest for reasons of standing in the place of Christ at the altar, standing as father, not mother. It also goes to tradition and the Scriptures. But allowing women to be lectors, altar servers, etc. I fail to see the problem there?

Why do we allow women to be extraordinary Eucharistic ministers and handle the Host and chalice and everything else but girls can’t help hold a book for a priest to read or ring a bell or carry a cross?

They can never be priests, so therefore why serve at the Holy Altar. The same reason, which tends to be deliberately ignored by Roman Catholic clergy, and some UGCC clergy with an anti-papal/anti-traditional agenda. Why is it that whenever this is brought up, that the real and truthful reason given is never accepted. And we keep on asking and asking and asking, until another more acceptable reason, which is NOT the reason is pronounced. I guess this is all part of the Western mentality.

 

[Aramis]

Is the rationale given for why girls shouldn’t be altar servers? They can’t serve because they can never be priests? This is absurd. I know married men at my church who altar serve sometimes. They could never be priests either?

Dead wrong. All men who are called may be priests. Some before marriage, some after widowerhood. And I know a few married catholic priests.

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

Relax with your “dead” wrongs, Aramis. I obviously know that some married men can become priests. But in the Latin West it isn’t going to happen and you know it. A married man cannot go and get ordained unless it’s in the Eastern rite or Anglican ordinariates or some special exceptions. Face it, the married guys participating in Mass as altar servers are not going to become priests.

The rationale here that girls cannot participate because they can never be priests is questionable at best. You’re basically demoding altar service to not service but on the job training, which it isn’t. I happen to be extremely, passionately opposed to women’s ordination. But allowing girls to serve at Mass? Give me a break; I have no problem with it. And I don’t look at altar service as only a step toward a future priesthood, but rather a special participation for kids and young people playing an important role at Mass worshipping their Lord.

Dead wrong. All men who are called may be priests. Some before marriage, some after widowerhood. And I know a few married catholic priests.

 

[Brendan]

Does the same law in the Roman Church apply to the Eastern Churches? That a Bishop may allow or disallow female altar servers in their territory?

The law that even permits them is Roman Canon Law. That only applies to the Latin sui juris Church.

The Eastern Churches have their own Code of Canon Law. So to even permit them would be up to the Synod of Bishops of the particular Church.