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Lisa4Catholics
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The Eucharist is the fruit of the sacrice.His Body and Blood,soul and Divinity.God Bless
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Annunciata
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The Eucharist… The greatest…He left it ALL for us the food for the rest of the journey…
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tkdnick
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I gotta say the greatest gift from God is LIFE! Without life, nothing else happens.
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RobedWithLight
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If Jesus had no free will, He would not be truly human nor truly God, but an automaton.
Gerry
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RobedWithLight
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I fully agree. After the fall, God offered man another chance, by sending His only begotten Son,so that whosoever will believe in Him will have life.
All this because of Love.
Gerry
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Gottle_of_Geer
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Sowndog
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Love
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oriel36
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Jesus was fully human,He was and remains fully Divine hence I can live comfortably with his temporal life on Earth as handed down in scripture and with His presence in mine through experience of love and all gifts of the Spirit.
Giving Jesus a choice in accepting or rejecting His Divine nature is a lesser form of Christ and Christianity and certainly no Catholic would accept this as a tenet of faith.
I rarely quote scripture however in context that it is God’s gift to become a follower of the Christian Way as Jesus himself said rather than a human ability to accept or reject God,I take my stand that sin is nothing more than human free will.
Catholics are conservative and liberal about the wrong things and unfortunately hold anti-Christian views on matters such as free will or what amounts to the same thing - opinions. Christ did not express a philosophical/ theological opinion and neither do I.
ccel.org/t/theo_ger/theologia17.htm
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Curious
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Nobody said Jesus could reject his divine nature. But Jesus could have sinned. If he was absolutely incapable of sinning, he was a robot and I again I say, what good was his sacrfice if he had no choice?
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oriel36
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Whatever Christ did was willed by God ,to believe less is a bad sign and a dilution of the life of Christ into something less than God.What would you have Jesus do so you can be justified in your opinion ?.
27Now my soul is troubled. And what should I say - ‘Father, save me from this hour’? No, it is for this reason that I have come to this hour. John 12.
The easiest thing in the world to do is retreat to the gospel of Matthew,Luke or Mark where Jesus requests -
“Abba, my Father, all things are possible to you. Take this cup away from me; yet, not my will but yours be done” MATT 26
The worst thing anyone can do is try to reconcile a version where Jesus not only accepts the end of his temporal life and recognises His own significance in utter disregard of his life against another version where he pleads with God to spare it.
This is not a matter of expunging one version in favor of another but again,Jesus was fully human in his own lifetime and remains fully Divine in His and in ours.That is why I believe the Word is made flesh and why sin is nothing other than free will with no connection to the Divine Will.
I am sure people assume that sin is strictly a matter of choices based on some moral standard but in the contemplative tradition,sin is missing the point in connecting Jesus to God or connecting the definite with the Infinite.
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tom.wineman
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Our salvation. What greater expression of undeserved love is there than that.
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oriel36
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I understand what you are saying .If Jesus had no free will, He would not be truly human nor truly God, but an automaton.
Gerry
The early Church would have recognised two types of Christians within its ranks (Augustine called on Peter and John as those two different apostolic types) and seen them as complimentary to each other while the center of Christian energy was quite different for both.The vast majority of Christians,both Catholic and Protestant practice their belief comfortably in a balanced way and indeed Christ prayed for this Christian represented by Peter.
20“My prayer is not for them alone. I pray also for those who will believe in me through their message, John 17
biblegateway.com/passage/?search=john%2017;&version=31;
The Christian who is converted as a gift of God and has no choice in the matter cannot be expunged from Apostolic Christianity.The existence of a Catholic/Protestant split lets me know that acceptance of two types of Christians within one Church is no longer celebrated and may not have been done so for many centuries.
The reason that sin is nothing other than human free will is a matter for those who have received the gift of God rather than human choice.
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Curious
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Nobody’s disputing that.
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Curious
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This is not a matter of my opinion and/or my justification. It’s very simple.
Let’s pretend it’s a sin to eat chocolate pie. Let’s also pretend I bring you a big luscious chocolate pie and you are incapable of eating it. Would it be a temptation? Of course not!! You can’t even eat it. It’s impossible for you to commit this sin.
The Bible says Jesus was tempted as we are. If it were impossible for him to commit sin then the temptations he faced would not have even been temptations. By saying that Jesus had no free will, you’re saying he could not have chosen to sin, and therefore was not tempted, when the Bible says he was.
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ProudArmyWife
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I voted with the free will. Again with I agree with the reasons of the other “free will” posters. Without free will, the Eucharist would be meaningless. We need to choose our salvation.
God has many willings upon us ‘fully-humans’ (as Jesus was). Can we all say that we follow God’s will daily? If so, the word abortion would not even be known to us. We must choice our path to Him - the gates of heaven are narrow.
God has many willings upon us ‘fully-humans’ (as Jesus was). Can we all say that we follow God’s will daily? If so, the word abortion would not even be known to us. We must choice our path to Him - the gates of heaven are narrow.
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oriel36
Guest
What is born of the flesh is flesh ,what is born of the Spirit is Spirit,a person who is physically born cannot chose to be Spiritual hence it is God’s choice and decision by the gift of the holy Spirit.Anyone can prepare the ground for God’s gift but only when it pleases His Majesty can we then participate as a follower of Christ.
Christianity is a Spiritual fountain,it is not a natural cistern to be couched in terms of natural appetites and desires.You can only eat so much choc cake or feed any other natural appetite but unfortunately many make Christ and Christianity into an exercise similar to a Stalin-like god who is ready to punish or reward us with heaven or hell.
Hell or the devil is nothing other than self-will with no connection between our temporal and Divine natures.The Eternal Life which encompasses our daily life is the one which generates the great human movements to love through the smallest kindness to the greatest masterpieces.
The devil is the devil because he would chose to love God on his own terms,it happens every day here as many believe that God needs to be defended rather than celebrated.Truly religion has become a cistern of indivual opinions rather than the fountain or the vine and branches.
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WhatIf
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His greates gift is His Son and our Savior! Since that was not a choice, though, I picked the Church. Where would Christianity be, if it wasn’t for the guidance of the Church and its protection from heresy etc.
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Sean.McKenzie
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You hit it on the head!!! it’s good to see so many different viewpoints!!!
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Sean.McKenzie
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This almost seems heretical, could you please shed some more light on what you are saying? “begotten not made…” (credo)If Jesus had no free will, He would not be truly human nor truly God, but an automaton.
Gerry
Moreover man being able to create and make a God!!!
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Benadam
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I have to agree with this at this time. So far it’s the only Gift that is necessary for man’s whole being. His creation and innocent existence, into the history of man right through to man in glory.
It seems God’s gift of Himself is the logical conclusion of this thought. I have a vague feeling that I overcomplicated this.
free will is too.
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