Growing Up in a Pro Gay Society?

[MainBrain]

Gay marriage has just been legalized in my state. How, (as a Christian and a Catholic), am I supposed to teach my child that being gay goes against scripture without having her labeled as homophobic? I do not believe being gay is a choice. Gays are born that way, in my opinion. I would not have an problem accepting gay marriage other than it goes against my religious beliefs. I know what it’s like to be degraded by those who don’t agree with my biblical beliefs. But in today’s society, I don’t know how a parent is to raise a child in this ultra liberal society that lacks the tolerance for conservative beliefs.

 

[bsroufek]

People are not born homosexual.

As far as teaching your children, you should teach them the truth plainly, without fear of labeling or public harassment.

 

[aTraditionalist]

bsroufek:

People are not born homosexual.

As far as teaching your children, you should teach them the truth plainly, without fear of labeling or public harassment.

This. I’m sorry for your state but the northeast part of the country has succumbed to liberal modernism. Think of your home as an island at this point.

Posted from Catholic.com App for Android

 

[mlz]

Sorrowfully, it is clear we as American Catholics have been lax in our prayers and witness that we are even facing this situation. God understands the struggles we ALL go through with sin but calls us to be faithful to His Church and it’s infallable teachings. Stand strong against the false culture contrary to the teadhings of our Church.

Amen,
mlz

 

[Origen52]

People are not born homosexual.

As far as teaching your children, you should teach them the truth plainly, without fear of labeling or public harassment.

On what evidence do you base your claim that people are not born homosexual?

 

[NFrancis]

I think that you should just tell them what you believe about marriage and tell them the reasons why. You can also explain how people have different opinions and everyone should be respected even if they have a different opinion.

 

[Elizium23]

Experiencing homosexual desires is not a choice. Acting upon them is. As with all types of sin, often we have thoughts, temptations, desires to stray from the path. This is part of being human, this is concupiscence. The goal is to properly form one’s conscience and exercise discipline and frequent reception of the sacraments, all of which will keep us from acting on disordered desires. These desires are not sins, but they are disordered, and they become sins when we entertain them willingly and then go further to act upon them.

Mortal sin requires three things: grave matter, full knowledge, and free consent of the will. Those who attempt homosexual “marriage” are freely consenting to activity that is contrary to Divine Law. It is immaterial whether homosexuals are born that way or conditioned. That is a red herring argument. The scientific answer is that we still don’t know. Pseudo-science has decreed that homosexuality is no longer a disorder, but we don’t believe in pseudo-science; we believe in God’s law and His divinely revealed will for us. The Evil One wants us to believe that sin is not a choice. It would be easy to think that we are helpless in the face of evil, but we are not. We have been equipped with every good grace from God to resist, and so we must.

 

[MarcoPolo]

Whether or not someone is born with a particular disposition does not mean that it is in the best interests of society to normalize or certify that disposition. Some people are born with violent tendencies or attraction to drugs or perversions or whatever. Such persons should be loved, but it is not rational to demand that a disposition at birth be automatically recognized as proper.

There are a number of reasons that are not even religious as to why it is not in the best interest of a society to normalize non-male-female “marriages.”

See
Not all marriages are created equal
Talk by Dr. Jennifer Roback Morse on why a society should not attempt to make same-gendered “marriages”
Replies to “gay marriage” arguments 1
Replies to “gay marriage” arguments 2

I’m sure there are other resources. But the reasoned mind can hopefully recognize that this largely is not an arrangement advantageous for children or a society.

And remember, to teach your own children to love, love, love - which means they would not confirm their friends in a lie, which gay “marriage” is. They would not confirm their friends in the idea that this is a matter of “equality,” which it is not. The great thing about love is that one learns to care for others ultimately beyond that other’s emotional satisfaction.

 

[RedFox0456]

Regardless of whether or not people are born with homosexual desire, some people wind up with it. There is nothing wrong with temptation. In fact, it’s overcoming that temptation that allows us to show our commitment to purity. Similar to how not having fear is not the same thing as being courageous. Honestly, Theology of the Body probably has the best explanation on why we believe the things we do about sexuality. Whenever I read snippets from PJPII, I seem to immediately understand purity that much better.

 

[Elizium23]

The problem is that “homosexuality is not a choice!” is a mantra used to change the conversation and deflect attention away from the real issue. By protesting that they didn’t choose to be this way (having these desires and tendencies) they think we will forget that sexual activity is, in general, a freely chosen act of the will. No, we cannot quite pick and choose what arouses or excites us, so the object of our desire is not usually in the realm of choice. But by free will we can give our body a go/no-go signal to act.

It is like people who demand that contraception be a covered expense because, apparently, having intercourse is so fundamental to their lifestyle, and not anything that is optional or freely chosen, that their inability to control themselves necessitates someone else paying for their release from the natural consequences of their activity. I promise you from first-hand experience that chastity is not misery, nor is it difficult. It requires discipline and self-mastery, but aren’t these all useful qualities to exercise?

Homosexuals are called to chastity. That is not unusual because all of us are called to chastity according to our state in life. Marriage is not a vocation for homosexuals because true marriage relies on sexual complementarity and the ability to engage in conjugal love that is both unitive and procreative.

Children can be taught very simply that men and women are different for a reason. They were built for each other, they fit together in a particular way . This is a scientific, biological fact. God told us to be fruitful and multiply. We do that by becoming one flesh, and starting families and raising the children in the faith. Children deserve both a mother and a father. To take one or both out of the equation does violence to the family and a disservice to all its members. Supporting traditional families is in the best interest of children and mankind. Anything else is cultural suicide.

 

[altms]

Even if people were born homosexual (which I believe isn’t true), what does that have to do with marriage?

 

[Cojuanco]

OP, let us clarify terms.

Being gay, if you mean being attracted to persons of the same sex, is not in and of itself a sin. Science is unsure of how these desires come to be, but in terms of moral theology the debate is actually pretty irrelevant. It just means that they are tempted by the sin of Sodom in particular, in terms of a Catholic outlook, just as another might be tempted to fornication, or another may be tempted to some other sin. It is the acting upon those desires that is a sin.

Of course, mortal sin - which is what the sin of Sodom is - has three elements.

First there must be grave matter. This is definitely the case with homosexual acts objectively.

Then the sin must be done with full knowledge. That is, you know it is wrong, that it’s not only a sin, but a mortal sin, and you know that the consequence of mortal sin can be losing the state of grace.

Then you have to do it with full consent of the will. That is, it must be a voluntary act.

Whether all three elements are present in a particular act is a question a priest or a theologian would understand I do not.

Personally, I would try to model for my hypothetical children the behavior I expect of them. That is, treat every man and woman fairly, and with the dignity they are due. If asked for my opinion on a particular relationship, to say that my belief is that of the Church. But always do it with kindness, and as one who speaks to a friend.

 

[anon36907098]

Think of your home as an island at this point.

People in GDR had fled into an “inner emigration” as they called it before the fall of the wall got reality. That was the way to deal with persecution.

Important is that we as christians keep our freedom in our hearts despite an overwhelming enmity in our environment. You can’t rescue the world in one day but you can protect your familiy on your “island”.

 

[Contra_Mundum_1]

You can’t rescue the world in one day but you can protect your familiy on your “island”.

I disagree with this and think that the OP’s question is reasonable. How *do you *raise children in such a society when you can’t protect them? This ideological pressure is everywhere: the media, entertainment, schools and universities. Friends, neighbours, family members - do they have the same values or will they corrupt children with their ideas? There is no island, unless children live in complete isolation. And what will happen when they take a peek outside the bubble? How will they react to the world and its strange ways?

I’d like to hear some good suggestions on how to handle this and how to install good values in children, because very soon I will be back in the same situation. And I’m dreading it.

 

[marymary1975]

The problem is that “homosexuality is not a choice!” is a mantra used to change the conversation and deflect attention away from the real issue. By protesting that they didn’t choose to be this way (having these desires and tendencies) they think we will forget that sexual activity is, in general, a freely chosen act of the will. No, we cannot quite pick and choose what arouses or excites us, so the object of our desire is not usually in the realm of choice. But by free will we can give our body a go/no-go signal to act.

It is like people who demand that contraception be a covered expense because, apparently, having intercourse is so fundamental to their lifestyle, and not anything that is optional or freely chosen, that their inability to control themselves necessitates someone else paying for their release from the natural consequences of their activity. I promise you from first-hand experience that chastity is not misery, nor is it difficult. It requires discipline and self-mastery, but aren’t these all useful qualities to exercise?

Homosexuals are called to chastity. That is not unusual because all of us are called to chastity according to our state in life. Marriage is not a vocation for homosexuals because true marriage relies on sexual complementarity and the ability to engage in conjugal love that is both unitive and procreative.

Children can be taught very simply that men and women are different for a reason. They were built for each other, they fit together in a particular way . This is a scientific, biological fact. God told us to be fruitful and multiply. We do that by becoming one flesh, and starting families and raising the children in the faith. Children deserve both a mother and a father. To take one or both out of the equation does violence to the family and a disservice to all its members. Supporting traditional families is in the best interest of children and mankind. Anything else is cultural suicide.

 

[anon36907098]

How *do you *raise children in such a society when you can’t protect them? This ideological pressure is everywhere: the media, entertainment, schools and universities. Friends, neighbours, family members - do they have the same values or will they corrupt children with their ideas? There is no island, unless children live in complete isolation. And what will happen when they take a peek outside the bubble? How will they react to the world and its strange ways?

The island I’m talking about doesn’t mean any real place. The island is a picture for the inner emigration I mentioned.

What I want to say is that you can’t silence the ideological pressure at school, media and so on in short-term. But you can fight for a holy heart, and that is the way to protect your children.

On the one hand one can say that this would be cowardly but on the other hand christians in the GDR (and other states) could preserve their faith for their familiy. As long as nobody controlls your private living there remain places like little islands.

This inner emigration decomposed an atheistic state!

We have the truth on our side. The important thing is that your children hear this truth. They will be able to reflect about the things they hear at school and what their parents told them. As long as you live authentic catholic (on your island) they will find out the truth.

I never said the question wouldn’t be reasonable. I regret if you understood me in that way. The problem is absolutly important. I’m facing it since I became father only a few weeks ago My ideas about the inner emigration result from my experiences and my memories to the GDR.

It seems to be a way to deal with this reality. Even because we can’t live in isolation.

 

[mellowcalico]

I am in a rough place with this topic too.

My Ex-husband is gay. He hid from me that he had same sex attraction when we were engaged and later in the engagement (and in the marriage) cheated on me with men. He said he was bisexual when I found out. Long story not so long, he left me, we divorced, he lives a gay lifestyle now (and my marriage was found null–just waiting for the official paperwork before it’s final. The diocese sent me a letter saying a proclamation was on its way).

But in all this, we have a child and joint custody.

I can’t teach anything about homosexuality because I don’t want her to end up disliking her own father (even if I make it very vanilla and try my best to be non-judgmental, it could also be seen by a court as me trying to turn a child o her father–which could effect custody). So I say nothing. I don’t think she understands things yet, but she’s confused why her father has so many friends who have “sleep overs.” Currently he has a live-in boyfriend–number three since he left me three years ago.

Anyway, so yeah… it’s rough. I have no idea what to do.

For what it’s worth, my opinion is that homosexuality is genetic in some fashion. My Ex is gay… so is his brother and three cousins on his mother’s side. No one in my family is gay (and I have a large, extended family). Just seems too co-incidental that it’s so concentrated in his family.

 

[Contra_Mundum_1]

We have the truth on our side. The important thing is that your children hear this truth. They will be able to reflect about the things they hear at school and what their parents told them. As long as you live authentic catholic (on your island) they will find out the truth.

My ideas about the inner emigration result from my experiences and my memories to the GDR.

Thanks for clarifying. I understand exactly what you mean because I also grew up under communism. I was not brought up in the faith but I saw glimpses of religious practice, including in my family.

I have to find the courage to live this countercultural life without fear, believing that lies, no matter how tempting and sweet, can’t win in the end. I pray daily for my children’s purity of hearts and gift of discernment.

 

[gardenswithkids]

Gay marriage has just been legalized in my state. How, (as a Christian and a Catholic), am I supposed to teach my child that being gay goes against scripture without having her labeled as homophobic? I do not believe being gay is a choice. Gays are born that way, in my opinion. I would not have an problem accepting gay marriage other than it goes against my religious beliefs. I know what it’s like to be degraded by those who don’t agree with my biblical beliefs. But in today’s society, I don’t know how a parent is to raise a child in this ultra liberal society that lacks the tolerance for conservative beliefs.

It’s tough. Our conservative beliefs will likely be labeled “homophobic” despite our best efforts to be fair, just and loving towards all. People call us ugly names because they want us to shut up–and sometimes because they are hurting.

I try to be fair to homosexuals and point out to my children that it was mostly heterosexuals who confused our society about the meaning of marriage. Divorce and the sexual revolution left many children being raised without both a father and a mother. Young children who live in a home with both their mother and father may grasp the horror of not living with both a loving mommy and a loving daddy!

I save this next part for older kids.Widespread acceptance of contraception contributed as it both increased sexuality outside of marriage (which correlates to increases in pregnancy outside of wedlock) and changed the understanding of sexuality within marriage when children become viewed as “optional add-ons” rather than the natural outcome of marital relations. Throw in the fact that many heterosexual couples live together without being married, (and they may even have children together), and viola-- marriage just seems like a legal relationship between two adults that has nothing to do with the procreation of children.

Most of us here who are parents of young children know what it’s like to grow up in a pro-choice, pro-contraception society filled people who are divorced and/or “shacking up”. People are products of the previous generation. The culture that we now find is the offspring of a generation that does not seem to recognize that sex makes babies and every child has a mother and father.

Let’s teach our children view people inclined towards homosexuality that same way we view people inclined towards other sexual sins. In other words, view them as humans. Humans in need of salvation from sin, just like the rest of us.

 

[Origen52]

It’s tough. Our conservative beliefs will likely be labeled “homophobic” despite our best efforts to be fair, just and loving towards all. People call us ugly names because they want us to shut up–and sometimes because they are hurting.

I try to be fair to homosexuals and point out to my children that it was mostly heterosexuals who confused our society about the meaning of marriage. Divorce and the sexual revolution left many children being raised without both a father and a mother. Young children who live in a home with both their mother and father may grasp the horror of not living with both a loving mommy and a loving daddy!

I save this next part for older kids.Widespread acceptance of contraception contributed as it both increased sexuality outside of marriage (which correlates to increases in pregnancy outside of wedlock) and changed the understanding of sexuality within marriage when children become viewed as “optional add-ons” rather than the natural outcome of marital relations. Throw in the fact that many heterosexual couples live together without being married, (and they may even have children together), and viola-- marriage just seems like a legal relationship between two adults that has nothing to do with the procreation of children.

Most of us here who are parents of young children know what it’s like to grow up in a pro-choice, pro-contraception society filled people who are divorced and/or “shacking up”. People are products of the previous generation. The culture that we now find is the offspring of a generation that does not seem to recognize that sex makes babies and every child has a mother and father.

Let’s teach our children view people inclined towards homosexuality that same way we view people inclined towards other sexual sins. In other words, view them as humans. Humans in need of salvation from sin, just like the rest of us.

Very well said, I quote your whole post because it bears repeating, and I’m totally incapable of cropping quotes.

I think the reason Catholics, and others opposed to same sex marriage, are seen as homophobic, is because they make no attempt to control heterosexual behaviour by legal means. Where are the demands that serial divorce and remarriage be made illegal?

Democracies function on the principle of the separation of church and state. Homosexuals want the ability to participate in a voluntary, civil contract, we choose to call marriage. If it helped things, why not just call civil marriages, civil unions. If I were to marry only in a civil court, the church would not consider me “married”, and I’d be living in a state of sin. Why do we claim that a civil act degrades a sacrament, when there is no link between the two? Does the fact that, let’s say, Newt Gingrich, has been married three times degrade my marriage, or the sacrament? Then why would homosexual civil marriages have any impact on the sacredness of a religious sacrament?