Hate Crimes

[whatevergirl]

Careful – we don’t want to inject common sense into the discussion.

Or as me sainted Irish Mither would say, “Sticks and stones may break my bones, but words will never hurt me.”

LOL!
If someone kills someone else – cold blooded murder–the crime doesn’t suddenly become worse because there was prejudice involved. A life has been taken–a murder has occured. Now, motives do play a huge part in jury deliberations, but if a white person say, murders an african-american person–for no apparent reason other than hate…I suppose it would be construed that the white person was hateful. But, it doesn’t change the actual definition of what took place.

I wonder when and why society coined the phrase hate crime? I suppose when no other motives match…‘hate’ was the apparent motive. So…if a gunman comes in and shoots three bank tellers in cold blood…is that not hate? Money being the driving force behind murdering the bank tellers…doesn’t diminish the fact that the person obviously doesn’t have a whole lot of regard for human life.

Do I feel more sympathy for them, or for the gay person who is murdered, simply because he is gay? I would have the same amount of sympathy. Seems like the phrase ‘hate crime’ was coined to somehow make those particular murders, violent assaults, etc…look worse than if hate/prejudice/intolerance wasn’t the motive? I dunno…are there stiffer sentences for hate crimes? Maybe I should start by asking that!!

 

[emily47017]

I dunno…are there stiffer sentences for hate crimes?

yep, as there are (in some states) stiffer sentences for the money motives you mentioned:

Thus, in many States the commission of a murder, or other capital offense, for pecuniary gain is a separate aggravating circumstance under the capital sentencing statute.

 

[Bennie_P]

LOL!
If someone kills someone else – cold blooded murder–the crime doesn’t suddenly become worse because there was prejudice involved. A life has been taken–a murder has occured. Now, motives do play a huge part in jury deliberations, but if a white person say, murders an african-american person–for no apparent reason other than hate…I suppose it would be construed that the white person was hateful. But, it doesn’t change the actual definition of what took place.

I wonder when and why society coined the phrase hate crime? I suppose when no other motives match…‘hate’ was the apparent motive. So…if a gunman comes in and shoots three bank tellers in cold blood…is that not hate? Money being the driving force behind murdering the bank tellers…doesn’t diminish the fact that the person obviously doesn’t have a whole lot of regard for human life.

Do I feel more sympathy for them, or for the gay person who is murdered, simply because he is gay? I would have the same amount of sympathy. Seems like the phrase ‘hate crime’ was coined to somehow make those particular murders, violent assaults, etc…look worse than if hate/prejudice/intolerance wasn’t the motive? I dunno…are there stiffer sentences for hate crimes? Maybe I should start by asking that!!

What is so sad about this “hate” crime thing most crime is committed between persons that have something in common, most murder is committed by someone the victims know. Most crimes against African Americans are comitted by other African Americans, most assaults on homosexuals are domestic in nature, otherwise gay lovers attacking thier lovers or thier lovers new partners, most assualts on women are committed by thier spouses or boyfriends. Even among right-wing extremist the people that need to fear them the most is each other.
What needs to be the concern of society is how to make families stronger and more stable.

 

[jabelltulsa]

bzzt! try again. your exact quote was “Emotion does not equal planning.” murder in the first or second degree (the context in which planning has been raised as an issue) depends on planning, not emotion or motivation. hate crimes are different.

Weird … I was just thinking about this today. It does, in fact, matter what the circumstances (and mind set) are in committing a crime. Hence 1st and 2nd degree (and Manslaughter - that sounds like the worst of them in terms of the name).

 

[emily47017]

(and Manslaughter - that sounds like the worst of them in terms of the name).

that word has always given me the shivers, too… !!!

 

[whatevergirl]

What is so sad about this “hate” crime thing most crime is committed between persons that have something in common, most murder is committed by someone the victims know. Most crimes against African Americans are comitted by other African Americans, most assaults on homosexuals are domestic in nature, otherwise gay lovers attacking thier lovers or thier lovers new partners, most assualts on women are committed by thier spouses or boyfriends. Even among right-wing extremist the people that need to fear them the most is each other.
What needs to be the concern of society is how to make families stronger and more stable.

amen to that bennie

 

[Jerusha]

Actions which do not directly physically harm the person, which are motivated by the kinds of hatred mentioned here, and are specifically designed to “force” the person into suicide, are hate crimes.

“Sticks and stones may break my bones, but words will never directly physically harm me.”

A person has the option to reject suicide, no matter how intense the persecution.

 

[vern_humphrey]

Actions which do not directly physically harm the person, which are motivated by the kinds of hatred mentioned here, and are specifically designed to “force” the person into suicide, are hate crimes.

A person has the option to reject suicide, no matter how intense the persecution.

I’ll never forget the time I told my mother the big kids were picking on me. She looked down at me, her first-born, wid th’ tears streamin’ down me face and said, “G’lang wid yez! Yer big and ogly enough to take care o’ yerself!”

How can anyone “force” me to do anything I don’t want to do – especially with mere words?

 

[Jerusha]

Intent is what counts, not results, in this case. After all, suicide can be read as an admission of guilt. The guiltless generally don’t commit suicide.

 

[vern_humphrey]

Intent is what counts, not results, in this case. After all, suicide can be read as an admission of guilt. The guiltless generally don’t commit suicide.

Suicide is usually a result of mental illness, such as clinical depression.

 

[emily47017]

Suicide is usually a result of mental illness, such as clinical depression.

i must be dreaming. did vern just say something true and rational?

 

[Jerusha]

Just so long as the individual remains aware of what causes the depression, even that is not a loophole.

And, obviously, since depression is anger turned inwards, and often anger is turned inwards because of fear of speaking one’s mind in one’s physical environment, thank God for the Internet.

Meds helped, too. Internet therapy rocks. Guidance from a certain librarian helped, too, if you are here, SS.

 

[matt1985]

I don’t believe in hate crimes laws. Isn’t any violent crime a hate crime? Instead of giving longer sentences for biased crimes, it would be a better idea to make everyone spend a longer time in jail if they commit that same crime regardless of what motivated them.

 

[vern_humphrey]

I don’t believe in hate crimes laws. Isn’t any violent crime a hate crime? Instead of giving longer sentences for biased crimes, it would be a better idea to make everyone spend a longer time in jail if they commit that same crime regardless of what motivated them.

What are you trying to do, make sense?

Of course you’re right – a violent criminal, as an old instructor of mine used to say, is a murderer in training.