harry potter

[mdrummer5]

Yep - completely blind!

This is the kind of statement made by someone who has no logical point to make. I’m blind because I’m smart enough to use the brain that God gave me to differentiate between fantasy and reality? I feel sorry for you or anyone who can’t make that distinction. Whether it be a lack of eduction or lack of IQ it’s very unfortunate.

Consider the spells in the books.

Wingardium Leviosa - makes an object fly… the words are clearly derived from “wing” and “levitate”

Immobulus - renders target immobile… I hope I don’t have to point out the connection there.

These things are clearly made up. Please show me an incantation that’s in the Harry Potter books which are fiction that is also present in a book related to “true” witchcraft.

The problem with people that think like this is that you’re so close minded and stubbornly set in your way of thinking that you perceive everything that isn’t purely Christian as evil. So while you have no logical rebuttal you will also not concede that it makes sense.

 

[Lost_Wanderer]

This is the kind of statement made by someone who has no logical point to make. I’m blind because I’m smart enough to use the brain that God gave me to differentiate between fantasy and reality? I feel sorry for you or anyone who can’t make that distinction. Whether it be a lack of eduction or lack of IQ it’s very unfortunate.

Education? IQ? How about basic sanity?

 

[melchesidechpio]

So does LOTR, Narnia, as well as classic Arthurian romance. I guess you find them offensive as well?

I am not familiar with those writings. Here is what the Catechism says about sourcary

Divination and magic

2115 God can reveal the future to his prophets or to other saints. Still, a sound Christian attitude consists in putting oneself confidently into the hands of Providence for whatever concerns the future, and giving up all unhealthy curiosity about it. Improvidence, however, can constitute a lack of responsibility.

2116 All forms of divination are to be rejected: recourse to Satan or demons, conjuring up the dead or other practices falsely supposed to “unveil” the future.48 Consulting horoscopes, astrology, palm reading, interpretation of omens and lots, the phenomena of clairvoyance, and recourse to mediums all conceal a desire for power over time, history, and, in the last analysis, other human beings, as well as a wish to conciliate hidden powers. They contradict the honor, respect, and loving fear that we owe to God alone.

2117 All practices of magic or sorcery, by which one attempts to tame occult powers, so as to place them at one’s service and have a supernatural power over others - even if this were for the sake of restoring their health - are gravely contrary to the virtue of religion. These practices are even more to be condemned when accompanied by the intention of harming someone, or when they have recourse to the intervention of demons. Wearing charms is also reprehensible. Spiritism often implies divination or magical practices; the Church for her part warns the faithful against it. Recourse to so-called traditional cures does not justify either the invocation of evil powers or the exploitation of another’s credulity.

 

[Lost_Wanderer]

I am not familiar with those writings. Here is what the Catechism says about sourcary

Then be familiar and educate yourself before you speak on the subject any further.

And for the record? I also advise you against citing a passage from the Catechism that I have read plenty times over. Fantasy magic doesn’t fall under the Catechism’s criteria. Then again, I don’t expect you to grasp that fact since you don’t even bother yourself with studying what it is you’re attacking.

P.S.

Btw, it’s spelled “sorcery” not “sourcary”. Unless you’re trying to pass yourself off as a witty mixer of words (in which case, you’re failing miserably in even trying), kindly please use some decent spelling.

 

[melchesidechpio]

Then be familiar and educate yourself before you speak on the subject any further.

And for the record? I also advise you against citing a passage from the Catechism that I have read plenty times over. Fantasy magic doesn’t fall under the Catechism’s criteria. Then again, I don’t expect you to grasp that fact since you don’t even bother yourself with studying what it is you’re attacking.

P.S.

Btw, it’s spelled “sorcery” not “sourcary”. Unless you’re trying to pass yourself off as a witty mixer of words (in which case, you’re failing miserably in even trying), kindly please use some decent spelling.

1. If I wanted to read Narnia and the other work that you mentioned, I will do so
2. I am new to this forum. Your bad attitude is really unprofessional and I haven’t conversed with you so I do not know what you know and don’t know. So please refrain from being so rude.
3. I honestly didn’t know how to spell sorcery
   

 

[Lost_Wanderer]

1. If I wanted to read Narnia and the other work that you mentioned, I will do so

Yes well, in my defense, you speaking on topics you have little knowledge about isn’t so professional either.

1. I am new to this forum. Your bad attitude is really unprofessional and I haven’t conversed with you so I do not know what you know and don’t know. So please refrain from being so rude.

Yes I’m aware of that. However, if you find me rude then do forgive me when I say that’s just how I talk (or write, either way my rhetoric is the same). On the other hand, you shouldn’t feel so defensive. All I ask is that you learn about that which you wish to argue about. I’ve experienced it more than once on these forums where someone felt offended by me suggesting that they are ignorant about the topic at hand. If you feel offended by that the I can’t help you. A fact is a fact.

1. I honestly didn’t know how to spell sorcery
   

Well you learn something new everyday. Although let me tell ya. I’ve met a lot of online users who have so much hatred for the things they protest that they caricature their very names. (e.g. fundamentalists twisting the name/title of Pope Benedict). Glad to know you’re not one of those people.

 

[mdrummer5]

Education? IQ? How about basic sanity?

I suppose this would be more accurate as one thing that defines an insane person is their inability to realize that they’re insane.

1. If I wanted to read Narnia and the other work that you mentioned, I will do so

The fact that you haven’t read any of the books being discussed makes you completley ignorant to what you’re arguing.

There have been a few instances of people citing the Catechism in reference to Harry Potter.

2115 God can reveal the future to his prophets or to other saints. Still, a sound Christian attitude consists in putting oneself confidently into the hands of Providence for whatever concerns the future, and giving up all unhealthy curiosity about it. Improvidence, however, can constitute a lack of responsibility.

2116 All forms of divination are to be rejected: recourse to Satan or demons, conjuring up the dead or other practices falsely supposed to “unveil” the future.48 Consulting horoscopes, astrology, palm reading, interpretation of omens and lots, the phenomena of clairvoyance, and recourse to mediums all conceal a desire for power over time, history, and, in the last analysis, other human beings, as well as a wish to conciliate hidden powers. They contradict the honor, respect, and loving fear that we owe to God alone.

Please explain (AFTER YOU’VE READ THEM) how the Harry Potter books make one curious about the future or how to obtain knowledge about it. Yes divination is one of the subjects at the FICTIONAL school but it is regarded as rubbish… if they were glorifying the idea of it or offering suggestions as to how to pursue it in real life (AGAIN IT’S FICTION)… I’d be right there with you. I’d also like to point out that the mere mention of something that goes against God does not make the source material evil or anti-Christian again, glorifying it in any way would but that doesn’t happen here.

2117 All practices of magic or sorcery, by which one attempts to tame occult powers, so as to place them at one’s service and have a supernatural power over others - even if this were for the sake of restoring their health - are gravely contrary to the virtue of religion. These practices are even more to be condemned when accompanied by the intention of harming someone, or when they have recourse to the intervention of demons. Wearing charms is also reprehensible. Spiritism often implies divination or magical practices; the Church for her part warns the faithful against it. Recourse to so-called traditional cures does not justify either the invocation of evil powers or the exploitation of another’s credulity

Seeing as how you’ve not read them you wouldn’t know this… but in the Potter books nobody is attempting to tame occult powers… given that it’s FICTION all of the witches and wizards are BORN with the innate ability to use magic. Again, it is all made up. I can appreciate your views and the strength in your faith but you are ignorant on this subject which is not a bad thing until you try to argue against it. Consider this before making your points.

It’s a world of fantasy and make believe and on that subject please review the following…

alexross.com/dbID/715.html

Are you honestly going to tell me that’s evil? The pricetag is but seriously? By your logic or lack of that picture is evil. If you truly believe that then you need to have your head examined.

 

[jimmy]

Where? I have yet to see where the “love” she posits is Grace from a Divine source and anything more than human love.

There is more than just the Augustinian tradition of Christianity. In the writings of Basil of Caesarea, love of God and neighbor is natural to man.
“Having received, therefore, a command to love God, we have possessed the innate power of loving from the first moment of our creation. Of this, no external proof is required, since anyone can discover it of himself and within himself. We are by nature desirous of the beautiful, even though individual conceptions of the beautiful differ widely (St. Basil, The Longer Rule, Q.2R).”

And regarding your problem with Harry and Voldemort drawing their power from the same source. You assert that good draws its power from God and evil draws its power from Satan. The question then arises, how did Satan become evil? The reality is that evil is a result of free will. Everyone draws from the same sources of power in real life, the difference is in how they use it. A man can either use his free will for good, or he can use it for evil.

That aside, do you expect every piece of fiction or literature you read to be explicitely Christian? If that is the case, your selection of books to read will be cut much smaller than it is. Charles Dickens, Jack London, and out because their writings aren’t explicitely Christian.

 

[jimmy]

I suppose this would be more accurate as one thing that defines an insane person is their inability to realize that they’re insane.

The problem with that argument is that it doesn’t specify who is crazy. Consequently it can be used against anyone. I think I am very sane, but with your thought in mind I could be completely insane without knowing it. The same can be said for anyone. The question is, how do you test whether you are sane? Do I just trust my own sanity to others who could very well be just as insane as me?

 

[mdrummer5]

The problem with that argument is that it doesn’t specify who is crazy. Consequently it can be used against anyone. I think I am very sane, but with your thought in mind I could be completely insane without knowing it. The same can be said for anyone. The question is, how do you test whether you are sane? Do I just trust my own sanity to others who could very well be just as insane as me?

Touche… lack of IQ it is! lol

 

[Lost_Wanderer]

The question is, how do you test whether you are sane? Do I just trust my own sanity to others who could very well be just as insane as me?

Oh that’s easy enough. Just check if the person seriously believes whether or not brooms can fly and sticks produce weird lights and sparks if you wave them around whilst speaking dog Latin.

 

[joandarc2008]

Not Fr. Euteneuer again. No offense but do you realize how many times how that LifeSiteNews priest has been cited on the subject of Harry Potter? If you’re going to commit the fallacy of appealing to an authority then at least show some variety and not point to the same man over and over again.

With that said, I will outright dismiss the man. You’re reading this right. (Am I hearing gasps?) He’s a priest, not a literary critic and he’s overstepping the boundaries of his jurisdiction. Unless he’s shown at least some competence in the study of literary theory and the practice of writing fiction, he shouldn’t be regarded as an authority on the matter. Hence, it should be declared that anyone who cites him is clearly committing a fallacy.

Actually he is not being cited merely as a priest he is being cited as a priest that is a fully trained exorcist which up until this Fall there were not that many in the US. So with all due respect before getting an ad hominem argument on a member of the clergy you should research his resume.

 

[Lost_Wanderer]

Actually he is not being cited merely as a priest he is being cited as a priest that is a fully trained exorcist which up until this Fall there were not that many in the US.

Does his resume include a degree in Literary Theory? Has he published any work of fantasy or just fiction even? Seeing as Harry Potter falls under those jurisdictions, it would seem that he and people such as yourself are forgetting your place.

So with all due respect before getting an ad hominem argument on a member of the clergy you should research his resume.

With all due respect, know what an ad hominen is before you start with the accusations. Being an exorcist doesn’t make you an expert on everything. If that’s an ad hominem to you, then I don’t even wanna know what ‘debate’ means in your ‘spiritual warfare’ dictionary.

 

[jimmy]

These threads on Harry Potter are a little rediculous. It is an argument between people who have read Harry Potter and those who haven’t. Those who are against Harry Potter, typically haven’t read Harry Potter. The question is, how can you really criticize something that you haven’t read? I would bet that everyone on this thread would be offended if a fundamentalist protestant wrote a critical review of Jesus of Nazareth, by P. Benedict without even reading the book.

The only argument that they can really offer is, ‘it is better to not read it just to be safe.’ They can’t make an argument regarding the supposed occult that it contains or the lack of Christianity because they haven’t read it and they don’t know what it says. So all they can say is avoid it, just to be safe. You can also avoid life, just to be safe, because life is dangerous.

 

[mdrummer5]

Actually he is not being cited merely as a priest he is being cited as a priest that is a fully trained exorcist which up until this Fall there were not that many in the US. So with all due respect before getting an ad hominem argument on a member of the clergy you should research his resume.

To go along with what LW said… Fr. Euteneuer nor anyone on these forums has presented a reason as to how harry potter is “has helped educate ‘younger generations in the language and the symbolism of the occult.’” They just make vague accusations without any proof. I don’t care what someone’s qualifications are if they can’t back up their claim. If you agree with him based solely on who he is rather than asking where such a claim comes from then you’re clearly not taking full advantage of the brain God blessed you with.

 

[promethius]

I was always under the impression that grace comes in many forms.

but not in the form of tricks of natural law or innate magical abilities. Grace supercedes natural law and is directly imparted by God.

Do forgive me if I find that this sounds like you imposing an outside, irrelevant theology to a fictional universe.

I’m totally at a loss for how one who calls themselves catholic thinks that moral discussion is irrelevant in child development…

So does LOTR, Narnia, as well as classic Arthurian romance. I guess you find them offensive as well?

This article defines the difference in these series far better than I could: catholic.com/thisrock/2001/0107fea1.asp

Even so, like I said, I don’t have a problem with the use of magic in the HP series, just with the fact that the moral lessons do not align with Christian moral theory and as such parents should be cautious to raise their children with appropriate catechisis while still allowing them to read such works.

Yet God created this world and God created the human imagination in which works such as Harry Potter are first conceived.

The fact that a human imagination can come up with something is in no way an argument in favor of that thing. Human “art” has composed “works” wherein there were images of a crucifix submerged in urine, a “painting” of the virgin Mary composed of pornographic images and feces, and a video of a crucifix with ants crawling over it.

The human imagination is not justification of anything, because the human imagination is flawed. We must always view art in context with morality.

Yeeep, I was right. You are imposing outside theology. Sorry but are you aware that you’re actually a committing a crime against the laws of objective literary criticism? Okay maybe its not a crime, but it is certainly one of the worst ways one can approach a story.

Really? Actually being aware of the morals and philosophy espoused by an author is BAD reading practice? Being aware of one’s OWN theology and morality in comparison is BAD practice?

What school did you go to? I need to write to your principle and inform him that his literature instructors are failing their students in regards to lessons on critical reading and comprehension…

What you’re doing is pretty much no different than a physics guy complaining about how a certain superhero can do this when it’s completely impossible.

conversely, moral lessons transcend the fantasy aspect of a work. We know that physical law is foregone in fantasy works (I have a bachelor of science degree in Physics, btw… so nice accidental example there). What is NOT clear is whether or not an author intends a moral imperitive to be applied to the real world or not, and whether or not a person will apply such a moral imperitive to the real world.

This is why it is important for parents to take the time to give their children proper catechisis… so their children are not being raised by TV and books which impart unchristian moral values.

It’s kinda annoying really, no offense.

Again, it baffles me how someone who is catholic finds proper catechesis “annoying”…

Just hammer in the fact that fantasy doesn’t work the same way as reality and vice-versa and bam. Problem solved.

Now it’s clear you either haven’t been reading my posts are aren’t comprehending them, because you’ve just said EXACTLY what I’ve been saying all along…

Proper parenting involves proper moral foundation and reenforcing to children that entertainment is not always true or a good source of moral guidance. That’s the bottom line.

 

[promethius]

Yes divination is one of the subjects at the FICTIONAL school but it is regarded as rubbish…

Not an argument either way, just a note. For intellectual honesty purposes, they do not take the divination class because it is rubbish. They take it because they think it will be easy to get good marks.

The book makes wholly clear that the teacher of the class IS able to make predictions about the future… just not using the methods she teaches in class.

Please, if you’re going to debate that someone needs to read the texts in order to intellectually discuss them, then you should at least hold yourself to an honest standard regarding YOUR discussion of what is actually in the texts.

 

[promethius]

There is more than just the Augustinian tradition of Christianity. In the writings of Basil of Caesarea, love of God and neighbor is natural to man.
“Having received, therefore, a command to love God, we have possessed the innate power of loving from the first moment of our creation. Of this, no external proof is required, since anyone can discover it of himself and within himself. We are by nature desirous of the beautiful, even though individual conceptions of the beautiful differ widely (St. Basil, The Longer Rule, Q.2R).”

Again, even in St Basil, the ability to love is given to us via Divine Command, and without God there is no love. We see no such indication of any sort of Divine Command or grace as the basis of human love in the entire series of Harry Potter.

God is all goodness and love, and without God there is no goodness or love. Different traditions believe this manifests in different ways, but ultimately they agree: Love is a gift from God and without God humans would be depraved creatures.

And regarding your problem with Harry and Voldemort drawing their power from the same source. You assert that good draws its power from God and evil draws its power from Satan. The question then arises, how did Satan become evil? The reality is that evil is a result of free will. Everyone draws from the same sources of power in real life, the difference is in how they use it. A man can either use his free will for good, or he can use it for evil.

This is a statement of terrible catechesis and nothing more. When Padre Pio had his visions, or when anyone draws on any charism whatsoever, these are acts of grace by the HOLY SPIRIT. Satan, by contrast, does not draw his abilities are actions by grace of the Holy Spirit, because he is entirely cut off from grace.

Satan, by contrast, is possessed of the innate ability according to his creation as an angel. He is ONLY able to draw on supernatural capabilities which are in keeping with his own personal ability as a being who was an angel.

Charisms are from God, occult powers are deceptions given by Satan, who in his own right is powerful by human standards but is entirely separated from and weak before the power of God.

Please, seek the proper catechesis of a good priest if you think that Charisms and Occult powers derive from the same source and are merely tools to be used according to human will…

That aside, do you expect every piece of fiction or literature you read to be explicitely Christian? If that is the case, your selection of books to read will be cut much smaller than it is. Charles Dickens, Jack London, and out because their writings aren’t explicitely Christian.

You haven’t been reading any of my posts have you? I have said time and again that I have no problem with anyone reading works of fiction such as Harry Potter. What I have said is that this reading should be not be in place of proper catechesis regarding christian values.

Granted I own 4,000 pounds of books (I get wonderful information from the fact that I’m in the military and they weigh my belongings each time I move) I would say I have quite a reading selection available… more than most, actually. I never advocate avoiding works of fiction which are not UTTERLY against christian values… what I advocate is what the church has always advocated: that good christian formation is a necessary part of human development.

These threads on Harry Potter are a little rediculous. It is an argument between people who have read Harry Potter and those who haven’t. Those who are against Harry Potter, typically haven’t read Harry Potter. The question is, how can you really criticize something that you haven’t read? I would bet that everyone on this thread would be offended if a fundamentalist protestant wrote a critical review of Jesus of Nazareth, by P. Benedict without even reading the book.

The only argument that they can really offer is, ‘it is better to not read it just to be safe.’ They can’t make an argument regarding the supposed occult that it contains or the lack of Christianity because they haven’t read it and they don’t know what it says. So all they can say is avoid it, just to be safe. You can also avoid life, just to be safe, because life is dangerous.

Wrong on so many levels. I have read the Harry Potter series, as well as the LOTR and Narnia series more often than most fans of the novels have. If you were actually reading my posts, you would know this.

Now, a question for you: Have you BEEN to any of the places mentioned in Harry Potter? I’ve been to almost all of them. Europe is quite lovely. I’m going to throw this argument back in your face: unless you’ve TRAVELLED to Europe and seen the places that are mentioned in the book, you can’t make an argument regarding the texts.

Now, see how utterly silly that argument sounds?

 

[promethius]

To go along with what LW said… Fr. Euteneuer nor anyone on these forums has presented a reason as to how harry potter is “has helped educate ‘younger generations in the language and the symbolism of the occult.’”

That’s not my point, or ultimately Fr. Euteneuer’s either. I sincerely doubt you’ve read HIS work, so by the argument of the people here, if you haven’t read it, don’t argue about it

The objections that Fr Euteneuer has, and me to a lesser extent, are on the Godless moral values projected by the text.

Fr. Euteneuer sees that as somehow also glamorizing human or other occult powers, I generally don’t… although I think that children should be taught what is fiction and what is real.

But the idea that triumph over evil is a totally godless endeavor which can be accomplished through innate human abilities CAN be potentially harmful. Have YOU read any texts on demonology? Might I recommend “Hostage to the Devil” as good reading material? One of the cases laid out therein details quite plainly how the idea of a Godless order and logic to the world led to demonic possession. In fact, this very concept was the cheif weapon with which the demon attacked the priest during “the clash”.

Again, this is not to say that Harry Potter (or other similar works) should not be read… just that people need to be conscious of proper catechesis in regards to faith and morals.

—> Side note: reading “Hostage to the Devil” will make you feel a bit like you’ve been dragged through the mud… I can’t exactly explain it, but reading the transcripts of speaches made by the demons somehow makes me feel like I’m dirty… dragged through a vat of oil or something… I always recommend caution when reading any text on demonology, because such a study requires a HIGH level of catechesis to be able to understand and handle it.

—> Side note 2: Fr Malachi Martin is in poor standing with the church. While I like his work on “Hostage to the Devil” I do not recommend his work since his falling out with the church.

 

[Fone_Bone_2001]

A claim which only came out in response to criticism of her. If you’ll kindly visit her official page, which I did before making that statement, she makes no assertion of christian affiliation at all. Her history mentions no christian organization and her list of awards and recognition contains no christian items either. For a christian, she’s remarkably unproud of the fact…

Please. Her faith features very prominently in any biographical description of her. See this link, for instance, in which she identifies herself as a practicing member of the Church of Scotland/Church of England, and which I found after literally ten seconds of searching.

This argument reminds me of one time when I heard a Protestant say, “If Peter was the first pope, who was the second?” Err… St. Linus, which is obvious if you bother looking for even five seconds.

I own all of the books. I have read all of them. I have even read some of them twice (the later ones, I think she was rather an amateur in her first two novels).

Oh, I certainly believe you. You implied as much in your first reply. That’s why I rewrote some of my response - for instance, I had originally typed, “as anyone who has read the series would know,” but in light of my suspicion that you actually knew the story, I changed it to “as anyone who has read the series should know.”

And indeed you should.

I also had a college reading level in 5th grade and scored in the top 1% of students in the United States in reading comprehension.

If that’s true, that makes the ignorance behind your claim that there is no Christian influence in Harry Potter even worse. Such a high level of intellectual proficiency does not entitle you to make such misleading errors.

Where is God then?

Where is God in the polytheistic pantheon of the fictional universe of Tolkien’s fantasy works?

I’ll tell you where: in the themes, structure, symbolism, and spiritual lessons. This is true of Harry Potter as well.

I must have missed Harry’s baptism where he receives imparted grace. I must also have skipped the chapter called “Harry’s First Holy Communion”. What sacraments are you talking about?

Actually, Harry does have a godfather, which means he’s been baptized.

Also, check out this article about the Godric’s Hollow scene of the new Harry Potter film:

phoenixweasley.wordpress.com/2010/11/02/christian-imagery-in-deathly-hallows-film-photos-of-godrics-hollow-churchyard/

It’s from a website dedicated to the Christian imagery in Harry Potter, The Lord of the Rings, and The Chronicles of Narnia.

None of these were what I meant to talk about, though your question brought them to my mind. I actually had in mind things like the inversion of the Christian sacraments in Voldemort’s rejuvenation ritual in Goblet of Fire: his evil ritual mimics and distorts both baptism (immersion in the cauldron; he goes in as a “baby” and comes out old instead of “new” in Christ) and the Eucharist (taking Wormtail’s “flesh” and Harry’s “blood” forcefully are hollow, evil inversions of the real, free, life-giving sacrifice of Christ’s own Flesh and Blood). The clear implication is evil’s hypocritical helplessness to exist on its own: it is a privation that must pervert and corrupt good. The whole thing with Voldemort drinking unicorn blood in Philosopher’s Stone works along similar lines.

This kind of symbolism is all over the fantasy works of Lewis and Tolkien as well. For instance, the Witch’s shaving Aslan in The Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe represents the stripping of Christ’s garment. Rowling is writing in the same tradition, prometheus.

“spiritual” does not equate to an accurate Christian message.

True. But in this case it is an accurate Christian message. The two Biblical quotations Rowling uses in Deathly Hallows - Matt. 6:21 and 1 Cor. 15:26 - underscore the entire series, and the lessons behind the efficacy of Lily’s sacrifice, the mechanics of how horcruxes work, and the legend of the Hallows, all communicate an extraordinarily Christian message on death.

I’ve actually BEEN to King’s Cross. Are you aware that the location is chosen because JK Rowling concieved the idea in the train station there?

You have misplaced the symbolism of the passage. King’s Cross is the place where JK Rowling first came up with the Harry Potter concept. The word “Cross” in the title of a trainstation does not imply an approved Christian message…

And there, I know the history of the series better than you, apparently.

I’ve been to England; I don’t remember if I’ve been at King’s Cross station. If you really deny that choosing to name the chapter after Harry efficaciously offers his own life to save his friends “King’s Cross” constitutes a deliberate Christian reference, then I’m embarrassed for you.

I hope everyone sees this part of my reply. They might miss it if they skim, of course, but if they see our dialogue on this chapter title they’ll realize - if they didn’t already know - that Rowling’s novels do have definitely Christian influence. It’s really that obvious and heavy-handed.