Greek Septuagint update!

[crazzeto]

What Rabbi said this?

History, says this… You dont’ need a Rabbi to learn history.

 

[geometer]

History, says this… You dont’ need a Rabbi to learn history.

Well, state the sources of your loaded questions…

 

[crazzeto]

Well, state the sources of your loaded questions…

One good place to start looking for this kind of information, is in the dictionary

websters-online-dictionary.org/Se/Septuagint.html

for instance

Several factors led Jews to eventually abandon the Septuagint, including the fact that Greek scribes were not subject to the same rigid rules imposed on Hebrew scribes; that Christians favoured the Septuagint; the gradual decline of the Greek language among Jews. Instead, Hebrew/Aramic manuscripts compiled by the Masoretes, or authorative Aramaic translations such as that of Onkelos, of Rabbi Yonasan ben Uziel, and Targum Yerushalmi, were preferred.

Here’s a little more
experiencefestival.com/a/Septuagint_-_Use_of_the_Septuagint/id/599300

 

[geometer]

Septuagint

"Like the sun lost behind the pall of darkness, the brilliance of the Torah had become eclipsed to all those who would now depend upon its rendering in a foreign language, with all its levels of depth and meaning lost. The Torah had become “like a lion in cage,” no longer the king of the beasts striking fear into all who heard its roar, now behind bars and stripped of its freedom and power; so too had the Septuagint reduced the Torah to just another cultural document. "

"The Jews of Egypt rejoiced that this translation would bring them respect and regard from the gentiles among whom the lived. The sages lamented that the translation would cause the Hebrew language to become forgotten among Egyptian Jews and hasten their assimilation. The crises of the next generations, leading to the spiritual darkness that preceded the miracle of Chanukah, proved that the sages’ fears were not unfounded. "

 

[crazzeto]

Septuagint

"Like the sun lost behind the pall of darkness, the brilliance of the Torah had become eclipsed to all those who would now depend upon its rendering in a foreign language, with all its levels of depth and meaning lost. The Torah had become “like a lion in cage,” no longer the king of the beasts striking fear into all who heard its roar, now behind bars and stripped of its freedom and power; so too had the Septuagint reduced the Torah to just another cultural document. "

"The Jews of Egypt rejoiced that this translation would bring them respect and regard from the gentiles among whom the lived. The sages lamented that the translation would cause the Hebrew language to become forgotten among Egyptian Jews and hasten their assimilation. The crises of the next generations, leading to the spiritual darkness that preceded the miracle of Chanukah, proved that the sages’ fears were not unfounded. "

You realize this is coming from a loaded source yes? Oh and my next question is, where is that written in the bible? it seems to me you’re relying upon tradition, not Apostolic, but human tradition for your quotations.

Jewish attitudes toward translations of their scriptures developed with time. By the 2nd century BC, it was often necessary for the readings in the synagogues to be interpreted in Babylonian Aramaic, producing the need for the targumim, though one Talmud writer forbids their use except for foreigners. A later Talmudic injunction by Rabbi Simon ben Gamaliel said that Greek was the only language into which the Torah could be accurately translated. The Septuagint found widespread use in the Hellenistic world, even in Jerusalem, which had become a rather cosmopolitan city and associated with many vibrant Jewish communities. Both Philo and Josephus show the influence of the Greek version in their citations of Jewish scripture.

Several factors finally led most Jews to abandon the Greek, including the fact that Greek scribes were not subject to Jewish technical rules of scribal interpretation; that Christians favoured the LXX; and the** gradual decline of the Greek language among Jews after most of them fled from the Greek-speaking Roman Empire into the Aramaic-speaking Persian Empire** when Jerusalem was destroyed by the Romans. Instead, Hebrew/Aramaic manuscripts compiled by the Masoretes, or authoritative Aramaic translations such as that of Onkelos, of Rabbi Yonasan ben Uziel, and Targum Yerushalmi, were preferred. The LXX translation began to lose official sanction after differences between it and the Hebrew scriptures were discovered. This contributed to the growing renunciation of Hellenization among Jews. All these factors combined and the Jewish people adopted the Masoretic text, except for works such as the Maccabees.

Ethiopian Jews are the only Jewish community today who still accept the Septuagint (minus Ecclesiasticus).

Edit
BTW, here is a comparison chart, showing how often Jesus and the Apostles quoted from the Septuagint:

scripturecatholic.com/septuagint.html

One more

ecclesia.org/truth/septuagint.html

 

[geometer]

You realize this is coming from a loaded source yes? Oh and my next question is, where is that written in the bible? it seems to me you’re relying upon tradition, not Apostolic, but human tradition for your quotations.

Now you are being completely silly. The whole issue is a problem for Jews, the scriptures are Jewish books, written by for and about Jews. Why should goyish oppinions matter?

I quoted from a Jewish source, this is what this Jewish source has to say about the problem in the here and now…

 

[crazzeto]

Here is some more for you:

From trinitarianbiblesociety.org/site/articles/lxx.asp

Perhaps one of the most important instances of the New Testament writers’ use of the Septuagint is Matthew 1.23, in which the Gospel writer quotes Isaiah 7.14. The Hebrew word almah, argued by some in our day to indicate a young woman of marriageable age but one not necessarily a virgin, is translated in the Septuagint as parthenos. This Greek word means virgin, indicating that the Jewish translators before the time of Christ understood the prophecy correctly. Other Jews after the advent of the Christian era translated the word into Greek as neanis, ‘young woman’, in order to distance the prophecy from fulfilment in Jesus. Matthew quotes the Septuagint, applying it to Jesus.

So basically you’re trying to build your knowlege of the Old Testament, based upon a culture which in heavily influenced by the rejection of Christ and early persecution of the Church. This isn’t to say anything about the Jews of today, today they are mostly all fine people just like any other group of people. This isn’t to say, however, that their understanding of history isn’t colored by what earlier generations did. For instance rejecting the Christ, rejecting everything Christians based their faith on (including the septuagint) and more.

 

[crazzeto]

Now you are being completely silly. The whole issue is a problem for Jews, the scriptures are Jewish books, written by for and about Jews. Why should goyish oppinions matter?

I quoted from a Jewish source, this is what this Jewish source has to say about the problem in the here and now…

Here’s a question, at what point was the story you relate first recorded? I would suggest to you it most probably wasn’t until after Christ’s crucifixion and resurection.

 

[geometer]

Here is some more for you:

From trinitarianbiblesociety.org/site/articles/lxx.asp

So basically you’re trying to build your knowlege of the Old Testament, based upon a culture which in heavily influenced by the rejection of Christ and early persecution of the Church. This isn’t to say anything about the Jews of today, today they are mostly all fine people just like any other group of people. This isn’t to say, however, that their understanding of history isn’t colored by what earlier generations did. For instance rejecting the Christ, rejecting everything Christians based their faith on (including the septuagint) and more.

Ok, you want to buy the whole book because Rabbis translated the word alma as virgin. Well, it seems that Rabbis don’t have to do much to make you happy.

You are completely dependent on what the rabbis do and say about the scriptures. They are they source of the language.

 

[crazzeto]

Ok you are you want to buy the whole book because Rabbis translated the word alma as virgin. Well, it seems that Rabbis don’t have to do much to make you happy.

You are completely dependent on what the rabbis do and say about the scriptures. They are they source of the language.

I provided serveral hundred such proofs, if you bother clicking the links I provided you. It doesn’t stop at “virgin”, it continues. More over, you’re not answering my questions about why you feel today’s Jews have a more accurate understanding of what Jesus was quoting, and why than the early Christians did.

 

[geometer]

I provided serveral hundred such proofs, if you bother clicking the links I provided you. It doesn’t stop at “virgin”, it continues. More over, you’re not answering my questions about why you feel today’s Jews have a more accurate understanding of what Jesus was quoting, and why than the early Christians did.

After two thousand years all we know, Jews and everybody, that the new testament used the septuagint as a source. They made use of the errors and everything.

There are a huge number of errors in the new testament about Judaism, I was fortunate to hear a Rabbi carefully go over many of them. And a lot of these errors were not drawn from the septuagint. The writers of the new testament failed at general knowledge of Judaism. This should not even be possible, but it is true…

 

[crazzeto]

After two thousand years all we know, Jews and everybody, that the new testament used the septuagint as a source. They made use of the errors and everything.

There are a huge number of errors in the new testament about Judaism, I was fortunate to hear a Rabbi carefully go over many of them. And a lot of these errors were not drawn from the septuagint. The writers of the new testament failed at general knowledge of Judaism. This should not even be possible, but it is true…

Are you suggesting that Jesus quoted error? Or are you suggesting that the NT is anything but the inerrant word of God?

 

[geometer]

Are you suggesting that Jesus quoted error? Or are you suggesting that the NT is anything but the inerrant word of God?

A Rabbi can show you that the new testament reports patriarchal history falsely, and for no apparent reason. There is no advantage for the writers of the NT to misreport history of the patriarchs.

 

[crazzeto]

A Rabbi can show you that the new testament reports patriarchal history falsely, and for no apparent reason. There is no advantage for the writers of the NT to misreport history of the patriarchs.

Nice attempt to provide a non-answer. Yes or no, is the NT the inerrant word of God? Do you accept that the Word Made Flesh quoted the Septuagint? If so, how do you explain why God Encarnate would qoute and teach error?

 

[geometer]

Nice attempt to provide a non-answer. Yes or no, is the NT the inerrant word of God? Do you accept that the Word Made Flesh quoted the Septuagint? If so, how do you explain why God Encarnate would qoute and teach error?

He said to ask the Rabbis about scripture, and I have been doing that…

 

[crazzeto]

He said to ask the Rabbis about scripture, and I have been doing that…

Ok, now I’m going to need the verse you keep quoting. Where is it. BTW, this was yet another non-answer. Please answer the question.

 

[geometer]

Ok, now I’m going to need the verse you keep quoting. Where is it. BTW, this was yet another non-answer. Please answer the question.

I have been trying to find it, but I am not having any luck. Maybe God has just removed it from the book just for you…

 

[crazzeto]

I have been trying to find it, but I am not having any luck. Maybe God has just removed it from the book just for you…

I seriously doubt that, as the Bible is the inerrant, unchangeable word of God. Much like Apostolic tradition, from whence the bible comes.

 

[geometer]

I seriously doubt that, as the Bible is the inerrant, unchangeable word of God. Much like Apostolic tradition, from whence the bible comes.

You should not tempt God. You should not try to create laws for him to follow, like telling him he is not to change the scriptures.

 

[crazzeto]

You should not tempt God. You should not try to create laws for him to follow, like telling him he is not to change the scriptures.

Where did I tell God anything? I’m stating something which is factually true.