Going full abstinence

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hoping4more

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Who here has?

I somewhat proposed it tonight, a little prematurely after she was trying to get me to be less stressed.

I thought I might be able to do it but she may not accept this, ( she has had a lot of doubt about the catholic faith since our marriage), we have a situation where we practically must abstain or be in sin( unable to take communion).

I am not sure how much I should speak to her about this either. Leave her her alone or confront her on the morality of it all. Etc.
 
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It’s a sensible question. I don’t how to advisor you.

If it’s something undergone by one of the spouse, I will be badly taken anyway.
The spouse can end up accomodating, but there could be resentment.

I was never in your tragic situation but we have know some abstinence period as long as 1 year. Some are chosen by one and undergone by the other. (and not always the same spouse, and not for the same reasons). Some because of inability, so undergone by the two of us.

What had help us to find it confortable, is to avoid all physical things, especially for men. (the only thing who remained : two kisses on the cheeks by week on the mass…). But in avoiding all physical things, and never keep some time shared together, we are easily growing apart.

So the best is to keep some common activities, complicity, some romanticism and not hesitate to tell the other that we love him/her. have real discussion on important and futile topics.

And keep a prayer life together if the two are believers.
 
What does this mean? It certainly can be done. The question often is whether it’s necessary to do.

OP, it’s unclear what you mean or why you need to abstain. Do you have previous marriages that haven’t been annulled? Before you discuss it further with your wife, be sure you understand clearly what the Catholic church’s teachings are. There are many misconceptions out there.
It’s essential that both husband and wife are in agreement on the morality of what they are doing.
 
Viki63,

I don’t want to speak for the OP, but he had already explain his difficult marital/familial/ and medical situation.

Looks on older posts of family life section, you could have an idea…
 
Werbenjagermeister. No, it will be full abstinence, otherwise I would much rather be in unison with my wife than to compromise myself.

It is a medical reason. She has cancer, pregnancy could be disastrous.

I just keeping wondering why God would, allow this; some type of punish,net for when we used contraceptives in the past, me not leading our family in this way or something…basically, for now the only way to stay in good Graces and not risk a great health risk is to abstain.
 
Viki63 said:
What does this mean? It certainly can be done. The question often is whether it’s necessary to do.
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It’s an adaptation of a joke from a movie. (The original isn’t CAF-friendly, but isn’t obscene.)
 
Cancer is not a punishment. And why people get it is certainly not because of punishment by divine intervention.

Please speak with your cancer professionals and Clergy about the best thing in this situation.

I am praying for your family
 
Periods are very difficult to predict when a women is going through chemo and hormone treatment, making NFp unusable; advanced methods of nFP might work when she is just on tamoxifen.

Everyone I have spoken to said we should abstain, it is too risky while on chemo, or use contraceptives methods and not take communion, aka be in sin.
 
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In a valid marriage, it is sinful for a spouse to refuse the marital debt when the request is reasonable.

If your wife chooses to use contraceptives, and she is aware that you do not wish to use them yet she continues, that sin is on her.

You cannot use contraception. If she chooses to, that is her decision.

I honestly wonder if your end goal is to drive her away from the marriage.

Read this document, section 3 but pay special attention to the bold I added:

http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/p...s/rc_pc_family_doc_12021997_vademecum_en.html
  1. Special difficulties are presented by cases of cooperation in the sin of a spouse who voluntarily renders the unitive act infecund. In the first place, it is necessary to distinguish cooperation in the proper sense, from violence or unjust imposition on the part of one of the spouses, which the other spouse in fact cannot resist.46, 561).] This cooperation can be licit when the three following conditions are jointly met:
when the action of the cooperating spouse is not already illicit in itself;47

when proportionally grave reasons exist for cooperating in the sin of the other spouse;

when one is seeking to help the other spouse to desist from such conduct (patiently, with prayer, charity and dialogue; although not necessarily in that moment, nor on every single occasion).
 
So sorry you are both dealing with this. Of course discuss it with your doctors and your priest. Cancer is certainly not a punishment, it’s just a result of living in a fallen world.
In your shoes, I might consider abstaining until she is healed from the cancer, if that’s her wish.
You can regard this as a time to grow in your faith and strengthen it. God is able to give you the graces you need to get through this with compassion and dignity.
By the way, due to medical issues, my husband and I have lived as brother and sister for about 22 years.
 
hoping4more said:
I just keeping wondering why God would, allow this; some type of punish,net
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Some things may seem to be a punishment, but the fact is is that they are always for the betterment of our souls.

I like this story of St. Gemma and her trials of sickness:
Gemma also writes about when her guardian angel gave her spiritual insight into why God was choosing not to heal her of a physical illness she was going through: “One evening, when I was suffering more than usual, I was complaining to Jesus and telling him that I would not have prayed so much if I had known that He was not going to cure me, and I asked Him why I had to be sick this way. My angel answered me as follows: ‘If Jesus afflicts you in your body, it is always to purify you in your soul. Be good.’”
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Pray much for your wife and have faith that she will come around to your position. God bless.
 
the vadecum for confessors gives a woman an out; I don’t have that option.

Actually, every person I spoke to said, morally, we should abstain. I have just be reluctant to bring it up in conversation.

I started this because I have seen on here where a few others said the went through or are currently abstaining, even for years. We would only need to for a few months at most.

How does this work, successfully?

After going to confession, 2 years ago, I asked the priest what I should do about her not trusting NFP and he said abstain. We didn’t have a long conversation. I didn’t have moral toolkit, so to speak, to be insistent about this. So I have tried be a bit unilateral about this before but it didn’t work out.
 
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It’s not that I think it is punishment per se, but God would not allow this unless there was something for us to learn. I don’t believe in chaos. And someone getting this at this young of an age is too extreme to be simply part of the fallen world, like it is just something that happens as you get older, etc. obviously we are to always grow and learn, but this is just too much a freak accident for us to not pay attention and change something.
 
Good on you for being selfless and taking this decision on.

When a person is undergoing cancer treatment, it can and usually does have an effect on their thoughts. Please get some info on this. It will help you understand a lot.
 
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In a case, if we want to see in a very “legalistic” wiew it could be difficult to find the way to contracept and not be involved.
  • the spouse who not want to be involved do not want commit the sin himself. In the case of a man, no vasectomy, no condom, no withdrawal.It is the sense of traditional moral theology for confessors. And I believe this document follow this tradition.
  • for the wife, in this present situation, hormonal contraception is not an option for medical reasons. Nor NFP for medical reason and personal preference.
So the options could be a copper IUD, and I have doubt that if the other spouse doen’t want to contracept he will be fine with that, given that It could be abortificient. But today, doctors claims the main action of IUD is spermicide…
There is the options of barriers methods which are less problematic on moral perspective, but I don’t know if the couple want to rest on the least effective method of contraception in this difficult time.
 
Or female sterilization.

And it’s not a decision it is smart to take in a crisis time for a couple who previousely want to have children.

perhaps I forget some things.

I am sorry to go to this details. I don’t know if it is a smart thing to do.

Ultimately, this couple will choose what they want to do, no one can take the decision for themselves.
hoping4more said:
I started this because I have seen on here where a few others said the went through or are currently abstaining, even for years. We would only need to for a few months at most.
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It seems more encouraging! I believe it was need for 5 years! Only a few mouths is quite feasible.

Perhaps the challenge to go throught all the treatment will be enough to kill any desire for sexual intimacy… I don’t know.

And ask for yourself. Not requiered to answers here. Do your wife and you have ever be abstinent? For exemple before marriage? Or the relation was sexual since the firts day? If you have some previous true experience, no matter when, you can relax yourself: you can do it again. Think of what was important on this period.

If you don’t have any experience of abstinence, It can be scary, and you can think that you don’t know how to do it…But ALL is possible. Sex is never an live obligation. It can be stopped IF and only IF at least one of the two is truly and deply motivated. And consider no other option.

Believe me, it’s possible. I don’t know how to do it, until I believe there is no other choice.

But again, if your wife is not motivated, it will be a challenge, and it could harm your relationship which is put to the test for a long time on many topics. And it will not help her cure her anti-catholic beliefs.

And what to do after this period of treatment is an other issue that you have to answer with your wife. But after…
 
I don’t think that any priest will come to any person and ask him personal questions regarding birth control, before allow her to take sacraments. And not in a situation of cancer. If she don’t raise the topic herself.

I believe if it was the case, there will not be many people who will take eucharist.

It is left on hoping4more to take his own decisions with his conscience.
 
There are female condoms and diaphragms. It is up to the person who wishes to contracept to find a way to do it.
 
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