Habitual tardiness

[mellowcalico]

I sure hope it’s not a sin. I am usually on time and I don’t like being late and feel “bad” when I am late. But most times when I am late it’s out of my control. Where I live it usually takes 45 minutes to get to work (I live 16 miles away from my job). But one minor accident can make that commute double! This Tuesday I was an hour late for work. It took me 2 hours to drive 16 miles.

I am always late bringing my daughter to soccer practice. But the truth is, my daughter has another commitment that ends at the exact same time that soccer begins. I talked to the coach, and he’s okay with our regular tardiness. But another parent who only knows me though soccer and doesn’t know what my daughter’s schedule is that might think I am habitually late for everything and a poor planner.

I don’t think it would be my place to judge whether or not I thought someone else was sinning (by being late or whatever else). I’d hate to have people look at me with accusing eyes when I am late. Sometimes we don’t know the whole story.

 

[EasterJoy]

I sure hope it’s not a sin. I am usually on time and I don’t like being late and feel “bad” when I am late. But most times when I am late it’s out of my control. Where I live it usually takes 45 minutes to get to work (I live 16 miles away from my job). But one minor accident can make that commute double! This Tuesday I was an hour late for work. It took me 2 hours to drive 16 miles.

I am always late bringing my daughter to soccer practice. But the truth is, my daughter has another commitment that ends at the exact same time that soccer begins. I talked to the coach, and he’s okay with our regular tardiness. But another parent who only knows me though soccer and doesn’t know what my daughter’s schedule is that might think I am habitually late for everything and a poor planner.

I don’t think it would be my place to judge whether or not I thought someone else was sinning (by being late or whatever else). I’d hate to have people look at me with accusing eyes when I am late. Sometimes we don’t know the whole story.

You’re not in the wrong. You are late when you can’t help it. When it has been predictable you’ve gotten permission to get there when you can. What anyone else thinks is their rash judgement, and no sin of yours.

 

[lifeisbeautiful]

lateness is not objectively sinful. Jesus was late to one of his best friend’s funeral. if chronically late people annoy me (a subjective response), then it would be best for me to NOT attempt to relegate lateness to the “sin heap.” i’m already annoyed-- i should agree with myself to judge now, too?

“bear wrongs patienly” is a spiritual work of mercy. to my reading, this is much more a clear directive. my vote’s with that.

Well, if you are taking it from the point of view of the person who is not late and whether or not they should judge those who are, that is different. Obviously no one should sit there and think they are on a high horse because they are punctual and the others aren’t. As with any other faults others may have, we should proceed with patience and love.

Nevertheless, I think it is good to acknowledge there could be some sin in being late (obviously not always), heavily depending on the factors surrounding the tardiness. There are millions of things that could be out of one’s hands, but there are situations in which one does have options/choices. I am a person that definitely struggles with the virtue of punctuality, I have a long ways to go. My poor dear husband definitely practices the virtues of patience and love with me. But I do think it is healthy for me to be aware that I need to be considerate of other people’s time and not waste their time. If wasting my own time can be sinful, how can wasting others’ time not be? Venial sins are not thaaat hard to come about…

 

[purplesunshine]

I think that life by the clock is very militant and in many parts of the world isn’t the way things work. It creates an idea that you live and die by the clock and leaves room for little else in life.

I tend to be at things early, but there was at time when I was driving a distance to go to events where I’d either be 20 minutes early or 20 minutes late. One time the roads were clear and I was at an event 40 minutes early. In New England it’s not safe or practical to stay in your car and wait…and it put the host in an awkward postion…and it was an area I didn’t know well, so short of bumming around a 7/11 there were no options. My other friend has the opposite approach for this very reason. To this person “Bible Study is at 8” means that 8 o’clock is when you enter the building.

Most of these are habits people learn from their parents. And I don’t think they are sinful unless there is a malicious intent. Also I think that alot of it has to do with what is expected of you. To one boss an 8am start time means that you’re expected to be already working at 8, done with coffee or any snacks. To another it means that you come in before the clock hits 8 and have a slow start with coffee and chatting and not cracking down for atleast 15 minutes. And anacdotally, most people come to understand what is expected of them either way.

 

[m_crane]

Being late is a sin against the eigth commandment; and thus a grave sin.

If it is committed with consent (ie; not an emergency) and with full knowlege, then one would be committing a mortal sin.

It has to be a *serious matter *also to be a mortal sin, usually lateness doesn’t fall into that catagory.

It’s usually just bad manners.

 

[livnlern]

To me, being early to a party or to someone’s house for dinner is just as bad as being late. When I’m having people over, I usually give an approximate time for them to show up, say 6:00. I get upset when I’m running around trying to light candles and set the table for company and a guest shows up at 5:45 and then I have to use up whatever time I have left in getting them a drink and making them comfortable. What are they thinking? You don’t have to be early unless it’s a surprise party. Outside of that, give the host/hostess a break and a little extra time to mix the onion dip before you make an appearance!
Sorry, I had to vent about this as it’s really aggravating to me.:tsktsk:

 

[EasterJoy]

Sinful? No, unless you are deliberately trying to upset someone.

Super Rude? You bet.

Love is patient, love is kind, love is never rude…

I think there is a difficulty with the “juridical” way of looking at sin: that is, classifying sins as mortal and venial in the same way as we would talk about capital and lesser crimes. The temptation is to think that only those things that get you a “fine” or “jail time” are sins.

God has in mind to make a saint of you, and will not be satisfied with less. It is not OK to be content with less ourselves.

There are people whose faults are such that tardiness is the least of their worries. There isn’t anyone, though, who does well with their soul to allow themselves some amount of rudeness as their due.

As I told my students in religious education, heaven isn’t heaven if you put people in it who don’t act like saints. No matter what things you’d give the group, it wouldn’t be heaven. Anything that doesn’t fit in heaven, that’s a sin.

 

[monicatholic]

there could be some sin in being late

there could be some sinfulness in what causes a person to be late; i.e., disregard of others’ work/ time/ worth, passive aggressions and resentments, intent to annoy etc.

but all those things would be the sin, the lateness would be just any number of possible manifestations; ie, symptoms. a person could be early or right on time and still be harboring those uncharitable intents.

lateness can be a great sourse of humility. i mean, how many years of me struggling to be on time just to have my sister calling crying as i’m walking out the door/ the dog vomiting on the kitchen floor as i put the baby’s snow suit on/ the 3 year old losing her shoes/ the traffic stopped dead because of an accident/ the teen son leaving my car on empty so i have to stop and get gas/ the baby messing her diaper/ (this list can go on and on) before i accept my limitations and weaknesses-- failures even as human, not necessarilly sinful.

objectively, lateness is not a sin.

i’m so much more with livnlearn on this one. do NOT show up early to my house. i still have 5 kids at home (one of them special needs.) you think i dont need those last 15 minutes? that’s when*** I ***have a hard time bearing wrongs patiently.

 

[EasterJoy]

objectively, lateness is not a sin.

Correct.

Choosing to have a disregard for other people’s time without service to a greater consideration, failing to keep commitments that were in your power to keep with no compelling reason, these can be sins. It is not whether we have served the clock, but whether we have failed in our duties, taken as a whole.

Sometimes, other people are late, and we just have to cope with that. After all, judging others based solely on whether or not their behavior is convenient to us could also be a sin.

 

[lifeisbeautiful]

Correct.

Choosing to have a disregard for other people’s time without service to a greater consideration, failing to keep commitments that were in your power to keep with no compelling reason, these can be sins. It is not whether we have served the clock, but whether we have failed in our duties, taken as a whole.

 

[KitSileya]

I don’t know whether I would call it a grave sin, but I do believe the circumstances matter a lot. I am always habitually early for things - hate having to stress, and so I plan accordingly. If people are late, I start worrying that I got the wrong information, that I’m in the wrong place, or on the wrong date etc. I find it very stressful.

Another friend of mine was complaining about a friend of hers that is late for everything - often an hour late to dinners, or other things. She cannot even pre-order movie tickets when they go to the movies, because often the friend would be so late they’d miss half the movie. And the friend won’t even call to say that she will be late, or even apologize. When I considered my array of friends, I realized I had deliberately let friendships lapse with people like that, because the stress outweighed the benefits I could get from their friendships. In other words, it’s a deal breaker for me.

I deliberately give anyone with children 10 minutes leeway for each child under the age of 10, (giving my Godmother 40 minutes extra - she’s very grateful for that ) but adults without children should manage to be on time or manage to send a text message when they realize they are going to be late. Some might consider that uncharitable, but I feel it is equally uncharitable to make me wait for 10-30 minutes, especially considering the climate of the place in which I live.

 

[cmscms]

I have to admit that in the past I was one of those people who couldn’t be counted on to be on time. I thank God that He has helped me become more punctual.

I agree that communication is the key. However, I also am of the nature that I really resent people who are late when there is no good reason. For example, they live 20 minutes from my place, they are suppose to be at my place at 1:00pm and at 12:00 pm they decide to throw a load of laundry in that takes 1 hour. They walse into my place at 1:45 expecting me to have total compassion for the fact they needed to do laundry. I just want to bang my head agains the wall !!! I purposely tell them 48 hours in advance to be ay my place for one so that they can have ample time to do their laundry or call me if they won’t be able to make it, they carry on with their life as if we never had plans and then at the last minute ‘Well, I was down to my last pair of underwear so you should understand laundry was more important’ That is just inconsiderate.

Another pet peeve of mine. If I agree to meet Person A downtown at 3:00pm and I am still a 10 minute walk away and it is 2:45pm, I will often bump into person B who is happy to see me and wants to talk. The first thing I say is ‘I am sorry but I am meeting person A in 15 minutes I can’t talk. I’d love to hear from you give me a call’. Person B ALWAYS takes it as the brush off !!! How can they expect me to always drop what I am doing because I bumped into them. Do they not realize we did not have an appointment !!!

One last thing that irks me about people who are chronically late for a social date and offer no apology and get offended when I ask them to be on time. I have NEVER seen any one of those people be late to catch a plane or show up for work. So why is it all of a sudden OK to be late when they have a social date with CM???

And since I am having so much fun airing my resentments, here is another one. If me and person A are walking to the movies and we bump into person A’s friend they will stop and talk. I will make it very obvious that I do not want to stop and talk and will even come out and say ‘The movie starts in 10 minutes’. Person A will continue to talk to their friend and then when we are alone and I express that I am annoyed that we missed the beginning of the movie, they will get mad at me stating ‘What was I suppose to do. I needed to be polite and I actually enjoy talking with my friend’. That is so wrong. You had a pre-agreed to event planned with me. You can not just brushed me off to the side because someone else shows up at the last minute. Not to mention, if you love talking to your other friend so much, why did you make a movie date with me instead of making a date with them???

Ahh… the difference in mind frames

Thanks guys

 

[gardenswithkids]

Thinking about this more, and reading replies, it seems to me the key is communication.

If I say I will be at the youth group meeting which starts at 6 pm, what I mean by that is that I will be there, in my seat, ready to listen at 6 pm. So if I do NOT adhere to MY meaning, my understanding I am being deceitful, lying, in one way. (Dict. definition of deceive: to mislead by a false appearance or statement; delude) Perhaps not a serious offense, nor grave matter. But I haev deceived by saying I will be there (and what being there means according to me) and then not being.

Now, on the other hand, if by, “Yes, I’ll be at the youth group meeting,” YOU mean that you will probably pull into the parking lot at 6 pm, then spend 15 min. using the bathroom, hanging up your coat, etc. and be in your seat at 6:15; then you are not lying or being deceptive. You are fulfilling what YOU mean by being there. Which is different than what I mean by being there.

So, does not much of the “problem” boil down to communication? What we mean by our words. Some feel it is okay to be (say more than 5 minutes) late for various functions. That, “I’ll be there,” means within 15 (or 30 or whatever) and are fine with that, see nothing wrong with it, do not see the words, “I’ll be there,” as a commitment to being there at 6 pm. Others, like myself, see the words, “I’ll be there,” as a commitment to being in place, in your seat by 6 pm, ready to begin.

I am not sure if society (our American society) has a norm on this. Some people/places/events believe being late X number of minutes is perfectly acceptable. Some do not.

I agree with this part, especially the part that questions if this is the norm. Some cultures use precise Swiss watches and set clock towers in the middle of the town square; some cultures use the position of the sun in the sky and sun dials. Swiss-watch people might get easily annoyed with sundial people. LOL on the term someone used “chronologically challenged”.

I don’t think people who are habitually late are “lying” or “sinning” when they say they’ll be somewhere at 6 o’clock and then show up at 6:15. If that’s lying, then couldn’t someone who says they’ll be somewhere at 6 o’clock who shows up at 5:45 also be accused of lying?

Isn’t extreme earliness rude, just as extreme tardiness is rude? And is it even a sin to be rude? Not always. What’s considered rude in one culture isn’t always considered rude in another.

Yes, we have a lot of control over whether we are on time or not. But one person considers “on-time” might not be what another person considers “on-time”.

Some people say “six” when they mean approximately six. Those who arrive early everywhere apparently also must use approximations with time, otherwise they would not be annoyed by people who show up precisely as the bell chimes.