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kvj888
Guest
can a priest kick out a child out of the church if that 2 years old child is baby talking?
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Rence
Guest
No. Did Jesus expell babies from his sermons?
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Tantum_ergo
Guest
Um, exactly what do you mean by ‘kick out’ and 'baby talking"?
First of all, where is the child’s parent/guardian? Two year olds don’t come to Mass alone.
If a child --and by ‘2 year old’ one can mean anything from exactly 2 today to 2 years, 11 months, and 30 days, IOW almost 3–is making earsplitting and unceasing ‘baby talk’ sounds and disrupting everyone around him/her and even drowning out the priest, all through the entire Mass, it would be both common sense and common COURTESY for the parents to take the child out of Mass and even possibly out of the building if he or she is that loud. That’s how children learn that there are consequences to bad behavior. If the normal family practice after Mass is to go out to McDonald’s, then if they have to take the child out for making too much noise, they don’t go to McDs and explain that bad behavior at Mass means nobody goes to McDs. Pretty soon the child will be quiet during Mass in order to gain the ‘reward’ of McD afterward.
A priest is a pastor and he owes a duty not just to that child but to everybody in his parish. If time after time people are coming to Mass and a child’s parent/guardian is not properly parenting or disciplining or teaching that child so that the child is loudly disruptive on a regular basis, then pray tell what recourse do the priest and people have? If the parent is not going to do the right thing until the priest has to verbally cue, “the child cannot be here disrupting people, please take him/her out until she/he is quieter”, then the priest has to tell that parent in order to do the responsible thing for the other people.
Now if the child is just now and then making a slight noise, but not really bothersome or intrusive, and the priest stops Mass to rant and rave, “There will be SILENCE in this Church from all people, no matter how young, and that child’s noise is not tolerated, you may NEVER return here!”. . .well, that would be a different kettle of fish.
JMO.
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Tantum_ergo
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We don’t know, Rence. Nobody kept a record.
And after all, if a 2 year old were making noise, the PARENTS probably apologized and took the child off to the side until he or she quieted down. Jesus wouldn’t have to TELL a responsible parent to discipline a child appropriately. So He wouldn’t have to expel a child, because the parents already acted like responsible parents.
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St_Francis
Guest
I spent years in the foyer during Mass with my little ones as they learned to be quiet at Mass.
This bothered me a lot until I saw a family leaving with their son because he was making too much noise. The thing was that their son had Cerebral palsy and couldn’t help making the noise despite being in his 20’s. After that, I offered up my time oitside for him and his family and others in the same position.
We just have to remember that the delightful sounds our beloved baby makes may be making it very hard for those around us, some of whom may not know English well, others of whom may be hard of hearing, and others may be suffering in other ways.
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NFrancis
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A priest certainly has the authority to do such a thing in his own parish. However, at my parish it is typically just ignored and they go through the liturgy like nothing is happening. In some settings it may be better for a priest to ask the parents to take their baby out of the area so no one is distracted. Actually, this is just common courtesy and common sense. I think I should also add that even if we believe our priest to be making a not-so-good decision, we should respect that decision and give them the benefit of the doubt (not just because they are priests, but all people deserve our respect and should be given the benefit of the doubt).
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OrdinaryMelkite
Guest
My Melkite church is small and unfotunately does not have a “children’s room” that big Catholic Churches have----so yes, we DO have occasional "problems’ with children and babies talking. Everybody rolls with it and accepts it. It DOES get slightly annoying during the Priest’s Sermon, but usually the parents either take the child out or simple manage to calm the child down with pacifiers or some other distraction so it not a PERSISTENT distraction.
We had one child like that for a long time—named Bella—adorable child, but she was around three years old and liked to babble intermittently during the service. No screaming, though. She always comes with her father, so she was calmed down by him eventually. As she grows older, she has “matured” more and is now mostly quiet during the service. She even tries to sing along to the Kontakions and chants------very funny. She has also developed a habit of going to the bathroom every 20 minutes or so----so she is escorted out by her daddy to the back of the church and evrything is quiet anyway for a while. Shei is good generally now.
OTOH, we now have new parishioners with two children—one of them a months-old infant baby boy. You can imagine already. Everybody understands, though, and “rolls with it.”
Great thread.
We had one child like that for a long time—named Bella—adorable child, but she was around three years old and liked to babble intermittently during the service. No screaming, though. She always comes with her father, so she was calmed down by him eventually. As she grows older, she has “matured” more and is now mostly quiet during the service. She even tries to sing along to the Kontakions and chants------very funny. She has also developed a habit of going to the bathroom every 20 minutes or so----so she is escorted out by her daddy to the back of the church and evrything is quiet anyway for a while. Shei is good generally now.
OTOH, we now have new parishioners with two children—one of them a months-old infant baby boy. You can imagine already. Everybody understands, though, and “rolls with it.”
Great thread.
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SORROWS
Guest
“Let the children come to me”
I asked my local priest once about how embarrassed I am when my granddaughter makes noise during Mass and he said to let her stay and in time she will learn how to keep silent and behave. His point was that we shouldn’t miss Mass and deprive ourselves and our children from being a part of the most Holy of Hours - Mass.
I asked my local priest once about how embarrassed I am when my granddaughter makes noise during Mass and he said to let her stay and in time she will learn how to keep silent and behave. His point was that we shouldn’t miss Mass and deprive ourselves and our children from being a part of the most Holy of Hours - Mass.
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Tantum_ergo
Guest
That’s why I was careful to remark that IF the parents did not remove a child who was causing visible distraction for a prolonged period of time (more than 5-10 minutes) , which should be common courtesy, then the priest might have to remark, for the sake of the other people, that the child should go out until she or he was quietER. Obviously no little one is going to be completely quiet, especially in our more permissive age.“Let the children come to me”
I asked my local priest once about how embarrassed I am when my granddaughter makes noise during Mass and he said to let her stay and in time she will learn how to keep silent and behave. His point was that we shouldn’t miss Mass and deprive ourselves and our children from being a part of the most Holy of Hours - Mass.
Your granddaughter is probably among the 99% of children who make an occasional noise which is understandable, normal, and acceptable behavior for a child.
But there is that 1% who make an unacceptable and CONTINUAL distraction.
Unlike you (showing concern about noise), the parents are not concerned and do not even think about discipline --perhaps they’re too exhausted or ill themselves, we don’t know. Perhaps they weren’t given good discipline when they were young.
I’d say that most of the people reading along here on a Catholic forum are the type of parents who would be alert to the noise their children make and WOULD take the child out unless they were assured by people and priest that the noise was ‘acceptable.’
But it’s the tiny minority of people who are not doing their jobs as parents (and even here as I said the parent could be ill or exhausted and less culpable) who might need some ‘help’ to help their children learn acceptable behavior and the idea of actions having consequences.
I would HOPE that the priest would be sensitive and understanding (not throwing a hissy). . . but while the majority of ‘child noise’ is accepable and intermittent, we have to be careful not to think that ANY level of noise or ANY behaviors by a child, including screaming, yelling, running around through the entire Mass, are to be ‘accepted’ because "Jesus wouldn’t scold the child’. (Personally, I think JESUS would just LOOK at the running child and the CHILD would get the message, and sit right down. I DON’T think that Jesus would ignore the bad behavior and burble about sweet little tots as a child was biting his leg or doing handstands on the altar.). . .
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Catholic90
Guest
The parents should show common courtesy by removing the loud child, or teaching the child to be quiet in these situations. If concerned, talk to the priest. Continually screaming children can be a distraction and can make it hard for others to hear. Children talking should be taught there is a time and a place for everything.
We have a family who has a disabled child who vocalizes loudly at random times. He cannot control himself. Everyone understands that. However, the child who vocalizes loudly can be taught to control him or herself. Two is not too young to understand that.
We have a family who has a disabled child who vocalizes loudly at random times. He cannot control himself. Everyone understands that. However, the child who vocalizes loudly can be taught to control him or herself. Two is not too young to understand that.
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Michaeljc4
Guest
The churches near my home (in the Archdiocese of Boston) have “children’s masses.” Kids generally go to those, and it is understood that there will be a certain level of noise. For other masses, yes, kids can be very distracting, but take my word for it: many mainline Protestant churches would be very happy to have too many kids in the pews, loud or quiet. Likewise, be happy that people are bringing their kids to mas at all in the wake of all the sexual abuse scandals, another of which is erupting in Kansas City, MO. Is there no bottom to this sewer?
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