Hard time distinguishing temptation from sin of thought

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I’ve had some hard time attempting to distinguish between sin of thought and temptation.
Please help me sort it out.

First case:
In the city, and especially buses, we are confronted with all sorts of butts. Sometimes, and especially when I’m tired, my eyes are drawn towards them, but once I realize it, I turn my eyes away. Should I consider it temptation or sin of thought already? How long a glance is a sin? I guess there’s no rule of thumb you can use with a chronometer (no 5 second rule- haha!).

Second case:
I am in the bus, and the driver doesn’t stop while I’m rushing to the door. I ring the bell over and over and bye-bye bus stop one block (-ish) from my workplace.
So then I get off, I try to control my self at first and before I known it I am blinded by several minutes of fantasies of revenge where I punch the living ketchup out of the driver’s nose. Then I shake it off. A few steps later, I’m overcome again by similar fantasies which last a few seconds (time in fantasyland lasts a million years so I can only suppose) and I shake them off.

(I’m starting to think buses are an instrument of the devil LOL
😃 )

No, now seriously, what should I think? Should I go and confess before my next eucharist? (I confessed on the day before Ash Wednesday (a.k.a. two days ago).
 
Correction:

Where it says: “…] I am blinded by several minutes of fantasies of revenge”,
it should read: “…] I am blinded by several seconds of fantasies of revenge”
 
I’m not sure on the confession. But I will say that the answers you’re going to get from people on this forum with thus matter seem pretty strict to me and I advise instead asking your priest about these as his answer will be much more authoritative than a poster here.
 
Like the above user said, talk to your confessor or spiritual director. This is a hard one to describe on a forum as it’s much more nuanced than your post suggests.

I’ve always lived by this rule on seeing other people’s attractiveness: it’s not a sin to notice other’s beauty you were made by God to see that beauty and to desire it. It’s not a sin to have sexual thoughts or quick unbidden fantasies as long as you (and here’s the key phrase) do not encourage or give yourself over to them.

Example: I see a pretty girl in clothes that fit her well, and I think to myself, “wow, she’s beautiful/hot/lovely.” My imagination then takes it to the next step and I think about what lies underneath… There I stop and say a quick prayer, “How lovely are Your dwelling places, O LORD of hosts!” (Psalm 84:1). Or I stop and say, “she deserves more respect than for me to jump to dirty thoughts right away.” I thank God for her beauty and I evaluate where I am in my life: am I single and ready to pursue women? Am I in a relationship? Am I single, but not ready?
Use those moments to better yourself, friend. Noticing beauty is not a sin, having lusty thoughts isn’t a sin, but choosing to have lusty thoughts is a sin.
 
The more persistent the temptation, the clearer it is that you have not given consent to it. “It is a good sign,” says St. Francis de Sales, “when the tempter makes so much noise and commotion outside of the will, for it shows that he is not within.” An enemy does not besiege a fortress that is already in his power, and the more obstinate the attack, the more certain We may be that our resistance continues.
  1. Your fears lead you to believe you are defeated at the very moment you are gaining the victory. This comes from the fact that you confound feeling with consent, and, mistaking a passive condition of the imagination for an act of the will, you consider that you have yielded to the temptation because you felt it keenly.
    by Fr. Quadrupani*Light and Peace *
It seems that if I realize I am thinking something and I shake myself and stop (or pray, for the recurring ones) that I have not consented.
 
Filius_Prodigus said:
I’ve had some hard time attempting to distinguish between sin of thought and temptation.
Please help me sort it out.

First case:
In the city, and especially buses, we are confronted with all sorts of butts. Sometimes, and especially when I’m tired, my eyes are drawn towards them, but once I realize it, I turn my eyes away. Should I consider it temptation or sin of thought already? How long a glance is a sin? I guess there’s no rule of thumb you can use with a chronometer (no 5 second rule- haha!).

Second case:
I am in the bus, and the driver doesn’t stop while I’m rushing to the door. I ring the bell over and over and bye-bye bus stop one block (-ish) from my workplace.
So then I get off, I try to control my self at first and before I known it I am blinded by several minutes of fantasies of revenge where I punch the living ketchup out of the driver’s nose. Then I shake it off. A few steps later, I’m overcome again by similar fantasies which last a few seconds (time in fantasyland lasts a million years so I can only suppose) and I shake them off.

(I’m starting to think buses are an instrument of the devil LOL
😃 )

No, now seriously, what should I think? Should I go and confess before my next eucharist? (I confessed on the day before Ash Wednesday (a.k.a. two days ago).
Click to expand...
Mortal sin must be deliberate (a deliberate thought, decision or action or inaction), committed in full knowledge and in full freedom.

A deliberate thought differs from a temptation in that a deliberate thought requires consent to wanting to commit that action or thought,

The saints have said it is a sin to deliberately think, “Gosh I would love to commit that sin,” (a sin has been committed in thoughts that way).

Whereas it’s not a sin to be tempted and say no to that temptation.
 
Thank you for your replies.
👍

They make sense. Perhaps it’s just scruples, and that can be the worst temptation of all, making virtue insufferable until you reach breaking point and send it all to hoot. It’s happened to me before (thus my online name)… but then is then and now is now, older, wiser, enough to notice and do something about it (like ask).

God bless you all.
 
My husband is scrupulous, so I deal constantly with helping him in this regard (distinguishing temptation from sin), and the first thing I ask him, which his spiritual director told him to ask himself also, is can you say without a doubt that you know what you did was mortally sinful? And if not, then it wasn’t mortal, and so drop it, even though we must not take venial sin lightly, but when someone is scrupulous, it’s hard distinguishing between mortal and venial, and it’s best to move on, rather than let it drive you crazy till your next confession.

But as for knowing when an evil thought becomes sinful? It becomes sinful when, after you recognize the temptation, continue to dwell on those evil thoughts and take pleasure in them…It is not sinful as long as you are fighting it, so even if you recognize the temptation, but are still struggling to get the thoughts out of your mind, that is not sinful, and infact it is meritorious when you succeed (by the grace of God) to overcome it,
But not all evil thoughts are mortal, you need to learn where the line is between mortal and venial with regard to types of sins, and if you don’t know if something is mortally sinful, then it’s not, because for something to qualify as mortal you need full knowledge, full consent, and grave matter.

It’s also a good idea to examine your motives, because often times scrupulosity is a result of thinking too much of ourselves, and taking ourselves too seriously, rather than thinking of God and avoiding sin for His sake alone.

Well, I hope I haven’t said too much, but I hope it helps anyways, take care.
 
(I will re-post a post I posted before - general remarks about “unwanted thoughts”)

UNWANTED THOUGHTS

All sorts of thoughts can happen to us out of the blue…(not sought etc)

The fact that a thought happened to one- does not mean per se there was any sin.

And for mortal sin one needs not only grave matter, full knowledge and deliberate (complete) consent…

Just cause a thought happened to you does not mean there was any sin. Let alone mortal sin.

Just calmly turn to something good…

Even if the thoughts return and return…or are intensely happening that does not mean there was any sin per se.

The fact that one is does not want them that they are go against what you want can rather be a sign one is well does not want them (does not consent fully). Talk with your Priest in confession about this …get some personal guidance.
Now…

For the next few moments --try real hard NOT to think of an Apple.

then scroll down.

What did you think of?

An apple.

Even though your will was against it (you did not want to think of an apple!)

Now back to unwanted thoughts…

The more you fear and try hard not to have them…the more they will likely come and bother you.

The best thing to do with such thoughts is not to fight them directly --not fear that they will come—simply do not consent and simply and calmly turn to something else…(or it may be best to keep doing the good thing one is doing…like they come out of the blue when your at work …keep working…keep praying …etc…calmly ignoring them…turning to something good…)

Ignore such unwanted thoughts like one would ignore a hissing goose or a barking dog. One does not stop to argue with a hissing goose or a barking dog does one? No. One keeps on walking…

(image there comes from a Carthusian Monk from centuries ago…)

Ignore such unwanted thoughts and do not fear them…just calmly turn to something good.
 
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