Has the EF become a first-world luxury?

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Came across this index which lists EF Masses worldwide
honneurs.free.fr/Wikini/wakka.php?wiki=PagePrincipalEn

I’ve also tried combing the official websites of FSSP, SSPX and other traditionalist groups to find their locations worldwide.
fssp.org/en/messes.htm
sspxasia.com

Obviously while not fully comprehensive it shows some patterns.
  • Most of the places where EF Masses are held regularly (weekly or daily) listed above are in developed countries.
  • In most developing countries or countries with a small Catholic population, EF masses are offered only occasionally (montly or more).
What do you guys think??? I think its pretty shocking that in developing countries, there is a stark deficiency in this regard. Why is this so??? Does it cost that much more to offer EF Masses???
 
Came across this index which lists EF Masses worldwide
honneurs.free.fr/Wikini/wakka.php?wiki=PagePrincipalEn

I’ve also tried combing the official websites of FSSP, SSPX and other traditionalist groups to find their locations worldwide.
fssp.org/en/messes.htm
sspxasia.com

Obviously while not fully comprehensive it shows some patterns.
  • Most of the places where EF Masses are held regularly (weekly or daily) listed above are in developed countries.
  • In most developing countries or countries with a small Catholic population, EF masses are offered only occasionally (montly or more).
What do you guys think??? I think its pretty shocking that in developing countries, there is a stark deficiency in this regard. Why is this so??? Does it cost that much more to offer EF Masses???
I’m no expert on the subject, but I would suspect it would have something to do with education.
 
What do you guys think??? I think its pretty shocking that in developing countries, there is a stark deficiency in this regard. Why is this so??? Does it cost that much more to offer EF Masses???
I live in one of those countries, so I’ll try to answer your question.

India, though under British rule, never had much classical Western culture. A Western education was only open to Anglophile, upper- and middle-class Indians who explicitly embraced British culture and values. This changed over time, but it has left the common man firmly enamoured of local culture and suspicious of anything “Western”, especially in matters religious.

India was colonized by the British, so there was a lot of Protestant influence. Services in the vernacular were the norm, and Anglican Churches (the Church of South India and the Church of North India) were formed by liberal Anglican leaders.

The Catholic missionaries who made converts often lacked logistic support, especially with the gradual collapse of the Portuguese empire. Moreover (I’m quoting from my parents here), many of the later comers were often reluctant to promote or educate their own converts, whom they rather looked down upon; instead, they wanted to curry favour with the upper castes of India, whom they respected for their education and moral standards. Catechesis suffered badly, and “Catholic schools” often became schools for the rich and the powerful - a problem that was exacerbated when we achieved independence and were left in the hands of a poorly formed local clergy.

Though many local priests were ordained, the formation they received was far from optimal. Latin was not emphasized, and exposure to classic Catholic theology was almost zero. Even those (like my father) who served as altar boys at Tridentine Masses were

The result of this lack of cultural support - a phenomenon that predated Vatican II by at least one generation, was that when the “spirit of Vatican II” hit India, what resulted was the perfect storm - Masses that sometimes looked like Hindu rituals, impromptu solos and sermons borrowed from our Protestant compatriots, “New Moon” and “Full Moon” festivals, and an emphasis on popular piety at the cost of liturgy and catechesis. In many parishes, “Christmas” is renamed “Yesu Kristhu Jayanthi”, lowering “Yesu Kristhu” (Jesus Christ) to the level of Hindu divinities such as Krishna. English Masses are a little better, but many of them are quite pitiful.

If any FSSP priests are reading this: we need you guys, please! A Traditional (or at least conservative) move could stop the massive haemorrhage we’ve had to the C.S.I. and the Assemblies of God, who are perceived as being more serious and devout about their faith! 😃
 
It has to have something to do with exposure. If the people don’t even know about the EF mass how would they know it’s even an option? I’m sure if some of these places had potential semninarians for groups such as the FSSP, they would be taken in in a heartbeat.
 
Interesting post about the more recent Catholic history in India RPRPsych. Thank you.

Also (forgive me in advance), this is all food for thought. Especially about the part where “they wanted to curry favour with the upper castes of India”.

But seriously. Thanks again for the informative post.
 
I am saddened to hear of the lack of strength of the Church in India, a country of great culture and future promise. We should pray for India and Australia both in need of mission work. But alas, where are the mission troops of old.
 
It has to have something to do with exposure. If the people don’t even know about the EF mass how would they know it’s even an option? I’m sure if some of these places had potential semninarians for groups such as the FSSP, they would be taken in in a heartbeat.
Exposure could be a remote reason, but just look at huge Catholic dominant countries like Brazil and Philippines, the number of parishes that celebrate EF regularly is comparatively smaller than in other countries in Europe, and North America. These are countries with centuries of Catholic history and tradition.
 
I live in one of those countries, so I’ll try to answer your question.

India, though under British rule, never had much classical Western culture. A Western education was only open to Anglophile, upper- and middle-class Indians who explicitly embraced British culture and values. This changed over time, but it has left the common man firmly enamoured of local culture and suspicious of anything “Western”, especially in matters religious.

India was colonized by the British, so there was a lot of Protestant influence. Services in the vernacular were the norm, and Anglican Churches (the Church of South India and the Church of North India) were formed by liberal Anglican leaders.

The Catholic missionaries who made converts often lacked logistic support, especially with the gradual collapse of the Portuguese empire. Moreover (I’m quoting from my parents here), many of the later comers were often reluctant to promote or educate their own converts, whom they rather looked down upon; instead, they wanted to curry favour with the upper castes of India, whom they respected for their education and moral standards. Catechesis suffered badly, and “Catholic schools” often became schools for the rich and the powerful - a problem that was exacerbated when we achieved independence and were left in the hands of a poorly formed local clergy.

Though many local priests were ordained, the formation they received was far from optimal. Latin was not emphasized, and exposure to classic Catholic theology was almost zero. Even those (like my father) who served as altar boys at Tridentine Masses were

The result of this lack of cultural support - a phenomenon that predated Vatican II by at least one generation, was that when the “spirit of Vatican II” hit India, what resulted was the perfect storm - Masses that sometimes looked like Hindu rituals, impromptu solos and sermons borrowed from our Protestant compatriots, “New Moon” and “Full Moon” festivals, and an emphasis on popular piety at the cost of liturgy and catechesis. In many parishes, “Christmas” is renamed “Yesu Kristhu Jayanthi”, lowering “Yesu Kristhu” (Jesus Christ) to the level of Hindu divinities such as Krishna. English Masses are a little better, but many of them are quite pitiful.

If any FSSP priests are reading this: we need you guys, please! A Traditional (or at least conservative) move could stop the massive haemorrhage we’ve had to the C.S.I. and the Assemblies of God, who are perceived as being more serious and devout about their faith! 😃
Sounds bad. I pray you guys gain someone who can set the faith right in India.
 
Exposure could be a remote reason, but just look at huge Catholic dominant countries like Brazil and Philippines, the number of parishes that celebrate EF regularly is comparatively smaller than in other countries in Europe, and North America. These are countries with centuries of Catholic history and tradition.
I really don’t know what the feeling is in the Philippines or Brazil but I’m guessing those populations were less likely to question authority and demand for EF came from the areas where it’s now most available. The Vatican has said to make the EF available if the faithful want it and groups like the FSSP are invited into the diocese when the Bishop sees the need. To me it’s strange that some of the bigger dioceses in the US don’t have an FSSP parish, though that doesn’t necessarily mean they don’t have diocesan or religious priests that offer EF masses. Maybe they’d take them if they could but there just isn’t enough FSSP priests available.
 
Came across this index which lists EF Masses worldwide
honneurs.free.fr/Wikini/wakka.php?wiki=PagePrincipalEn

I’ve also tried combing the official websites of FSSP, SSPX and other traditionalist groups to find their locations worldwide.
fssp.org/en/messes.htm
sspxasia.com

Obviously while not fully comprehensive it shows some patterns.
  • Most of the places where EF Masses are held regularly (weekly or daily) listed above are in developed countries.
  • In most developing countries or countries with a small Catholic population, EF masses are offered only occasionally (montly or more).
What do you guys think??? I think its pretty shocking that in developing countries, there is a stark deficiency in this regard. Why is this so??? Does it cost that much more to offer EF Masses???
Thanks for the links & thread.
 
Interesting post about the more recent Catholic history in India RPRPsych. Thank you.

Also (forgive me in advance), this is all food for thought. Especially about the part where “they wanted to curry favour with the upper castes of India”.

But seriously. Thanks again for the informative post.
Well, it was a bit cynical, and I may have bitten off more than I could chew in trying to summarize 70 years of history in a few paragraphs.

The bright side is that:
  1. People here are not very individualistic, and they still respect those in authority. This means that if the right kind of authority takes charge, a lot of these issues are reversible. For example, there was no fuss (except for a few grumpy letters in a local magazine) when the translation of the English OF Mass was modified (“for many”, “consubstantial”, etc.) People just followed the leader.
  2. The Church does a fantastic job with things like education for the poor, orphanages, caring for the sick and dying, and so on. The trouble is that they’ve become exclusively focused on the “preferential option for the poor”, and liturgy and catechesis have suffered. (For example, a recent draft document by a group of Indian Jesuit priests on the upcoming national election read exactly like an Indian National Congress talking points manifesto.) 😛
  3. Mass attendance, and attendance at popular devotions, have not suffered because of the Order of the Mass (I’d say, using a rough estimate, that they are either the same or they’ve slightly increased.) In other words, people are still coming to Church.
  4. Though some political parties have been very critical and vocal in attacking conversions to Christianity, freedom to worship is by and large respected.
This means that if two or more consecutive Popes take up the issue, provide clear guidelines to the Bishops, and work harder on the formation of priests, things could get a whole lot better. It’s far from impossible. 👍
 
I am saddened to hear of the lack of strength of the Church in India, a country of great culture and future promise. We should pray for India and Australia both in need of mission work. But alas, where are the mission troops of old.
Well, it’s not all that bad. (Rainy days tend to make me a bit of a curmudgeon, and I’d just got soaked before typing that post.) As I said, the Church in India is strong on social justice and group participation, and is more authority-friendly. (For example, gay marriage, women priests, and abortion are non-issues for most Indian Catholics. I can’t say the same on contraception though. :D) However, she is weak on liturgy, purity* and catechesis, and that always gets to a purist like me.
  • “Purity” is a poor word, but I’m just using it as shorthand for “free from secular, Hindu or Protestant influences and syncretism.”
 
I really don’t know what the feeling is in the Philippines or Brazil but I’m guessing those populations were less likely to question authority and demand for EF came from the areas where it’s now most available. The Vatican has said to make the EF available if the faithful want it and groups like the FSSP are invited into the diocese when the Bishop sees the need. To me it’s strange that some of the bigger dioceses in the US don’t have an FSSP parish, though that doesn’t necessarily mean they don’t have diocesan or religious priests that offer EF masses. Maybe they’d take them if they could but there just isn’t enough FSSP priests available.
Do you think it’s likely that the people just aren’t interested? Not only here, but around the world?

We have a Latin Mass parish in our city, and it has a nice crowd and is fairly full. But it’s not packed by a long shot. The OF parish Masses (at least on Sundays) are packed. Nothing hostile against the EF or traditional Catholicism–it’s just that people aren’t interested. They like Mass in their own language.

I think that Protestant missionary work probably has a lot of influence on why people in 3rd world countries aren’t interested in Catholicism or a Mass in a different language than their own. RPRPsych hinted at it in their excellent post. This is a link to an interesting (and fairly long) article about Protestant missionary work in other countries: christianitytoday.com/ct/2014/january-february/world-missionaries-made.html WARNING–this article will be upsetting to many Catholics. I found it upsetting, and I’m a convert from Protestantism.
 
I really don’t know what the feeling is in the Philippines or Brazil but I’m guessing those populations were less likely to question authority and demand for EF came from the areas where it’s now most available. The Vatican has said to make the EF available if the faithful want it and groups like the FSSP are invited into the diocese when the Bishop sees the need. To me it’s strange that some of the bigger dioceses in the US don’t have an FSSP parish, though that doesn’t necessarily mean they don’t have diocesan or religious priests that offer EF masses. Maybe they’d take them if they could but there just isn’t enough FSSP priests available.
Here in the Philippines the EF is almost non-existant. Only a handful of parishes in the entire country have an EF Mass.

By the way, the Vatican did not say to make the EF available if the faithful want it. Pope Benedict’s motu proprio stated that it should be made available if a “stable group” want it. Unfortunately, “stable group” is not defined either in percentage of the parisioners or in actual numbers which can make it easy for a priest to deny the request.
Also, if I remember correctly, any priest celebrating an EF must be proficient in Latin and not simply able to learn all the Mass prayers by heart and many seminaries no longer teach Latin.
 
I work with and meet a lot of African oblates.

Two things come to mind here. One, they’re far too busy building running hospitals, and schools to spend time worrying about the form of the Mass.

Two, their worship style tends to be exuberant as opposed to the solemnity of an EF Mass. That’s not a bad thing. Culturally that’s just the way they are. Plus they have no long tradition of the Latin language. Unlike European languages their native languages have no Latin roots.

They have huge, huge material needs and very little resources. Most of their energies are going towards scrounging up those resources. Being with them is a very humbling experience. They are extremely dedicated to the faith, and they are extremely hands-on.
 
The TLM is mostly of European descent. Culturally, it is very alien to many countries like Africa, India, South America, etc. Africa, where I would say the TLM is pretty much non existent, has a flourishing Catholic population, and they are Catholics who are literally willing to die for their faith. I heard a recent survey that also said that African Catholics also abide very strongly by Catholic teachings, e.g. abortion, same sex marriage, contraception, etc. So I don’t know that the EF is a “first world luxury” as much as it is “first world sensibilities.” So maybe there is just no call for an EF Mass in these countries.
 
I work with and meet a lot of African oblates.

Two things come to mind here. One, they’re far too busy building running hospitals, and schools to spend time worrying about the form of the Mass.

Two, their worship style tends to be exuberant as opposed to the solemnity of an EF Mass. That’s not a bad thing. Culturally that’s just the way they are. Plus they have no long tradition of the Latin language. Unlike European languages their native languages have no Latin roots.

They have huge, huge material needs and very little resources. Most of their energies are going towards scrounging up those resources. Being with them is a very humbling experience. They are extremely dedicated to the faith, and they are extremely hands-on.
👍

This is very heartening to hear. Nothing wrong with cultural differences and exuberance. 🙂
 
It has to have something to do with exposure. If the people don’t even know about the EF mass how would they know it’s even an option? I’m sure if some of these places had potential semninarians for groups such as the FSSP, they would be taken in in a heartbeat.
I agree. Wish there was much more exposure.
 
My church has a sister parish in El Salvador. The parish is huge, covers many square miles, and has six churches. The people are poverty-stricken. There is one priest. Before someone in our parish donated a pickup truck, he was making his rounds by horseback. He cannot even get to each church every Sunday.

I seriously doubt he has the time to offer the EF along with the OF, even if he knew it. And I doubt that many people would be interested in it. Most probably have never heard Latin, as the generation before Vat. II is mostly gone now, and the education is very basic. And I think that is the way it is in most third world countries.
 
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