Gods love verses His affection

[mtnmikeblue]

I have a question about Gods love verses His affection. I ask this because I know that we are called to love our neighbor but I don’t believe it is possible to have affection for all people.

Does God in His love also have affection for all people?

 

[AlanFromWichita]

What do you mean by “affection?” An emotional response?

Alan

 

[mtnmikeblue]

What do you mean by “affection?” An emotional response?

Alan

I guess I’m talking about “liking” people.

It seems that when we like people we tend to be more understanding and tolerant. We pray for them in that we feel compassion as maybe their going through something.

But with those who we really don’t like, we tend not to spend as much time in exploring their needs so as to have compassion for them in prayer.

So I was just wondering if God has compassionate affection for everyone? He “loves” everyone, but does He “Like” everyone?

If so, is it possible for us to grow in our liking everyone too?

Or maybe we just need to grow in our compassion for those we don’t like?

Out of love and obedience to God I believe I would do whatever I could to assist my neighbor in any need they might have, but I seem to lack real compassion in my assistance if it is towards a neighbor whom I really don’t like.

 

[Domnall]

God does “love” everyone,but God cannot (in a simple sense) like or dislike someone.

Love is limitless…God can love you ad infinitum.

However, Liking, as well as dislike are not infinite terms. What I mean is this…like and dislike are terms that are binding. You can only like someone so much before it turns into something else. Also, you can only dislike someone so much until it become hatred.

So, God doesn’t really like or dislike people, because those terms reflect a limit…like human feelings. God isn’t bound by limits.

(If I’m not clear, please let me know and I’ll try to rephrase )

 

[TheQuestioner]

Love is not a feeling. “Liking” and “disliking” are feelings. God is a spiritual being, therefore God doesn’t have feelings. Therefore, God cannot “like” nor “dislike” a person. He’s not even “indifferent” since this too is a feeling. Jesus tells us to love everyone, not “like” everyone. Therefore we are not bound to like everyone.

 

[Domnall]

Love is not a feeling. “Liking” and “disliking” are feelings. God is a spiritual being, therefore God doesn’t have feelings. Therefore, God cannot “like” nor “dislike” a person. He’s not even “indifferent” since this too is a feeling. Jesus tells us to love everyone, not “like” everyone. Therefore we are not bound to like everyone.

Thanks for saying that way better than I did!

 

[mtnmikeblue]

God does “love” everyone,but God cannot (in a simple sense) like or dislike someone.

Love is limitless…God can love you ad infinitum.

However, Liking, as well as dislike are not infinite terms. What I mean is this…like and dislike are terms that are binding. You can only like someone so much before it turns into something else. Also, you can only dislike someone so much until it become hatred.

So, God doesn’t really like or dislike people, because those terms reflect a limit…like human feelings. God isn’t bound by limits.

(If I’m not clear, please let me know and I’ll try to rephrase )

Not sure what you mean by like and dislike being binding terms.

I have acquaintances that I like. I like them probably because we share things in common. Similar personalities and so on. So in these terms what do you mean by it turning into something else?

Same as dislike. I work with people I dislike. Again in terms of personality and what not. But I don’t see how it would become hatred.

 

[mtnmikeblue]

Love is not a feeling. “Liking” and “disliking” are feelings. God is a spiritual being, therefore God doesn’t have feelings. Therefore, God cannot “like” nor “dislike” a person. He’s not even “indifferent” since this too is a feeling. Jesus tells us to love everyone, not “like” everyone. Therefore we are not bound to like everyone.

I guess I’m having a hard time in understanding love in terms that are feelingless.

Don’t get me wrong, I do not let this stop me from loving my neighbor whom I may not like but it seems that one could love a whole lot more if they liked the individual as well. No?

Our Lord for example. We love our Lord but how can we help not love Him. He is Love. Patient, kind, compassionate, self-giving. He is very likable too.

 

[fhansen]

Love is a feeling so powerful it can cause one to sacrifice their life for another-it’s not a non-emotional intellectual disposition. Jesus wept for His lost sheep, suffered, and died for them. For us to be in His presence- the presence of Love- is to know kindness and patience and peace and well-being and elation…and love unconditionally-from One who desires your best interest and eternal happiness.

 

[TheQuestioner]

Love is a feeling so powerful it can cause one to sacrifice their life for another-it’s not a non-emotional intellectual disposition. Jesus wept for His lost sheep, suffered, and died for them. For us to be in His presence- the presence of Love- is to know kindness and patience and peace and well-being and elation…and love unconditionally-from One who desires your best interest and eternal happiness.

Jesus had a body, and therefore had emotions. But spirits don’t have bodies, and therefore no emotions. As such, the Father and Spirit don’t have emotions, though they can create them in us. Neither do the angels have emotions.

Love is a non-emotional intellectual disposition. This is the reason why a wife who claims to be miserable will not leave her husband for 50 years, or why a person who’s family member has been killed can not press charges against a murderer even though there is still a lot of hurt, or why a black doctor can perform surgery on a member of the KKK who was injured after starting a riot against other blacks.These are acts of love (agape, which is self-sacrificing love).

If we relied on our emotions to determine our actions, we would be completely evil (our natures are corrupted, so our feelings can be all out of wack).

 

[TheQuestioner]

I guess I’m having a hard time in understanding love in terms that are feelingless.

Don’t get me wrong, I do not let this stop me from loving my neighbor whom I may not like but it seems that one could love a whole lot more if they liked the individual as well. No?

Depends. We might not be as inclined to help our neighbor if he needs help, but we can always work against our inclinations (we do this whenever we do any good, for humans are inclined to evil). So though liking someone would make doing a whole lot more for them easier, one does not have to like someone in order to do a whole lot more for them.

 

[fhansen]

Jesus had a body, and therefore had emotions. But spirits don’t have bodies, and therefore no emotions. As such, the Father and Spirit don’t have emotions, though they can create them in us. Neither do the angels have emotions.

Love is a non-emotional intellectual disposition. This is the reason why a wife who claims to be miserable will not leave her husband for 50 years, or why a person who’s family member has been killed can not press charges against a murderer even though there is still a lot of hurt, or why a black doctor can perform surgery on a member of the KKK who was injured after starting a riot against other blacks.These are acts of love (agape, which is self-sacrificing love).

If we relied on our emotions to determine our actions, we would be completely evil (our natures are corrupted, so our feelings can be all out of wack).

Our feelings may or may not be out of whack but Gods’ aren’t and in any case love is never merely a non-emotional intellectual disposition and Jesus showed us the face of the Father.

 

[TheQuestioner]

Our feelings may or may not be out of whack but Gods’ aren’t and in any case love is never merely a non-emotional intellectual disposition and Jesus showed us the face of the Father.

You ever have someone make you mad enough to hit em? I mean, really hit em. Like, take them, drag them to some hidden corner, and beat em to a pulp? You ever stop and think “nah, he’s my brother” or “nah, we’ve been friends for years” or “nah, he doesn’t know what he is saying anyway”. How about a wife who hates her husband but still cooks meals for him or a husband who hates being tied down to his family but still works to take care of them? These are all acts of mercy and love, though totally lacking in affection. These acts of love are arguably greater than those done when we “like” someone because they are harder to do and require total self-sacrifice.

And yes, our feelings are out of wack. It is part of our fallen nature (thus we may dislike our wives but feel attracted to a random woman)

 

[mtnmikeblue]

I believe both are true. Although I think sacrificial acts of love are worthy of more merit in that they are done purely for the benefit of another.

But I’m still having a bit of a struggle in understanding how God’s love is directed to certain individuals.

I think it is possible that Gods love is accompanied with affection. God is pure and holy, so any affection from Him would also be pure and holy. Whereas any affectionate love on our part is more than likely tainted with some type of selfishness.

But my question remains. Is it possible for us to grow in Gods affectionate love for those who are unlikable?

I have to think that God does have affectionate love for every human being. So my question is, can we ever hope to grow and share in this affectionate love of God for others too. Or are we doomed to simply love our neighbor out of obligation?

 

[TheQuestioner]

I believe both are true. Although I think sacrificial acts of love are worthy of more merit in that they are done purely for the benefit of another.

But I’m still having a bit of a struggle in understanding how God’s love is directed to certain individuals.

I think it is possible that Gods love is accompanied with affection. God is pure and holy, so any affection from Him would also be pure and holy. Whereas any affectionate love on our part is more than likely tainted with some type of selfishness.

But my question remains. Is it possible for us to grow in Gods affectionate love for those who are unlikable?

I have to think that God does have affectionate love for every human being. So my question is, can we ever hope to grow and share in this affectionate love of God for others too. Or are we doomed to simply love our neighbor out of obligation?

Well of course it is possible. If you get to know someone ask God to help you see them with the eyes that He sees them, and ask God to give you affectionate love for your neighbor. But remember that affectionate love (filius I believe), while good, is not the most perfect kind of love since it is a feeling and not love in and of itself. Love itself, for the good of the other, and that is self sacrificing with or without emotions is a more perfect kind of love (agape).

Also, realize that the affection you speak of can only apply to the second person of the Trinity, Jesus, since He has a body. But it cannot apply to the Father and Spirit. Affection is a characteristic attached to a body.

I’ll pray for you.

 

[mtnmikeblue]

Well of course it is possible. If you get to know someone ask God to help you see them with the eyes that He sees them, and ask God to give you affectionate love for your neighbor. But remember that affectionate love (filius I believe), while good, is not the most perfect kind of love since it is a feeling and not love in and of itself. Love itself, for the good of the other, and that is self sacrificing with or without emotions is a more perfect kind of love (agape).

Also, realize that the affection you speak of can only apply to the second person of the Trinity, Jesus, since He has a body. But it cannot apply to the Father and Spirit. Affection is a characteristic attached to a body.

I’ll pray for you.

Good points, that you very much.

I was also just thinking about our Lord when He said;

***“Father, forgive them; for they do not know what they are doing " And they cast lots, dividing up His garments among themselves”. *** Luke 23:34

I have to believe that Jesus had genuine compassion and felt kindness towards those who were crucifying Him when He said, “Father forgive them”.

Can you imagine that?

I understand we are to love our enemies, but can you imagine having heart felt compassion for them too? Very hard for me to comprehend this.

But if this is given for us to do, then I pray that the Lord will do whatever it takes to work it within my heart of stone.

Thank you for your prayers

 

[fhansen]

Well of course it is possible. If you get to know someone ask God to help you see them with the eyes that He sees them, and ask God to give you affectionate love for your neighbor. But remember that affectionate love (filius I believe), while good, is not the most perfect kind of love since it is a feeling and not love in and of itself. Love itself, for the good of the other, and that is self sacrificing with or without emotions is a more perfect kind of love (agape).

Also, realize that the affection you speak of can only apply to the second person of the Trinity, Jesus, since He has a body. But it cannot apply to the Father and Spirit. Affection is a characteristic attached to a body.

I’ll pray for you.

I dunno. Love without feeling sounds like love without passion and Jesus demonstrated God’s passion for us by His sacrifice-pure agape love. Otherwise, I’m not sure why He’d bother-or why anyone else would either for that matter. But maybe I miss your point.

 

[TheQuestioner]

I dunno. Love without feeling sounds like love without passion and Jesus demonstrated God’s passion for us by His sacrifice-pure agape love. Otherwise, I’m not sure why He’d bother-or why anyone else would either for that matter. But maybe I miss your point.

Well I can imagine that Jesus did what he did out of love and also had compassion, but remember when he chased people out of the temple? He still had love while He did it. I’m quite sure He wasn’t all smiles and giggles while He did it but He still did it. In the same way when your parents are very angry and punish you, they actually do it out of love, because in the end it was good and right and worked towards the salvation of the merchants at the temple for Jesus to chase them out, as it was for your parents to punish you. True self-sacrificing love goes beyond a feeling. In the same way, angels who have no bodies and therefore no emotions still love us, because they work towards our ultimate good, heaven.

In order for love to be love it has to be unconditional. If love disappears when we are mad then it is not. Jesus got mad, but no one says His love disappeared. Jesus got sad, and no one said he stopped loving. Jesus got tired and reclusive at times, and no one says He stopped loving. People say He was always loving because in all those things He gave the gift of Himself for all people. This is love. Sacrifice, not feeling.

 

[mtnmikeblue]

remember when he chased people out of the temple? He still had love while He did it. I’m quite sure He wasn’t all smiles and giggles while He did it but He still did it. In the same way when your parents are very angry and punish you, they actually do it out of love, because in the end it was good and right and worked towards the salvation of the merchants at the temple for Jesus to chase them out, as it was for your parents to punish you.

Another good example, thank you.

This is something I have to grow in. If I were the one chasing the people out of the temple I’m sure it would not have been from the same heart of Christ. No He was not all smiles and giggles but even in His actions of sternness His desire for them had to have been pure and good, free from anything that was unloving.

I believe this is His desire for us too. Yes the more I think about it, I do believe the Lord wants to bring us to a place where His love becomes our love too.

Our Lords pure love for the unloving can also become ours.

While this pure love may not be accompanied with smiles and giggles, it also should and can be free from all that is unloving.

I was also just looking at Math 17:21

"But this kind does not go out except by prayer and fasting."

While this context in Math 17 is that of casting out evil spirits, I believe it can also be applied to this discussion.

Look at a few verses earlier Math 17:17
"And Jesus answered and said, "You unbelieving and perverted generation, how long shall I be with you? How long shall I put up with you? Bring him here to Me."

And then three verses down Math 17:20
***"Because of the littleness of your faith; for truly I say to you, if you have faith the size of a mustard seed, you will say to this mountain, ‘Move from here to there,’ and it will move; and nothing will be impossible to you. ***

Yes the more I contemplate on this I now see that our Lord DOES want to give us His pure heart of love for others. But I also see that in order for Him to do so there needs to be much prayer and fasting.

So with your help guys I believe our Lord has given me the answer. Thank you.

I see now that it really doesn’t matter if this command to love our neighbor is accompanied by feelings or not. Sometimes there might be feelings and sometimes there wont. What matters is love from a pure heart. Meaning a heart that is completely untainted by anything but pure love.

And this can only be accomplished by much prayer and fasting.

**“Blessed are the pure in heart, for they shall see God”.
**

Thank you so much for your help