Has the Permanent Diaconate Increased Vocations to the Priesthood or not?

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The diaconate never “disappeared” and never will.

The only question was whether or not a permanent diaconate or a transistional diaconate is most appropriate.
 
There are now 17,000 permanent deacons in the U.S. with many more in formation. It is expected that the number of deacons will exceed the number of priests in the not too distant future if vocation numbers continue. It’s true that I do some of the things that I did before Ordination. Some I did not do such as Baptize, witness marriages, give the homily at Mass, bless houses Etc. The Holy Orders that I received from the bishop, have enhanced my ability to minister in the Church. It is difficult to understand. You have to experience it to appreciate it. The Holy Spirit works in mysterious ways. One of my fellow deacons, who’s wife died, was elevated to the priesthood. So in his case, it did increase vocations.
 
Deacon Tony560:
The Holy Spirit works in mysterious ways. One of my fellow deacons, who’s wife died, was elevated to the priesthood. So in his case, it did increase vocations.
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And there was one in this diocese who after he got a divorce, was elevated to the priesthood. I am not sure that the addition of one more priest was worth the scandal it caused. 😦
 
Being a military brat I’ve been able to see in various dioceses that there are deacons who are absolutly wonderful and deacons who really don’t have any business being in any kind of authority position…I wish the formation process was a little more standard.
 
I think Deacons will be a mark of the Church in America. Hopefully Deacons will servants of the Church and ministers of the Precious Blood, not stand ins for priests. I have read where Deacons serve as parish administrators, and where plans are ready for Deacons to preside over communion services when a Holy Mass is not feasible. These are two examples where I think the Deaconate is not ideally suited. But necessity may dictate otherwise.

Deacons can and should baptize, witness marriages, assist in the Holy Mass, serve on parish councils and in other parish ministries, and perform works of charity in the community. They should also support themselves and their families, if married. Their family is their primary responsibilities. The salvation of their wife and children is paramount.

Some married men are called to service and it is good that the Church can ordain them. The Holy Spirit will flow through our Deacons and make the Church strong. Hopefully the Bishop’s men will be free to live a life of service to the Church.

Support your Priest and Bishop, I know my Deacon does. His example is a good one to follow.

Christ’s Peace,

TJD
 
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Kielbasi:
Most parishes don’t have deacons, and all of the deacons’ duties can be performed by layfolk when needed, and actually are performing them in most places

Its been a blessing as it gives a handful of men an opportunity to really dedicate themselves permanently to the liturgical ministries, but the church isn’t a whole lot better off.
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I find your answer puzzling. You state that the diaconate has duties that can be provided by “layfolk” and that, for the most part, this is true. There are duties that a deacon can perform that lay people can not. Some of these include performing a baptism service (the true service with the christening/anointing - we all know anyone can baptize with water in an emergency), marriage service, blessings, giving sermons/homilies, funeral service, etc.

I am not trying to build a wall here between lay people and the diaconate but my point is that a deacon is part of the clergy where a lay person is not. When the bishop lays his hands on the diaconate candidate’s head, he ceases to be a lay person and he enters into the clerical state. There is an ontological (please don’t fault me for my spelling if this is wrong - it is late) change. This is not my point but I wanted to make it anyways.

My true point is that with the lack of priests and the choice between a lay person and a deacon - who would you rather have? A deacon has normally 4 to 5 years of education that focuses in many different areas such as Theology, Christology, Homiletics, liturgy, etc. that a lay person normally does not have. A deacon is part of the clergy. He is the bishop’s helper. He is the service end of the church. In this, he acts as the arms of the Church to reach outside the walls of the parish and into the community as a cleric and servant.

Again, the Church needs all of us. Through our baptism, we become responsible for the building and care of our Church. We infact become priests to the cause of evangelizing our faith. Whether you are a cleric or a lay person, we are all called to the same role.

I just find it sad that you see the diaconate as such a negative Order. http://forums.catholic-questions.org/images/icons/icon9.gif
 
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Kielbasi:
The diaconate never “disappeared” and never will.

The only question was whether or not a permanent diaconate or a transistional diaconate is most appropriate.
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What is the difference between the two - transitional and permanent - besides the obvious? Isn’t a deacon a deacon? The first part just describes the period of time that the person is going to be a deacon, doesn’t it? http://forums.catholic-questions.org/images/icons/icon5.gif
 
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DIT:
What is the difference between the two - transitional and permanent -
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Deacon: A transitional deacon is a seminarian studying for the priesthood. A permanent deacon can be married and assists a priest by performing some of the sacraments.
 
All priests and bishops are ordained first as deacons…but then are ordained usually within one year of their ordination as deacon to the priesthood…hence they are known as transitional. But permanent deacons remain deacons unless they pursue later study to move on to the priesthood. This is reserved only to celibate deacons, whether they are widowed or ordained when they are single men. But once you are ordained a deacon, you can never lose that gift offered by God and the church.
 
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HagiaSophia:
Deacon: A transitional deacon is a seminarian studying for the priesthood. A permanent deacon can be married and assists a priest by performing some of the sacraments.
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HagiaSophia -

Sorry to say that is a wrong answer (in the way I was asking it). THERE IS NOT A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN A TRANSITIONAL DEACON AND A PERMANENT DEACON. They are the same, they are deacons.

The difference is that a transitional deacon will most likely continue forward in his studies and training. This would hopefully lead to ordination as a priest one day. . . . but it might not as well.

I think St. Bruno explains it well too. I tend to be a little more blunt.
 
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stbruno:
All priests and bishops are ordained first as deacons…but then are ordained usually within one year of their ordination as deacon to the priesthood…hence they are known as transitional. But permanent deacons remain deacons unless they pursue later study to move on to the priesthood. This is reserved only to celibate deacons, whether they are widowed or ordained when they are single men. But once you are ordained a deacon, you can never lose that gift offered by God and the church.
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I was under the impression that once a man became a permanent Deacon, he would have to recieve special permission to become a priest, because of the path he took. And, that a widower permanent Deacon could become a priest since he is no longer married (again with special permission).
 
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mjdonnelly:
I was under the impression that once a man became a permanent Deacon, he would have to recieve special permission to become a priest, because of the path he took. And, that a widower permanent Deacon could become a priest since he is no longer married (again with special permission).
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For the most part, you are correct. When one is ordained a deacon, they could continue forward to priesthood if allowed to do so.

In the case of those who chose the permanent diaconate, they should remain deacons permanently - or atleast - that is the original intent of their ordination.

All deacon takes a vow of celebacy. An unmarried candidate for the permanent diaconate takes the vow of celebacy and can not marry after ordination. A married candidate for the permanent diaconate takes the vow of conditional celebacy. This vow is “conditional” on the death of a permanent deacon’s spouse. If the married permanent deacon’s wife should preceed him in death, he is restricted from remarrying again.

If upon the death of his spouse and the lack of a committment to his children (those that might be dependent on him - normally under the age of consent), a widower permanent deacon can petition his bishop and seek permission to continue on to priestly ordination. This rare and is the exception rather than a rule.

Hope that helps.http://forums.catholic-questions.org/images/icons/icon7.gif
 
I believe that it has and it will to a greater degree down the road.

Specifically, in our diocese, we have a man who became a deacon years ago. His son is now a Priest and I believe the Deacon’s example helped in son in the discernment. Incidentally, this Deacon’s wife died and he is now studying the Priesthood so we might be the only diocese in America, if not the world with a father and son as Priests.

Generally, the ways that our Deacons contribute to our Parish (1,000 families and one Priest) will lead to increased vocations (Priesthood, Religious, and Deaconate) but they definitely contribute to the faith life of our parish. I hope that nothing in my comments below are construed as critical of our Pastor as we have one of the most gifted Pastors in the entire Diocese but he is like us and only has 16 hours a day that he is awake and he needs his prayer time too.
  1. Our Deacon allows our Priest to “disappear” when there are family emergencies/deaths and be with that family for as long as it takes. The personal contact that a young man or woman has during this time of trial may be the way that this person sees a vision of their calling.
  2. During Lent, we have Stations and other organized devotions that attract families as they are held at various times of the day to accommodate different schedules. If we had to depend on our Pastor to do this and all of his other ministries/responsibilities, he would be unable to make the commitment in the event that other responsibilities would require his attention. Vocations begins with a heart open to God and a heart that takes the time to listen to His voice.
  3. We are able to have Eucharistic Adoration before or after Jr./Sr. High CCD classes for 15 minutes that might not otherwise be available.
  4. We have an Adult Education program, RCIA program, Jordan Program (baptism preparation), Marriage Preparation First Sacraments (Communion & Penance) Preparation, Alter Server Training Program (our young people are often called to assist the Bishop at the Cathedral because they are so well trained) and Extra-ordinary Minister Training that would be the envy of any Parish in the U.S. and it would all be impossible without the dedication of our two Deacons.
  5. Our city has three hospitals and our Deacons are the ones who do most of the hospital visits unless the situation is grave which again allows our Pastor to be where he is most vital at any particular moment.
  6. In addition to the Marriage Preparation with Father, in certain difficult cases like inter-faith couples or where the non-Catholic is agnostic/atheistic/anti-Catholic, the couple is assigned to our married deacon (the other is a widower) to insure that the issues are handled better than less trained lay people.
These Deacons are not considered mini-priests or even second class. They know their calling is to serve as they are directed by our Bishop and fortunately he is allowing them to serve their own Parish under the direction of our Pastor. These Deacons have subbed for our Pastor at Baptisms, funerals, weddings, and shown up at Daily Mass to celebrate a Communion Service at the last minute because our Pastor is called away. These men are so loved and respected in our parish that not once has anyone complained including when one Deacon showed up for a wedding five minutes before it began.

All of these faith life programs add to the vitality of our Parish and members- a vitality that was impossible until our current Pastor delegated more things to not only our Deacons but to lay members. We now have one young man in the Seminary (first in the 40 year history of the Parish), another at a Catholic College contemplating transferring to the Seminary, a young woman preparing to be a Nun (also a first), and at least two high school students who my H.S. Freshman daughter says will be Priests.

On a side note, our Pastor serves as Spiritual Director to many priests and religious in our area. If we want more vocations, we also have take care of the people who have already taken the vows. Thanks again to our Deacons as they help Father do this important work too.
 
DIT:

Your statement is not quite correct:
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DIT:
All deacon takes a vow of celebacy. An unmarried candidate for the permanent diaconate takes the vow of celebacy and can not marry after ordination. A married candidate for the permanent diaconate takes the vow of conditional celebacy. This vow is “conditional” on the death of a permanent deacon’s spouse. If the married permanent deacon’s wife should preceed him in death, he is restricted from remarrying again.

If upon the death of his spouse and the lack of a committment to his children (those that might be dependent on him - normally under the age of consent), a widower permanent deacon can petition his bishop and seek permission to continue on to priestly ordination. This rare and is the exception rather than a rule.
/QUOTE]

All deacons DO NOT take a vow of celibacy. Only unmarried deacons make a promise to remain celibate.

Two distinctions here:

ONE:
  • A vow and a promise are not the same thing - vows are taken by consecrated men and women (brothers, sisters, and priest of religious orders).
  • Promises are taken by diocesan clerics (deacons & priests). They are similiar to vows, but not the same thing canonically.
TWO:
  • Only unmarried deacons make a promise of celibacy, meaning they will not marry. The promise is not administered to married candidates. I was ordained in November (with the revised ordination rite) and one of my nine classmates was widowed. Only he made the promise of celibacy.
I assume “DIT” means “deacon-in-training.” How far along are you in your studies? How is it going?

We are blessed here in the Archdiocese of Omaha to have 180 deacons, nearly as many as we have priests. In a couple of months we will ordain 17 more (largest class ever), which will be our 28th class overall!

It is quite simply the case that the pastoral needs of our people would not be met without these wonderful men to are sacramentally configured to the servanthood of Jesus Christ.

God bless all the deacons, and all those who assist them with prayer, support and encouragement!
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Diaconia -

I stand corrected on the vows and promises. I did not know that but I will definitely look into it.

On the promise of conditional celebacy and celebacy, our training has stated that as a married diaconal candidate, upon ordination you make the promise to not remarry. This means if your spouse dies, you promise (or vow as my notes from class are written - yes, I checked but that could just be a mistake in my notes too) not to remarry without the permission of both your bishop and Rome. I noted in my notes that this waiver against this promise is seldomly granted by Rome after the death of a spouse.

I have a long way to go in my formation but I have had my eyes opened as well as my heart. It has been a great experience and journey so far. I look forward to the rest of the journey and hope it continues to be as rewarding.

I echo your praise for those willing to make the committment to the Lord both in time, talent, and training. It is a true fulfillment of their baptism duty.
 
Orionthehunter

Thanks for your witness regarding your Deacons. It sounds like your parish is truly blessed. Reading positive comments about our clergy is motivating.

Christ’s Peace,

TJD
 
DIT:
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DIT:
Diaconia -

I stand corrected on the vows and promises. I did not know that but I will definitely look into it.

On the promise of conditional celebacy and celebacy, our training has stated that as a married diaconal candidate, upon ordination you make the promise to not remarry. This means if your spouse dies, you promise (or vow as my notes from class are written - yes, I checked but that could just be a mistake in my notes too) not to remarry without the permission of both your bishop and Rome. I noted in my notes that this waiver against this promise is seldomly granted by Rome after the death of a spouse.

I have a long way to go in my formation but I have had my eyes opened as well as my heart. It has been a great experience and journey so far. I look forward to the rest of the journey and hope it continues to be as rewarding.

I echo your praise for those willing to make the committment to the Lord both in time, talent, and training. It is a true fulfillment of their baptism duty.
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Your notes are generally correct, and anyone aspiring to the sacred Diaconate should assume that they will not be able to remarry if their wife dies. Exceptions are sometimes made, but that was not my point in my previous post.

What I meant to make clear is that during the ordination liturgy you will not make a promise of celibacy, because you are already married. Only unmarried candidates make that promise.

Here’s the text from the Ceremonial of Bishops (emphasis is mine):

503 After the homily, the public acceptance of celibacy is made by candidates for priesthood in the order of presbyterate and by unmarried candidates for the diaconate. . .

504 The the candidates manifest their intention of a commitment to celibacy by answering, I am, to the question put by the bishop, or by some external sign determined by the conference of bishops. The bishop ends by saying, May the Lord help you to persevere in this commitment. The candidates answer, Amen.

505 Then the candidates for the diaconate who are not obliged to make the commitment to celibacy come forward. As the candidates stand before him, the bishop questions them all together in the words provided in The Roman Pontifical (no. 15), including the question on the celebration of the liturgy of the hours.

So the order of the ordination rite for deacons is thus:


  1. *]Unmarried candidates promise celibacy.
    *]Candidates promise to pray the Liturgy of the Hours (collectively).
    *]Candidates promise obedience to the bishop and his successors (individually, by kneeling before the bishop and placing their hands within his hands).
    *]Candidates prostrate themselves for the Litany of the Saints.
    *]Candidates go to bishop individually who lays hands upon them in silence.
    *]Bishop prays the Prayer of Consecration.
    *]Each of the newly ordained deacons are vested with stole and dalmatic.
    *]Individually the deacons go to the bishop and receive the Book of the Gospels.
    *]Finally, the bishop gives the sign of peace to the new deacons.

    Peace to all,
 
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