Reformed,
Lets back up a little.
You posted this to me, after I gave my answer from the beginning of the thread and before I gave it again, when you finally admitted that, in your opinion, I had the answer correct.
I have to respectfully disagree with you. If you point to religious organizations such as the Roman Catholic Church and other religious institutions, unregenerate people will probably see the flesh in the churches (hypocrisy and sin).
That CC is not just a “religious organization.” It is the Church Christ said he would build on Earth. Because it has Christ as it’s head and because it is indwelt by The Holy Spirit, Himself, it is more than a mere institution, as I’m sure you define the word “institution.” The Church is also the Mystical body of Christ and as such, it is Holy. If you point people to the True Church on Earth, which is also One, and Apostolic in nature, then of course, both unregenerate people and regenerate people alike will probably see the flesh in the Church (not church
es as Christ only established one institution). Christ came to save sinners. We are all hopelessly flawed and we all sin to one degree or another at any given time during the course of our lives. Of course hypocrisy and sin will be found in Christ’s true Church. Christ himself promised it would be. He likened His Church to a net holding both good and bad fish. You mis-define the word church and so you must mis-interpret the verse about the net and in so doing, turn it into something invisible. But a net can be seen and the bad fish within it do not corrupt it, if it is fashioned by the Master Fisherman, which is Jesus.
God saves sinners through the proclamation of the gospel of God’s grace by the power of the Holy Spirit,
True,
and not through sprinkling of water.
False.
You are a victim of “either/or” theology. You lead from a false premise that Baptism does not regenerate the soul of man and so you come to false conclusions that it is possible for one who is Baptized to be un-regenerate. Whether you will admit it or not, this “either/or” theology negates free will. Now I’m not going to get into the Baptism debate on this thread. It can be found elsewhere on the board and throughout this web-site if you are really interested in learning the truth the Bible holds. Suffice it to say, the Bible tells us that Baptism is the Sacrament (one of them) of initiation and is the ordinary means whereby we may say we are “saved.” We are being saved, in other words, we are in the process of being saved, throughout the process that is our life (we still have to live our life, don’t we?) by, as you say here, the proclamation of the Gospel of grace (which is Jesus Christ, in the flesh, which is also the Eucharist, “I am the bread of life.”) by the power of the Holy Spirit, which we have literal (supernatural) access to, through the other Sacraments (Holy Communion, Reconciliation, Confirmation, etc…).
If people are united to Christ and born from above through sprinkling of water, you would have 1 billion catholics who would be led by the Spirit, and never leave the Catholic Church if the Catholic Church is the One True Church.
And you have just described the Church Triumphant, that is the Catholic Church as it exists in an ideal state, in heaven. The problem is, we are existing, at the present time, in an imperfect world. People are imperfect in this life and so they falter, they sin, they leave the Catholic Church. Regeneration does not ensure perfection while the soul is wrapped in this flesh. That doesn’t mean that the Bible is wrong as it tells us that regeneration occurs at Baptism.
"Baptism, which saves you now." Regardless of how one defines the process whereby one is regenerated, there will be the free will to contend with. This is where your system of faith (your "reformed theology aside, I still haven’t had time to study exactly what this new theology is all about, so bear with me, if you will) starts to break down. You have no way to discuss the reality of sin.
The one true church is a living organism
True,
consisting of regenerate Christians
true, Baptized Christians,
from various Christian communities, and some who do not even attend a church.
false. Those communities (as well as the unchurched), which deny the truth of the One Gospel of Christ, in it’s fullness, have seperated themselves from the One, True Church. That is the visible Church, the Catholic Church.
You cannot consider Protestants your separated brethren and state that they are not part of the church.
You must look at the big picture and accept it’s many facets. What you say here is true. They are part of “the church.” But they are separated (by their own free will) from what we call the One True Church. According to the laws of this world, one Body cannot be divided and unified at the same time. So it is a mystery how the phenomenon of Protestantism gives us a reality that people can be seperated from the Body and yet still members in some sense.
Christ prayed for the unity of His One Church. I believe God the Father would answer the prayer of His only begotten Son in the affirmative and Jesus got what He asked for, a unified Church on Earth (the Catholic Church). Some men sinned and in so doing, chose to separate themselves from that One Body. At the same time, they have the Grace that comes through Baptism and faith in Christ (the righteousness of God) and so, in some sense, one that is a mystery to us, they remain members of the universal body, that is the spiritual body, that is His church, but not the One True Church (which joins the spiritual to the supernatural) because they do not embrace the whole of the One True Gospel.
The catholic church is universal.
Yes it is. And so is the Catholic Church.
When you add the word Roman in front of catholic, you are not longer talking about God’s universal (catholic) church which he has chosen before the foundation of the world.
First of all, I did not add the word Roman in front of catholic. Catholics did not do this. It was you, and the non-catholic world that added the word Roman. It started out as a derrogatory term to define the Catholic Church and as a means of confusing people like you into rejecting Her truth. It has come to a point that it is sometimes necessary to use the term Roman so people will know what you are talking about. Using the term, however, in no way negates the fact that God’s Universal (Catholic) Church is that same Church which is the perfect fullfillment of HIS assembly which he has chosen, nor does it negate the fact that the universal church, in some mystical way, includes our brethren who are in the state of the sin of schism.
The topic of this thread is God’s righteousness which is required for entrance into Heaven.
True,
God’s righteousness is not membership and communion with the Roman Catholic Church.
False.
And I sense that your use of the term Roman, is derogatory. It is said by people in your mindset as if it were a dirty word and you offend God when you do this.
You should be ashamed.
