Grounds for Marriage Annulment in the Catholic Church

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I think I want to move to wherever you live.

Jk. I actually don’t mind sticking through a parish with issues. It’s just that a parish with issues and a wife with issues and my own issues is too much! 🙂
 
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i haven’t caught up with the thread, but I want to say.

none should stay with a partner if they are in a situation of domestic violence.
 
Thank you very much for your kind words. It has been my experience and I am so happy it wasn’t yours.

May God Bless you and yours …
 
Absolutely, after being confronted by the pastor/elders/etc. If the problem persists, then I believe separation is warranted.(And not even necessarily confronted by them, but that the loving spouse should make those kinds of interventions to correct bad behavior).

I don’t believe grabbing an arm rough, or throwing something to the wall qualifies for separation. There are levels of anger control problems that can be forgiven/tolerated without unjust separation.

Also, is the other spouse behaving in antagonizing/quarelsome, verbal abuse also?

Not that it justifies abuse, but contributes to temptations. Do not provoke one to anger and take away your spouses peace, and then point, yelling “abuser!”

The same principles apply to sexual infidelity. A spouse who flirts with conversations and compliments is not the same as sexual intercourse. And is the other spouse neglecting sexual relations for long periods, or demanding contraception? Or are they secretly masturbating while the other spouse is left hanging for affection?

Again, the point isn’t that any bad behavior is justified, and must be confessed with efforts of improvement. But a Christian spouse must show efforts of wanting to help the other through faults and weakness, with a willingness to work on their own faults that contribute to hurtful behavior.

It’s these grey areas that don’t make it so simple as saying “no one should stay with an abuser”. Or “my spouse is a cheater and I can leave them”

Especially when children are involved. Each relationship needs guidance and discernment whether a period of separation, or permanent separation is warranted.

And a period of separation should be done with loving support. People can overcome struggles with bad behavior. It doesn’t have to always mean a permanent psychological defect, or that it prohibited the ability to consent to marriage!
 
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rcwitness said:
If the problem persists,
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i am sorry, but if the problem persists is not the answer to putting up with domestic violence.

Once, one episode is enough. Persisting problems lead to dead spouses.

The intervention is not left to pastors and elders. It is left to those who are qualified to intervene, after the one being abused has left.

There is a lot more to stopping domestic violence then correcting bad behaviour.
 
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rcwitness said:
I don’t believe grabbing an arm rough, or throwing something to the wall qualifies for separation.
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there is your main problem, finding it acceptable to lay hands on a partner.

you need to understand the pattern of domestic violence. It escalates.
so there is grabbing arms roughly, throwing things against walls, both indicators of anger management problems

but we know, this escalates. and thats the problem. it can end very badly with a dead person, or gravely injured person. what if a child is in the line of whats being thrown against a wall, what then?

the argument about provoking anger as a defence was thrown out of australian courts as it should be

we cannot control another, we can only control ourselves. If a person feels they are being provoked, they need to deal with it. professionally.

and don’t conflate domestic violence with sexual infidelity.
thats totally unacceptable.
to start discussing sexual issues when the discussion was on domestic violence is concerning
there is no grey area in domestic violence. ever.
 
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Roseeurekacross said:
and don’t conflate domestic violence with sexual infidelity.
thats totally unacceptable.
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I believe that’s because of my post 387, in which I said those were two reasons I would separate, even if there were no grounds for nullity.
 
i can speak as a person who had a partner who tried to kill her once or twice.
If I had said enough and walked away with the first red flag…
 
I’m sorry you were abused this way. However, I have to respectfully disagree. To accuse everyone who let’s their anger get the better of them to the degree of grabbing an arm or throwing something at a wall as the first actions which will ultimately lead to killing someone is very inappropriate.

It has nothing to do with justifying anything violent, rather not accusing someone of something they have not done, or likely will never do.
 
No. But it’s two common reasons that DO justify permanent separation.

I firmly believe in not judging one for gross, exsessive possibilities which some cases have escalated to.
 
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rcwitness said:
. To accuse everyone who let’s their anger get the better of them to the degree of grabbing an arm or throwing something at a wall as the first actions which will ultimately lead to killing someone is very inappropriate.
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do you understand what domestic violence is all about? or are you speaking of your opinions.

because it has been validly defined that domestic violence escalates.

so once an arm is grabbed, a thing is thrown, the boundaries of whats acceptable behaviour move.

next time the arm grab becomes more , the thing thrown becomes an aim at a head etc.

then the boundaries move again

next time the person gets grabbed by the arm and thrown against the wall

the boundaries move again

next time the violence escalates further.

you are going against the valid and reputable research on domestic violence and how it escalates. You are very wrong on this
 
i think you best just drop this line of discussion about what is acceptable or not acceptable in leaving a partner.

because you are advocating acceptable terms for staying with a spouse. and saying oh just discuss it with an elder or a priest
 
For an arm grab or throwing an object? Of course I’m not going to judge someone for attempting to kill me.

I’ve thrown an object against the wall. Yet I’ve never hit my wife!
 
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By the way, I didn’t say “hit”… I said an arm grab or throwing something at the wall.
 
again , do you understand the escalation and moving of boundaries in a situation that begins with arm grabbing and object throwing.

because thats how domestic violence begins. In every single case.

throwing objects against walls is an anger management issue. Putting holes in walls is an anger management issue, breaking objects is an anger management issue.

grabbing arms is an anger management issue

we just don’t run around grabbing the arms of people we are angry with, that leads to us being put in jail. doesn’t it.

what happens when we throw objects against walls in public?
 
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