Grace is always the initial cause?

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shocktrooper

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From what I have gathered from being a Catholic for a short while and studying the faith to better understand it, grace always being the first cause has always baffled me. I submit to the Church’s teaching on this but I am looking for better understanding. How can there be free will if God’s grace is what gives us our faith? How is this different from Calvinism, which claims God chooses who goes to heaven and who does not? If God gives His grace to whom He chooses and we are saved by grace, then is that not God choosing who will be saved? Please help. I am sure I am missing something important here.

Pax Christi.
 
Calvinists believe certain people are deprived of faith, that God “passes over” them. Catholicism does not. All persons have the opportunity to be saved. No one can say to God at judgment: “You deprived me of the graces I needed to be saved! Therefore my condemnation is unjust!”

Now predestination is a mystery no doubt. The Catholic Church teaches at least 2 pertinent things here. 1) God gives all souls the grace to be saved; and 2) God gives all souls the free will to accept grace.

Now exactly how God’s sovereignty does not violate man’s free will is not fully comprehended. But consider this: If God granted the gift of free will to man to accept grace, then as soon as we start saying that God’s grace trumps the free will, we forget that the gift of free will was indeed free will. Do you follow that?

In other words, don’t forget that free will is a gift too. God is fully capable of bestowing on a soul the free choice to accept His grace. The grace was imperative. And the soul’s will remained free. God is that good.
 
I like MarcoPolo’s answer. It is much more complete than mine will be, but to try and simplify things. God provides the grace - but we respond to that grace with our free will by faith.

As it says in Ephesians:

For by grace you have been saved through faith, and this is not from you; it is the gift of God; (Eph 2: 8)
 
MarcoPolo said:
Calvinists believe certain people are deprived of faith, that God “passes over” them. Catholicism does not. All persons have the opportunity to be saved. No one can say to God at judgment: “You deprived me of the graces I needed to be saved! Therefore my condemnation is unjust!”

Now predestination is a mystery no doubt. The Catholic Church teaches at least 2 pertinent things here. 1) God gives all souls the grace to be saved; and 2) God gives all souls the free will to accept grace.

Now exactly how God’s sovereignty does not violate man’s free will is not fully comprehended. But consider this: If God granted the gift of free will to man to accept grace, then as soon as we start saying that God’s grace trumps the free will, we forget that the gift of free will was indeed free will. Do you follow that?

In other words, don’t forget that free will is a gift too. God is fully capable of bestowing on a soul the free choice to accept His grace. The grace was imperative. And the soul’s will remained free. God is that good.
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Ok. I understand the Church’s teaching on predestination and free will and I know we truly don’t fully understand it. I was under the impression that the teaching was God’s grace was not given to all people, i.e pharaoh or those Jews that have had their hearts hardened.

So what you are telling me is that no one is exempt from God’s grace and we all must receive and dispose ourselves to His grace, correct?

And grace is what we are saved by but it can not impede our free will, correct?

If so, then grace is not always the initial cause to faith, or is it? Wouldn’t it be our free will acting to accept that grace and faith?

Thanks.
 
I think it’s what’s call “prevenient grace”. It’s provided to all men as a sort of call to God, but we have to grasp it to go any further.

Fifth chapter, sixth session of The Council of Trent:

“The Synod furthermore declares, that in adults, the beginning of the said Justification is to be derived from the prevenient grace of God, through Jesus Christ, that is to say, from His vocation, whereby, without any merits existing on their parts, they are called; that so they, who by sins were alienated from God, may be disposed through His quickening and assisting grace, to convert themselves to their own justification, by freely assenting to and co-operating with that said grace.”

So… the grace is like incense that fills Earth, we’re dying in our sins holding our breath and sometimes it wafts up our nostrils. When it does, to be saved we have to start breathing it. 😃
 
InternetWoman said:
I like MarcoPolo’s answer. It is much more complete than mine will be, but to try and simplify things. God provides the grace - but we respond to that grace with our free will by faith.

As it says in Ephesians:

For by grace you have been saved through faith, and this is not from you; it is the gift of God; (Eph 2: 8)
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I needed confirmation on this as well. I understood what MarcoPolo explained about what grace was, but your words made it click even better. Thanks InternetWoman! WoundedIcon’s explanation was perfect as well.

I love how God created both grace and free will, but to the extent that they wouldn’t interfere with each other in a negative sense. I honestly don’t think we’re meant to understand it. This is just another example of why there has to be mysteries. Humans aren’t meant to understand certain things because, in all honesty, we most likely wouldn’t be able to comprehend them. It’s sort of like how we can’t wrap our mind around how God has always been there - it’s set in our minds that there’s a beginning, and there’s an end to things. God had no beginning - that’s an example of certain aspects of Him that are difficult to comprehend. I hope this makes sense.
 
shocktrooper said:
From what I have gathered from being a Catholic for a short while and studying the faith to better understand it, grace always being the first cause has always baffled me. I submit to the Church’s teaching on this but I am looking for better understanding. How can there be free will if God’s grace is what gives us our faith? How is this different from Calvinism, which claims God chooses who goes to heaven and who does not? If God gives His grace to whom He chooses and we are saved by grace, then is that not God choosing who will be saved? Please help. I am sure I am missing something important here.

Pax Christi.
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Imagine you are drowning. God by HIs grace throws us a rope. Unless we decide by our free will to reach out and grab the rope. They work cooperatively.
 
ignatius777 said:
Imagine you are drowning. God by HIs grace throws us a rope. Unless we decide by our free will to reach out and grab the rope. They work cooperatively.
Click to expand...
:amen: I love this articulate metaphor. Well said!
 
shocktrooper said:
Ok. I understand the Church’s teaching on predestination and free will and I know we truly don’t fully understand it. I was under the impression that the teaching was God’s grace was not given to all people, i.e pharaoh or those Jews that have had their hearts hardened.

So what you are telling me is that no one is exempt from God’s grace and we all must receive and dispose ourselves to His grace, correct?

And grace is what we are saved by but it can not impede our free will, correct?

If so, then grace is not always the initial cause to faith, or is it? Wouldn’t it be our free will acting to accept that grace and faith?

Thanks.
Click to expand...
As to the likes of Pharoah, even the Scripture uses both phrases “God hardened his heart” and “Pharoah hardened his heart.” Do also look into prevenient grace. Grace is always the initial cause of faith. More from Trent:The Synod furthermore declares, that in adults, the beginning of the said Justification is to be derived from the prevenient grace of God, through Jesus Christ, that is to say, from His vocation, whereby, without any merits existing on their parts, they are called; that so they, who by sins were alienated from God, may be disposed through His quickening and assisting grace, to convert themselves to their own justification, by freely assenting to and co-operating with that said grace: in such sort that, while God touches the heart of man by the illumination of the Holy Ghost, neither is man himself utterly without doing anything while he receives that inspiration, forasmuch as he is also able to reject it; yet is he not able, by his own free will, without the grace of God, to move himself unto justice in His sight. Whence, when it is said in the sacred writings: Turn ye to me, and I will turn to you, we are admonished of our liberty; and when we answer; Convert us, O Lord, to thee, and we shall be converted, we confess that we are prevented by the grace of God.
 
MarcoPolo said:
As to the likes of Pharoah, even the Scripture uses both phrases “God hardened his heart” and “Pharoah hardened his heart.” Do also look into prevenient grace. Grace is always the initial cause of faith. More from Trent:The Synod furthermore declares, that in adults, the beginning of the said Justification is to be derived from the prevenient grace of God, through Jesus Christ, that is to say, from His vocation, whereby, without any merits existing on their parts, they are called; that so they, who by sins were alienated from God, may be disposed through His quickening and assisting grace, to convert themselves to their own justification, by freely assenting to and co-operating with that said grace: in such sort that, while God touches the heart of man by the illumination of the Holy Ghost, neither is man himself utterly without doing anything while he receives that inspiration, forasmuch as he is also able to reject it; yet is he not able, by his own free will, without the grace of God, to move himself unto justice in His sight. Whence, when it is said in the sacred writings: Turn ye to me, and I will turn to you, we are admonished of our liberty; and when we answer; Convert us, O Lord, to thee, and we shall be converted, we confess that we are prevented by the grace of God.
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Thank you all for your answers. They are very helpful and clarify the Church’s teaching on this for me. God bless and take care.

Pax Christi.
 
The Catechism has a good section on the different types of graces God bestows. vatican.va/archive/ENG0015/__P6Z.HTM

Here is the paragraph that gives the 2 major divisions.
CCC #2000 Sanctifying grace is an habitual gift, a stable and supernatural disposition that perfects the soul itself to enable it to live with God, to act by his love. Habitual grace, the permanent disposition to live and act in keeping with God’s call, **is distinguished from actual graces **which refer to God’s interventions, whether at the beginning of conversion or in the course of the work of sanctification.There is only 1 “habitual” grace. It is sometimes called sanctifying or deifying grace. (cf. CCC 1999)
It is also referred to as the grace of justification. (cf. CCC 1266)
 
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