Glorifies: Now or Later?

[thenobes]

Hi all,

Just leaving this post to get others’ ideas as to what exactly Paul means in his statement “and he who He justified, He glorifies” in his epistle.

Is he talking about our current state, living in a state of Grace? Or does he mean “at the end of the world”?

Or both?

Especially am interested in ECF thoughts, if anyone is so knowledgeable of any.

I raise this issue because ISTM that if “glorify” means our current state (albeit not our final glorification) then Paul’s statement cannot be a basis for OSAS.

I will check back in a while, as I have to be away for some time.

peace
steve

 

[Teflon93]

If you’d be so kind as to provide the Scripture passage where Paul says this it would help us find relevant ECF commentary for you.

 

[thenobes]

…or thereabouts.

If you’d be so kind as to provide the Scripture passage where Paul says this it would help us find relevant ECF commentary for you.

For those whom He foreknew, He also predestined to become conformed to the image of His Son, so that He would be the firstborn among many brethren; and these whom He predestined, He also called; and these whom He called, He also justified; and these whom He justified, He also glorified.

I’m going to xref crosswalk.com’s interlinear greek study tool for similar uses of the verb for “glorified”. Be back.

peace
steve

 

[Teflon93]

…or thereabouts.

For those whom He foreknew, He also predestined to become conformed to the image of His Son, so that He would be the firstborn among many brethren; and these whom He predestined, He also called; and these whom He called, He also justified; and these whom He justified, He also glorified.

I’m going to xref crosswalk.com’s interlinear greek study tool for similar uses of the verb for “glorified”. Be back.

peace
steve

That helps. If no one’s responded by this evening I’ll check my Ancient Christian Commentary on Scripture for this passage and post results.

 

[bpbasilphx]

The Byzantine tradtion (both Orthodox and Catholic) see this as talking about theosis–the process of sanctification, which starts with baptism and continues throughout the world to come.

 

[thenobes]

Bless their souls!

Although they are definitely Protestant, they cannot help stumbling on the truth sometimes.

The word glorify, as the stem of the word in Romans 8:

Home > Lexicons > Greek > Doxazo
The KJV New Testament Greek Lexicon

Strong’s Number: 1392 Browse Lexicon
Original Word Word Origin
doxavzw from (1391)
Transliterated Word TDNT Entry
Doxazo 2:253,178
Phonetic Spelling Parts of Speech
dox-ad’-zo Verb

Definition
to think, suppose, be of opinion to praise, extol, magnify, celebrate to honour, do honour to, hold in honour to make glorious, adorn with lustre, clothe with splendour
to impart glory to something, render it excellent, to make renowned, render illustrious
to cause the dignity and worth of some person or thing to become manifest and acknowledged

King James Word Usage - Total: 62
glorify 54, honour 3, have glory 2, magnify 1, make glorious 1, full of glory 1

KJV Verse Count
Matthew 4
Mark 1
Luke 9
John 16
Acts 5
Romans 5
1 Corinthians 2
2 Corinthians 2
Galatians 1
2 Thessalonians 1
Hebrews 1
1 Peter 5
Revelation 2

---

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Total 54

Greek lexicon based on Thayer’s and Smith’s Bible Dictionary plus others; this is keyed to the large Kittel and the “Theological Dictionary of the New Testament.” These files are public domain.

Looks like OSAS is not supported here!

peace
steve

 

[Teflon93]

ECFs on Romans 8:30-

Origen:

I understand this, as do most people, to mean that someone who is justified is justified because he has been called, and that someone is called because he has been predestined, and that he is predestined because he has been foreknown…Those who think that God’s foreknowledge is limited to knowing what will happen in the future are obviously wrong, for there can be no divine foreknowledge without predestination—the two things go together…

But how can it be that all who are called should be justified, when we know that many are called but few are chosen? It seems to me that here we are talking about a different kind of calling. For indeed many are called, but not all are called according to God’s purpose…It is only those who are called according to his purpose who are justified. (Commentary on the Epistle to the Romans)

Ambrosiaster:

To “call” is to help somebody who is already thinking about faith or else to address him firmly in the knowledge that he will listen. (Commentary on Paul’s Epistles)

Chrysostom:

God justified them by the regeneration of baptism and glorified them by their adoption as sons. (Homilies on Romans 15)

Augustine:

Are all those who are called justified? “Many are called, but few are chosen.” But since the elect have certainly been called, it is obvious that they have not been justified without being called. But not everyone is called to justification; only those “who are called according to his purpose.” (Augustine on Romans 55)

Augustine:

God elected believers in order that they might believe, not because they already believed. (Predestination of the Saints 17.34)

 

[Teflon93]

Pelagius:

Those whom God knew in advance would believe, He called. A call gathers together those who are willing to come, not those who are unwilling…Paul says this because of the enemies of the faith, in order that they may not judge God’s grace to be arbitrary. They are called to believe through preaching and are justified through baptism when they believe, and are glorified with spiritual powers now or in the resurrection to come. (Pelagius’s Commentary on Romans)

Cyril of Alexandria:

Jesus said: “Come to me all who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.” He calls everyone to himself, and no one is lacking in the grace of his calling, for when he says everyone he excludes nobody. But those whom he long ago foresaw would come into being he predestined to participate in the future blessings and called them to receive justification by faith in him and not to sin again. (Explanation of the Letter to the Romans)

Theodoret of Cyr:

Those whose intention God foreknew he predestined from the beginning. Those who are predestined, he called, and those who were called, he justified by baptism. Those who were justified, he glorified, calling them children: “To all who received him, who believed in his name, he gave power to become children of God.” Let no one say that God’s foreknowledge was the unilateral cause of these things. For it was not foreknowledge which justified people, but God knew what would happen to them, because he is God. (Interpretation of the Letter to the Romans)

 

[Teflon93]

Net-net for the ECFs is that we are glorified at baptism by being adopted as God’s children.