Good Friday question

[buc_fan33]

Greetings! First, I feel bad posting this, since as a priest, I feel like I should be the one who has all the answers to these things! But, hey…there’s only been one omniscient person with a human nature, and we crucified Him. Anyway…I need some help from a liturgical expert.

In today’s liturgy for Good Friday, the rubrics are not clear about two things.

1. Prior to the Prayer over the People, it says that the deacon is to say, “Bow down for the blessing.” However, it is not clear if prior to this the priest says, “The Lord be with you,” as is normally done. I can’t find the answer on Google. Any expert have an idea?
2. Related to this, the rubrics are not clear if there is a final blessing or not. It just says that after the Prayer Over the People, the ministers genuflect to the cross and depart in silence. It’s ambiguous as to whether or not there is a final blessing.

If anyone knows, I’d greatly appreciate some insight. Blessings in advance and a blessed Triduum.

 

[Vico]

Greetings! First, I feel bad posting this, since as a priest, I feel like I should be the one who has all the answers to these things! But, hey…there’s only been one omniscient person with a human nature, and we crucified Him. Anyway…I need some help from a liturgical expert.

In today’s liturgy for Good Friday, the rubrics are not clear about two things.

1. Prior to the Prayer over the People, it says that the deacon is to say, “Bow down for the blessing.” However, it is not clear if prior to this the priest says, “The Lord be with you,” as is normally done. I can’t find the answer on Google. Any expert have an idea?
2. Related to this, the rubrics are not clear if there is a final blessing or not. It just says that after the Prayer Over the People, the ministers genuflect to the cross and depart in silence. It’s ambiguous as to whether or not there is a final blessing.

If anyone knows, I’d greatly appreciate some insight. Blessings in advance and a blessed Triduum.

I heard on EWTN that there is no dismissal on Good Friday. In the youtube video from 3/29/13, at Duke Catholic Center,Fr. Michael Martin, after communion is finished, from the silence he rises to say:

Celebrant: Let us pray: Almighty ever-living God …
Faithful: Amen
Celebrant: Bow down for the blessing. May abundant blessing, O Lord, we pray …

Also from USCCB:

Holy Communion

The rubric is specific that either the deacon or priest bringing the Blessed Sacrament to the altar puts on a humeral veil. Rather than indicate there is no procession, the rubric says the deacon or priest brings the Blessed Sacrament back from the place of reposition “by a shorter route.” All stand in silence. The rubric for the priest has been shortened, indicating that “the Priest goes to the altar and genuflects” (GF, no. 22).

The priest communicates after Behold the Lamb of God. There is a new rubric that notes the priest is to say privately, May the Body of Christ keep me safe for eternal life. (GF, no. 27).

Mention is made that Psalm 22 (21) may be sung during the distribution of communion or another appropriate chant (GF, no. 28). After Communion either the deacon or another suitable minister takes the ciborium to a place prepared outside the church, or, if circumstances require, may place it in the tabernacle (GF, no. 29).

The priest then says Let us pray and, “after observing, according to circumstances, some period of sacred silence, says the prayer after Communion” (GF, no. 30). The Missale Romanum in this instance emphasizes the period of silence after Let us pray.

Before the Prayer Over the People the priest, if there is no deacon, may say the invitation: Bow down for the blessing.(GF, no. 31).

The previous rubric mentioned only that all depart in silence. The new rubric notes “after genuflecting toward the Cross,” all depart in silence.(GF, no. 32).

It is then indicated that the altar is stripped after the celebration. “The cross remains upon the altar with two to four candles” (GF, no. 33).

usccb.org/prayer-and-worship/liturgical-year/triduum/roman-missal-and-the-good-friday-liturgy.cfm

 

[buc_fan33]

Thanks. Your Youtube suggestion gave me an idea. I went and found the video of Pope Benedict’s Celebration of the Lord’s Passion at St. Peter’s from 2012, and in his celebration he omitted both the dialogue (The Lord be with you…and with your spirit), as well as omitting the final blessing. I’m going to trust that Pope Benedict and his MC know what they are doing, and follow their lead. Blessings to you!

 

[Crusaderbear]

Our Monsignor explained it to the RCIA last Saturday - my wife is going thru it now - Triduum is a single ‘mass’ taking 3 days, so no final blessing. Our Monsignor loves explaining everything to the congregation, it’s really refreshing!

 

[FrDavid96]

Greetings! First, I feel bad posting this, since as a priest, I feel like I should be the one who has all the answers to these things! But, hey…there’s only been one omniscient person with a human nature, and we crucified Him. Anyway…I need some help from a liturgical expert.

In today’s liturgy for Good Friday, the rubrics are not clear about two things.

1. Prior to the Prayer over the People, it says that the deacon is to say, “Bow down for the blessing.” However, it is not clear if prior to this the priest says, “The Lord be with you,” as is normally done. I can’t find the answer on Google. Any expert have an idea?

Roman Missal. Good Friday rubric #9 says that the Passion is read “in the same way as on the preceding Sunday.”
Palm Sunday rubric #21 “no greeting or signing of the book.”

So no, the greeting “The Lord be with you” is not done on Good Friday.

1. Related to this, the rubrics are not clear if there is a final blessing or not. It just says that after the Prayer Over the People, the ministers genuflect to the cross and depart in silence. It’s ambiguous as to whether or not there is a final blessing.

If anyone knows, I’d greatly appreciate some insight. Blessings in advance and a blessed Triduum.

No. No final blessing.

Simply put: it’s not in the Missal, so don’t do it. That’s not sarcasm or being snarky. I mean it at face value. It’s not there, so don’t do it.

It’s confusing because the deacon may announce “Bow down for the blessing” but then, no actual blessing occurs. Instead it’s a “Prayer over the people” however that is not followed by a sign-of-the-cross as it would typically be at a Mass. The actual sign blessing is not implied here, it’s intentionally omitted.

 

[FrDavid96]

Post Script:

When the Passion is proclaimed, I always replace the word “Gospel” with the word “Passion” according to tradition.

 

[Vico]

Thanks. Your Youtube suggestion gave me an idea. I went and found the video of Pope Benedict’s Celebration of the Lord’s Passion at St. Peter’s from 2012, and in his celebration he omitted both the dialogue (The Lord be with you…and with your spirit), as well as omitting the final blessing. I’m going to trust that Pope Benedict and his MC know what they are doing, and follow their lead. Blessings to you!

Thank you. So did H.H. Pope Benedict do the Prayer over the People after Bow down for the blessing?

Super populum tuum, quaesumus, Domine, qui mortem Filii tui in spe suae resurrectionis recoluit, benedictio copiosa descendat, indulgentia veniat, consolatio tribuatur, fides sancta succrescat, redemptio sempiterna firmetur.

May abundant blessing, O Lord, we pray,
descend upon your people,
who have honored the Death of your Son
in the hope of their resurrection:
may pardon come,
comfort be given,
holy faith increase,
and everlasting redemption be made secure.
Through Christ our Lord.

 

[buc_fan33]

Roman Missal. Good Friday rubric #9 says that the Passion is read “in the same way as on the preceding Sunday.”
Palm Sunday rubric #21 “no greeting or signing of the book.”

So no, the greeting “The Lord be with you” is not done on Good Friday.

No. No final blessing.

Simply put: it’s not in the Missal, so don’t do it. That’s not sarcasm or being snarky. I mean it at face value. It’s not there, so don’t do it.

It’s confusing because the deacon may announce “Bow down for the blessing” but then, no actual blessing occurs. Instead it’s a “Prayer over the people” however that is not followed by a sign-of-the-cross as it would typically be at a Mass. The actual sign blessing is not implied here, it’s intentionally omitted.

Thanks, but I was asking with respect to the prayer over the people. I know it’s not said prior to the reading of the Passion.

Generally speaking, I agree with you regarding rubrics. If it’s not there…don’t do it. But you have to admit, sometimes rubrics can be, shall we say, ambiguous? Here’s an example. In the Order of Christian Funerals, in the burial rite, there is prayer to be used “when the gravesite is to be blessed.” However, nowhere in the rubric is there an indication of A) how the priest is to hold his hands, B) if he is to make the sign of the cross over the grave, or C) if he is to use holy water. (It’s actually clear in the Spanish ritual book, but that’s beside the point.) I’ve personally encountered numerous cases where a rubric is unclear. The old Rite of Marriage (prior to the new version instituted last year) was full of things that didn’t match up with the missal.

Anyway, the point of my question was that, normally, you would only have a prayer over the people when it is followed by a blessing. Further, as you pointed out, it doesn’t make a whole lot of sense for the deacon to say, “Bow down for the blessing” when there is no blessing. But regardless, I did exactly what you suggested…omit the dialogue (The Lord be with you…and with your spirit) and omit the final blessing.

Have a very blessed Triduum!

 

[buc_fan33]

Thank you. So did H.H. Pope Benedict do the Prayer over the People after Bow down for the blessing?

Super populum tuum, quaesumus, Domine, qui mortem Filii tui in spe suae resurrectionis recoluit, benedictio copiosa descendat, indulgentia veniat, consolatio tribuatur, fides sancta succrescat, redemptio sempiterna firmetur.

May abundant blessing, O Lord, we pray,
descend upon your people,
who have honored the Death of your Son
in the hope of their resurrection:
may pardon come,
comfort be given,
holy faith increase,
and everlasting redemption be made secure.
Through Christ our Lord.

Yes.

 

[FrDavid96]

Thanks, but I was asking with respect to the prayer over the people. I know it’s not said prior to the reading of the Passion.

Generally speaking, I agree with you regarding rubrics. If it’s not there…don’t do it. But you have to admit, sometimes rubrics can be, shall we say, ambiguous? Here’s an example. In the Order of Christian Funerals, in the burial rite, there is prayer to be used “when the gravesite is to be blessed.” However, nowhere in the rubric is there an indication of A) how the priest is to hold his hands, B) if he is to make the sign of the cross over the grave, or C) if he is to use holy water. (It’s actually clear in the Spanish ritual book, but that’s beside the point.) I’ve personally encountered numerous cases where a rubric is unclear. The old Rite of Marriage (prior to the new version instituted last year) was full of things that didn’t match up with the missal.

Anyway, the point of my question was that, normally, you would only have a prayer over the people when it is followed by a blessing. Further, as you pointed out, it doesn’t make a whole lot of sense for the deacon to say, “Bow down for the blessing” when there is no blessing. But regardless, I did exactly what you suggested…omit the dialogue (The Lord be with you…and with your spirit) and omit the final blessing.

Have a very blessed Triduum!

Yes, the rubrics can often be confusing.

With regard to your comment about the funeral rites, the Congregation for Divine Worship has actually addressed that one; in general, but not specifically. There was a decree about this a few years back. In all the blessings, we’re supposed to add a sign of the cross “at the words of blessing.” Of course, when the blessings (so called) were reformed in the 1970’s the actual words of blessing were removed. Catch 22. So, the Congregations says to add the cross at the end. Here’s the relevant decree: notitiae.ipsissima-verba.org/show/135

At this point, I’ll make a personal comment that I find the new Book of Blessings to be worse than useless. I think I’ve found maybe 3 actual blessings of things. They’re worse than useless because they are supposed to be blessings, but they are not. We don’t bless things, so when we’re done, they’re no more blessed than they were before. Worse than useless.

Back to your original question.
When the current ritual is confusing, I find it helpful to turn to the vetus ordo
In my 1962 Missal, there’s no final blessing at the conclusion of Good Friday.

In the '62 Missal, there is no final prayer over the people. It looks to me that the prayer they call a blessing (although there’s no actual blessing) is new. Still, there’s certainly no final blessing. Nevertheless, I do think it still comes back to what I wrote earlier of “if it’s not in the text, don’t do it.” Given that we know the Church considers the Triduum to be one continuous Liturgy, it does make sense to omit any proper final blessing. That leads me to the conclusion that the omission of any mention of a proper blessing is intentional, and not an oversight (as it is in the Book of Blessings, so-called).

So, today, the deacon said “Bow your heads…” then I read the prayer with hands extended. Exactly as printed. No sign of the Cross. Then we genuflected and walked out in silence.

I want to caution lay participants here: I am not saying that we follow the rubrics of 1962. I am saying that we look to them for guidance to help in answering a question when something is unclear in the present rubrics. We follow the present-day rubrics, but in order to do that, sometimes we can be guided by the more clear rubrics of the past. This does not always work.

This might be of interest as it’s related: notitiae.ipsissima-verba.org/show/67
I would just add that I don’t think this notice would apply to Good Friday. I’m just posting it for general information.