God, male, female, neither?

[shocktrooper]

No.

From the very beginning, it is said, God made man(kind) in his image." His is best used because at the time of the writers of the books of the bible, they could only conceive of men as being the “People of God,” since women, even in the most liberal traditions were still seen as extensions of their men, or as belongings.

Now that society and men alike understand that women are their own persons, we can read this passage as it was intended. God made man and woman because God is not “neither male nor female,” God is both. How else can God create on his/her own? He is the ultimate creator, and like an asexual being he/she is both.

Consider a sponge in the ocean. It is a living being, but it has no sex. It is both Male and Female, and continues to grow… never does it truly die because the parts that do are replaced by the new life of the same piece of sponge…

God is both Male and Female. God appeared to many, including Moses, and those interpreted him as male. This is solely the way that God chose to appear to them, perhaps for cultural reasons perhaps because in those early spiritual stages we (humans) could not have recognized him as both sexes. I believe that Jesus would have called him Father because Jesus already had a biological Mother, Mary. Why would he then call God Mother? It has nothing to do with anatomy, nor physiology, nor sex at all-afterall, God can create out of him/herself, so why would God need a sex organ?

God is both Male and Female. If you are comfortable calling God Mother, then you can do so. You’re not going to get into trouble, in fact I know a handful of Catholic Nuns that call God Mother. Take care.

God is not male or female and does have both within HIM, but He is masculine. Dr. Kreeft has a great presentation on this. It touches on how our soul animates and forms our bodies. Since my soul is masculine, I am male. Since your soul is feminine, you are female. Since God the Father is masculine, Jesus is male. It is a philosophical argument and also a Scriptural one since Sacred Scripture cannot be changed to fit a certain generation like pilots13 desires. If the nuns you know call God, mother, then I would have nothing to do with them since they have been deceived by Satan on the nature of Who God is. Calling God, “mother”, has been condemned by our Church and no amount of dissent will change that.

Also, changing the language to be more non-exclusive blurs the common theme that runs between the Old and New Testaments. Many New Testament references about the Messiah and others refer back to the Old Testament. Changing one or both will cause people to miss prophesies in the Old Testament. I can only think of one person that would like to see that happen.

Pax Christi.

 

[Whadyamean]

Is God male, female, or gender neutral?

This is confusing for me, because while in the Catechism it says that God is neither male nor female, and has properties of both mother and father…

…in the Bible God is described as “He” and Jesus calls him “Father” not “Mother.”

So why is this? Is God male in the Bible because the languages of the time were like English in that “he” is the generic pronoun and “she” is used only when the subject is known to be female?

Is it appropriate to call God Mother as well as Father?

Thanks!

As children we often learn about things at the level of our capacity. And all humans think by means of symbols. Often, just as parables have more secret meanings, (Mark 4:33-34) and Maurice Nicoll~ The New Man: Some interpretations of the parables and miracles of Christ, so do these symbols. In other words, we have to talk to each other in terms that a general audience can understand. But as we mature, many of these symbols become more transparent through the exigencies and rewards of our experience. This is a reason, perhaps, hat the Sun has so often been used as a symbol for God. It has no gender, no life on Earth would live without it’s presence, and it is totally impartial to what it sheds its light on and we can take advantage of its energy as we wish, or not.

But in the case of the Abrahamic religions, of which Catholicism is one, the symbolism is heavily familial. Therefore Father God as the religion derives from a paternalistic society where males had all the power and women were nearly property. So no “Mother” God, despite many other religions worshiping a female deity due to the abundant and gifting nature of the world.

But in these days many often refer to God as Father-Mother. Mary Baker Eddy, the founder of Christian Science and a great healer, referred to God that way and amended the Our Father to conform to her idea that God is the potential behind the perfection of gender. Any thinking person of faith likely thinks that way, but she out and just says it. Other people of faith, not necessarily Catholic, also follow this custom, or use some other word, like Light, Truth, Love, Spirit, Soul, Mind, or Principle to go by the usual potential misperceptions inherent in the usual usage of the word God in our particular culture.

Hope that helps.

 

[shocktrooper]

As children we often learn about things at the level of our capacity. And all humans think by means of symbols. Often, just as parables have more secret meanings, (Mark 4:33-34) and Maurice Nicoll~ The New Man: Some interpretations of the parables and miracles of Christ, so do these symbols. In other words, we have to talk to each other in terms that a general audience can understand. But as we mature, many of these symbols become more transparent through the exigencies and rewards of our experience. This is a reason, perhaps, hat the Sun has so often been used as a symbol for God. It has no gender, no life on Earth would live without it’s presence, and it is totally impartial to what it sheds its light on and we can take advantage of its energy as we wish, or not.

But in the case of the Abrahamic religions, of which Catholicism is one, the symbolism is heavily familial. Therefore Father God as the religion derives from a paternalistic society where males had all the power and women were nearly property. So no “Mother” God, despite many other religions worshiping a female deity due to the abundant and gifting nature of the world.

But in these days many often refer to God as Father-Mother. Mary Baker Eddy, the founder of Christian Science and a great healer, referred to God that way and amended the Our Father to conform to her idea that God is the potential behind the perfection of gender. Any thinking person of faith likely thinks that way, but she out and just says it. Other people of faith, not necessarily Catholic, also follow this custom, or use some other word, like Light, Truth, Love, Spirit, Soul, Mind, or Principle to go by the usual potential misperceptions inherent in the usual usage of the word God in our particular culture.

Hope that helps.

In Catholicism, the priest represents God to the people. This is why there will ALWAYS be a MALE ONLY priesthood. This is the underlining reason why some what to change the nature of God. They want to make it so that a woman can represent God to the people; they want to bring in priestesses. Most people that identify with God as “mother” have no problem with women priests. Calling God “mother” is the handmaid to a female priesthood. The bottom line is that they don’t understand the OT Levitical Priesthood which means they have no way of understanding the Catholic Priesthood.

Pax Christi.

 

[Dakota_Roberts]

As children we often learn about things at the level of our capacity. And all humans think by means of symbols. Often, just as parables have more secret meanings, (Mark 4:33-34) and Maurice Nicoll~ The New Man: Some interpretations of the parables and miracles of Christ, so do these symbols. In other words, we have to talk to each other in terms that a general audience can understand. But as we mature, many of these symbols become more transparent through the exigencies and rewards of our experience. This is a reason, perhaps, hat the Sun has so often been used as a symbol for God. It has no gender, no life on Earth would live without it’s presence, and it is totally impartial to what it sheds its light on and we can take advantage of its energy as we wish, or not.

But in the case of the Abrahamic religions, of which Catholicism is one, the symbolism is heavily familial. Therefore Father God as the religion derives from a paternalistic society where males had all the power and women were nearly property. So no “Mother” God, despite many other religions worshiping a female deity due to the abundant and gifting nature of the world.

But in these days many often refer to God as Father-Mother. Mary Baker Eddy, the founder of Christian Science and a great healer, referred to God that way and amended the Our Father to conform to her idea that God is the potential behind the perfection of gender. Any thinking person of faith likely thinks that way, but she out and just says it. Other people of faith, not necessarily Catholic, also follow this custom, or use some other word, like Light, Truth, Love, Spirit, Soul, Mind, or Principle to go by the usual potential misperceptions inherent in the usual usage of the word God in our particular culture.

Hope that helps.

God’s attributes are masculine

In Catholicism, the priest represents God to the people. This is why there will ALWAYS be a MALE ONLY priesthood. This is the underlining reason why some what to change the nature of God. They want to make it so that a woman can represent God to the people; they want to bring in priestesses. Most people that identify with God as “mother” have no problem with women priests. Calling God “mother” is the handmaid to a female priesthood. The bottom line is that they don’t understand the OT Levitical Priesthood which means they have no way of understanding the Catholic Priesthood.

Pax Christi.

Actually the male priest is because *in persona Christi *

 

[pilots13]

If God is neither male or female, then how can God be masculine? When a woman is say a body builder, we say she is masculine, but we still call her a she. So if God is neither male or female, and even if God has masculine traits (which how do we know that as no one as truly seen God) then why call God a he? Why not just call God, God, or I AM, or something similar?

“the priest represents God to the people.” Don’t we all represent God to each other?
“And the King will say, ‘I tell you the truth, when you did it to one of the least of these my brothers and sisters, you were doing it to me!’” Matthew 25:40

And one last point, I don’t agree with referring to God as a female any more than I do to referring to God as a male.

 

[shocktrooper]

God’s attributes are masculine

Actually the male priest is because *in persona Christi *

Yes, I do agree, good point. But the Person of Christ is masculine because Him and the Father are one. The Father is masculine, which means the Son had to be male when taking on human flesh. God’s nature being poured out into space and time means that Christ in His divine nature is masculine. He took on a human nature but it did not do away with the divine, but are perfectly united in this Hypostatic Union.Thanks for making that point.

The logic follows like this…

Person…Divine Nature…Human Nature
God the Father…masculine…n/a
the Son…masculine…male
Priesthood…n/a…male

Pax Christi.

 

[shocktrooper]

If God is neither male or female, then how can God be masculine?

You will have to ask HIM, but I don’t think this mystery will be solved for you in this life. This is just one of those things we need to accept in humility. Not everything needs to be so clear for us.

So if God is neither male or female, and even if God has masculine traits (which how do we know that as no one as truly seen God)

Jesus knows the Father because they are one. I think I will just go with His word in Sacred Scripture.

then why call God a he?

because Jesus knows the Father better than anyone, and He called Him, “Father”.

Why not just call God, God, or I AM, or something similar?

Why not just call Him what Jesus said to call Him? Our Father…

“the priest represents God to the people.” Don’t we all represent God to each other?

No, when we are talking about the priesthood, this is not the case. All can represent the people to God but not the other way around.

“And the King will say, ‘I tell you the truth, when you did it to one of the least of these my brothers and sisters, you were doing it to me!’” Matthew 25:40

This has nothing to do with what we are talking about in this thread.

And one last point, I don’t agree with referring to God as a female any more than I do to referring to God as a male.

God is pure spirit for sure, but Divine Revelation tells us that He is masculine and a Father. I see no reason for not agreeing with this. This is more likely an issue because of the way you view Divine Revelation. It seems that you think only human elements brought about Sacred Scripture and that there was no Divine help or inspiration.

Pax Christi.

 

[Whadyamean]

If God is neither male or female, then how can God be masculine? When a woman is say a body builder, we say she is masculine, but we still call her a she. So if God is neither male or female, and even if God has masculine traits (which how do we know that as no one as truly seen God) then why call God a he? Why not just call God, God, or I AM, or something similar?

“the priest represents God to the people.” Don’t we all represent God to each other?
“And the King will say, ‘I tell you the truth, when you did it to one of the least of these my brothers and sisters, you were doing it to me!’” Matthew 25:40

And one last point, I don’t agree with referring to God as a female any more than I do to referring to God as a male.

Good points. My preference is I AM. I’m not a Christian Scientist, but MBE, the founder, used seven synonyms for God: Life, Truth, Love, Mind, Soul, Spirit, and Principle. Principle is an excellent one, too.

 

[pilots13]

You will have to ask HIM, but I don’t think this mystery will be solved for you in this life. This is just one of those things we need to accept in humility. Not everything needs to be so clear for us.

In other words, we will never know that God is masculine. We’re just assuming and going with it.

Jesus knows the Father because they are one. I think I will just go with His word in Sacred Scripture.
because Jesus knows the Father better than anyone, and He called Him, “Father”.
Why not just call Him what Jesus said to call Him? Our Father…

“Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the city that kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to it! How often have I desired to gather your children together as a hen gathers her brood under her wings, and you were not willing!”
Here’s Jesus referring to God as a mother hen. So which Jesus is right? The one you quoted saying Our Father or the one I quoted saying mother hen?

No, when we are talking about the priesthood, this is not the case. All can represent the people to God but not the other way around.
This has nothing to do with what we are talking about in this thread.

I feel my scripture quote is relevant. You said only the Priest represents God, and this is Jesus saying we all represent God (which I believe, that God is in every one of us and we, God’s people, are all representative of God). In that passage Jesus, speaking as God on judgement day says anything you did to another, you did to me, meaning that other person represents God. Notice it doesn’t say “you were doing it to my people” but rather “you were doing it to me”

Lastly, random question related to this topic. If I say, “This has been a great day, God has blessed me! God is good!” is that wrong? Should I have said “This has been a great day, God as blessed me! He is good!”

 

[Whadyamean]

“Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the city that kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to it! How often have I desired to gather your children together as a hen gathers her brood under her wings, and you were not willing!”
Here’s Jesus referring to God as a mother hen. So which Jesus is right? The one you quoted saying Our Father or the one I quoted saying mother hen?

I love this!!! And we might also ask, then, are women not made in the image and likeness of God, only males? If they aren’t, why did Jesus bother with them at all instead of them figuring large in His life? and if not, why are they allowed in the Church at all? And the following adds even more weight to Pilot’s take:

I feel my scripture quote is relevant. You said only the Priest represents God, and this is Jesus saying we all represent God (which I believe, that God is in every one of us and we, God’s people, are all representative of God). In that passage Jesus, speaking as God on judgement day says anything you did to another, you did to me, meaning that other person represents God. Notice it doesn’t say “you were doing it to my people” but rather “you were doing it to me”

 

[Holly3278]

Well, let’s see, we have God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit. God the Father does not have a body but we do call him Father so I would say that if he does have a gender, he is male. God the Son clearly is male. As for God the Holy Spirit, I am not sure. I could be wrong on this. However, we can be certain that Jesus Christ was male.

 

[Dakota_Roberts]

If God is neither male or female, then how can God be masculine? When a woman is say a body builder, we say she is masculine, but we still call her a she. So if God is neither male or female, and even if God has masculine traits (which how do we know that as no one as truly seen God) then why call God a he? Why not just call God, God, or I AM, or something similar?

“the priest represents God to the people.” Don’t we all represent God to each other?
“And the King will say, ‘I tell you the truth, when you did it to one of the least of these my brothers and sisters, you were doing it to me!’” Matthew 25:40

And one last point, I don’t agree with referring to God as a female any more than I do to referring to God as a male.

God has no physical body, but He has a masculine reality, He is God the Father, if He was trying to avoid masculinity or femininity He would have used Creator.

 

[TheRealJuliane]

I do not believe that God came to us in male form by accident. He intended to come as a man, not a woman, or He would have been a woman. I reject the image of God as a woman, such as in the book “The Shack,” where God is pictured as a large black woman.

God chose his form, and Jesus knows that God is Father. So if Jesus is God and God is Jesus, they are both masculine.

I have no problem with this, and when people say “God…She” I think they are very misguided.

 

[Dakota_Roberts]

I do not believe that God came to us in male form by accident. He intended to come as a man, not a woman, or He would have been a woman. I reject the image of God as a woman, such as in the book “The Shack,” where God is pictured as a large black woman.

God chose his form, and Jesus knows that God is Father. So if Jesus is God and God is Jesus, they are both masculine.

I have no problem with this, and when people say “God…She” I think they are very misguided.

I and the father are one, how could Jesus be one with a woman

 

[Whadyamean]

I and the father are one, how could Jesus be one with a woman

Well enough, but again, where does that leave women who we believe to be created in the image and likeness of God along with men? How does that work?

Something I stated elsewhere might apply here:

As children we often learn about things at the level of our capacity. And all humans think by means of symbols. Often, just as parables have more secret meanings, (Mark 4:33-34) and Maurice Nicoll~ The New Man: Some interpretations of the parables and miracles of Christ, so do these symbols. In other words, we have to talk to each other in terms that a general audience can understand. But as we mature, many of these symbols become more transparent through the exigencies and rewards of our experience. This is a reason, perhaps, that the Sun has so often been used as a symbol for God. It has no gender, no life on Earth would live without it’s presence, and it is totally impartial to what it sheds its light on and we can take advantage of its energy as we wish, or not.

But in the case of the Abrahamic religions, of which Catholicism is one, the symbolism is heavily familial. Therefore “Father God” as the religion derives from a paternalistic society where males had all the power and women were nearly property. So no “Mother” God, despite there being many other religions worshiping a female deity due to the abundant and gifting nature of Creation.

But in these days many often refer to God as Father-Mother. Mary Baker Eddy, the founder of Christian Science and a great healer, referred to God that way and amended the Our Father to conform to her idea that God is the potential behind the perfection of gender. Any thinking person of faith likely thinks that way, but she out and just says it. Other people of faith, not necessarily Catholic, also follow this custom, or use some other word, like Light, Truth, Love, Spirit, Soul, Mind, or Principle to go by the usual potential misperceptions inherent in the usual usage of the word God in our particular culture.

 

[shocktrooper]

In other words, we will never know that God is masculine. We’re just assuming and going with it.

We know He is masculine because He has told us so in Sacred Scripture. We may never understand it though, which is fine. There are mysteries in our faith. God being masculine and a father is not a mystery, but how this can be with our finite minds is the mystery for us.

“Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the city that kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to it! How often have I desired to gather your children together as a hen gathers her brood under her wings, and you were not willing!”

Here’s Jesus referring to God as a mother hen. So which Jesus is right? The one you quoted saying Our Father or the one I quoted saying mother hen?

So God is now a mother hen? Let’s read this closely.

How often have* I *desired to gather your children together as a hen gathers her brood under her wings…

Ok. The “I” underlined is Jesus. We know Jesus is male and is the face of the unseen God (Father). The “as” starts the next half that is simply giving Jerusalem a common understanding as to how the Father will gather his children. You are taking this to mean way too much. If we take it for what you want, then God is not only a female, but a female hen, with wings and a beak.

I feel my scripture quote is relevant. You said only the Priest represents God, and this is Jesus saying we all represent God (which I believe, that God is in every one of us and we, God’s people, are all representative of God). In that passage Jesus, speaking as God on judgement day says anything you did to another, you did to me, meaning that other person represents God. Notice it doesn’t say “you were doing it to my people” but rather “you were doing it to me”

Yes, God sustains all life; a certain part of Him lives in all of us, including the rest of creation. So can a dolphin represent God to us just because the life of God is in the dolphin and keeps it in existence? This passage is simply speaking of the love of neighbor we are supposed to have OUT OF LOVE for God, not because they represent God. I understand what you are saying but you are drawing a parallel between two things with no Church teaching to back you. This tactic is very dangerous and has been the cause of many schisms in the Church.

Lastly, random question related to this topic. If I say, “This has been a great day, God has blessed me! God is good!” is that wrong? Should I have said “This has been a great day, God as blessed me! He is good!”

No, that is not wrong. Neither of those responses are wrong. But if you said “… She is good”, then that would be wrong.

Pax Christi.

 

[shocktrooper]

I love this!!! And we might also ask, then, are women not made in the image and likeness of God, only males? If they aren’t, why did Jesus bother with them at all instead of them figuring large in His life? and if not, why are they allowed in the Church at all? And the following adds even more weight to Pilot’s take:I love this!!! And we might also ask, then, are women not made in the image and likeness of God, only males? If they aren’t, why did Jesus bother with them at all instead of them figuring large in His life? and if not, why are they allowed in the Church at all?

Well enough, but again, where does that leave women who we believe to be created in the image and likeness of God along with men? How does that work?

Women are absolutely created in the image and likeness of God. No one has ever said otherwise here. Our Blessed Mother Mary was the only person created and conceived without sin and stayed pure her whole life. That is the greatest honor that a woman can have. Instead of women trying to do the impossible and become a priest, they should emulate Mary. What a great role that would be to the Church! Men and women are both created in the image and likeness of God but that does not mean that men and women are the same and have the same functions. Men can’t have children, is God unfair to men? Where is the justice? Are men now not created in the image and likeness of God because we can’t bear children? No, not at all! Each part of the Body of Christ (Church) is part of the same Church but have their own part. A hand can’t compensate for the foot when the foot is cut off. The point is that men have always represented God to the people and this role cannot be assumed properly by a woman. No matter how hard we try, it is impossible.

 

[Whadyamean]

Women are absolutely created in the image and likeness of God. No one has ever said otherwise here. Our Blessed Mother Mary was the only person created and conceived without sin and stayed pure her whole life. That is the greatest honor that a woman can have. Instead of women trying to do the impossible and become a priest, they should emulate Mary. What a great role that would be to the Church! Men and women are both created in the image and likeness of God but that does not mean that men and women are the same and have the same functions. Men can’t have children, is God unfair to men? Where is the justice? Are men now not created in the image and likeness of God because we can’t bear children? No, not at all! Each part of the Body of Christ (Church) is part of the same Church but have their own part. A hand can’t compensate for the foot when the foot is cut off. The point is that men have always represented God to the people and this role cannot be assumed properly by a woman. No matter how hard we try, it is impossible.

Wow. I guess that is a lot of good stuff about Mary, whom I’ve seen put functionally before Jesus or the other “Persons” of God by Marianist devotees, similar to what is anthropologically found in Mother cults. But that doesn’t say much about God and why Deity in your case is regarded as male. You do understand that that is simply a convention, do you not? And whom are you talking about when you say that “men have always represented God to the people?” Perhaps you mean “in the Catholic Church and its variations?” That ought to be spelled out, otherwise you might look silly to anyone with some knowledge of history and religion. Just saying…

 

[Kathryn_Ann]

1. Who said God is a woman? He is not a woman.
2. Female human beings are considered to be in the “image of God”. Refer to the Catechism of the Catholic Church (CCC) paragraph number 369. Here is a snip from that:
   Man and woman are both with one and the same dignity “in the image of God”.
3. It is proper to refer to God with male pronouns. God chose to reveal himself as Father.
4. God the Father is not a man. See CCC 370:
   In no way is God in man’s image. He is neither man nor woman. God is pure spirit in which there is no place for the difference between the sexes. But the respective “perfections” of man and woman reflect something of the infinite perfection of God: those of a mother and those of a father and husband.

Quote worthy, and I could not agree more. Thank you for enlightening us on a sometimes confusing topic!:angel1::harp::heaven:
Kathryn Ann

 

[shocktrooper]

You do understand that that is simply a convention, do you not?

Call it what you want but it is still Divine Revelation.

And whom are you talking about when you say that “men have always represented God to the people?” Perhaps you mean “in the Catholic Church and its variations?” That ought to be spelled out, otherwise you might look silly to anyone with some knowledge of history and religion. Just saying…

I am speaking as a Catholic. My comment concerns Judaism and it’s fulfillment, Catholicism. I am well aware of pagan religions that treat many objects as god.

Thank you for allowing me to clarify my position.

God bless.