Have gotten no help at my parish feel like leaving the church....

[wisdomseeker]

I agree with Gretahope. There are many Protestant ministers who are very good and holy men and women. They are not head hunters. The Protestant communities are defective, because they are no longer Churches. They have lost their succession. But the persons are not defective. They are good people.

Look at some of the Protestant Ministers who work for the Catholic Church. Let’s begin with Dr. Alveda King at Priests for Life. She’s Protestant and she’s a Pastoral Associate on a canonically erected Catholic Association. There are several very good Protestant Ministers teaching at our papal universities in Rome. They are very good theologians and not head hunters. They train our priests and brothers in solid theology and are not trying to recruit them.

You want to stay away from anyone, Catholic or other, who demonizes another person.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF

And one wonder why we are in such theological mess. this the answer. father corapi one time denounced this. that it is wrong to have people of other faiths teaching our schools. how can they teach Catholic when they themselves dont believe what we believe?

 

[wisdomseeker]

One of my university professors, an Anglican, taught in the Vatican, at the Augustinianum. I doubt that he was teaching them to hate the CC - I suspect he taught them about patristics.

yes. i am sure he had to avoid the subject of Church, Eucharist, papacy, and many things we are to believe. and you wonder why so many priests dont know their faith.

 

[jmcrae]

Hi B*rother: thank you so much for writing. I am honored you are writing me.

“First, the primary mission of the Church is to save souls through the sacraments”.*

I have come to believe Jesus Christ is the only thing/one that can save souls. “I am the way, the truth and the life, no one cometh unto the Father except through me”. John 14:6.

Can you please explain what you say above? I am very confused.

The majority of the time, Jesus comes to us through the Sacraments of the Catholic Church. He can also choose to come to us through extraordinary spiritual experiences, and visions, etc., but this isn’t very common, and doesn’t happen to everyone. However, as Catholics, since we have access to the Sacraments, we can have deeply personal and deep experiences of Jesus pretty much any time we go to Mass or to Confession, rather than having to wait on a movement of the Spirit that may or may not come to us.

 

[Bluegoat]

yes. i am sure he had to avoid the subject of Church, Eucharist, papacy, and many things we are to believe. and you wonder why so many priests dont know their faith.

I doubt this was an issue.

 

[rinnie]

With all my marital issues lately, I’ve literally gotten very little, minimal help from my parish, or others, so I feel, honestly like leaving to go to a non-denominational church, where there is a prayer group, bible study, the pastor is available for counseling, etc. and I feel the spirit there much more. I am really torn, as I will always be a Catholic of course. I feel no wonder so many are leaving the church, there is so much lacking, in the way of spirit led marriage stuff, and other things, for teens, etc. I am confused.

I, and we have met with our Priests, but all they say is basically “aw that’s horrible, and you have every reason for an annulment”…that’s it. They also said, they have had much more serious issues than ours on their hands…etc… They didn’t even open their Bibles once :shrug:and show us what the Lord says, like the other pastor did, when husband and I met with him. This pastor blatently opened up his Bible, and pointed Romans 1 out to my husband, showing him the path to destruction he was on in his infidelity. He also opened up the Bible where it says Husbands love your wives as Christ does the church, then asked my husband, “do you think you are doing this”? My husband said “YES”. Then he asked him point blank, “HOW ARE YOU DOING THIS IF YOU ARE COMMITTING ADULTERY”? mY husband then proceeded to almost walk out of the session…but did not. He asked me too. I said YES. I have tried so hard to love my husband, and be a Godly wife, but my heart is so broken, I do not know if it can be un-hardened at this point, not without a conversion of my husband’s heart and actions.

Just wanted to share and ask have any of you fellow Catholics ever felt this way?

It should not be like this if you ask me. But there is no help in our church!

Oh p.s. We have no deacons I was told and no married couples who we can meet with even. I e-mailed one couple who leads a lot of things, and they never even got back to me… whereas, I e-mailed a pastor from a local church whom we met with, and he e-mailed me back the very next day and said he’s happy to meet with me or us anytime.

Hi Corinne, Sorry to hear about the struggle you and your husband are going through. But what you guys need to do is ask Father about the retreats that the RCC has set up for marriages in trouble. They are usually in the Church Bulletin. If not have Father find out where the sessions are being held.

I don’t think anyone knows how busy a Priest is today and what he has on his plate. That is why there are retreats today to help people.

There are other retreats also that I think you will find very very helpfull later down the road.

But you must first find Retrouvaille in your area. Many People here can help explain it to you. But it is for marriages in trouble.

Down the road there are other retreats for dull marriages, For marriages that are great but need an extra spark.

Then there are personal retreats a one and one for just women to spend time with God alone without your spouse. Which will help you become a better spouse.

Same with men they have retreats. Its just prayer, etc just like for us women.

There are tons of retreats for all kinds of marriages. My Husband and I have never gone but will be attending one together soon just to gain a larger spiritual connection with God. This is not for a marriage, it is because we asked to take a larger part in the Church. But there are tons of retreats.

But I think that once you work on your marriage, then you guys can begin to work on yourself and open yourself up to another world that you did not even know existed.

So please check in to Ret. for now. And hopefully next year you 2 can both be different people and reconnect with not only eachother but with God and others. And maybe you two may be the ones to make it, and help others in years to come. You never know why or what God has up his sleeve for you or your husband or how he chooses to get your attention

 

[lizaanne]

Corinne - you have gotten a lot of good advice here, some not so good. Here is my take on this, and is in response to your opening post specifically.

Going to a heretical place of worship (it is not a Church, only the Catholic Church can claim that title) is no different from your husband’s own infidelity to your own marriage. The Church is the Bride of Christ. You have been confirmed in the fullness of Faith, through the sacraments, including your marriage. You are willing to give up on Christ’s One True Faith for some emotional comfort by looking for greener grass elsewhere. How is this any different to the betrayal of a spouse in a marriage?

Don’t go looking behind other fences for happiness. True happiness lies right where you belong, with the fullness of Truth in the Catholic Church. Just because you have the misfortune of belonging to a parish that does not seem to care about your situation (and shame on them), does not mean that the entire Church is worth turning your back on and looking elsewhere for comfort and that warm fuzzy you get from an “altar call” .

Remember - no matter how comforted and happy you may feel there, Christ is absent from their place of worship. He only resides in the tabernacles of the Catholic Church. You can’t have it both ways - you can’t live with one foot in the Catholic Church and one in some other place. There are resources out there, my goodness you live in California, one of the largest states in the country. It’s not like you are in the wilds of Alaska or something. Call the Archdiocese and ask for help. Don’t take the easy way out - you are not letting your husband off easy, don’t let yourself off easy either.

God bless - I hope you can stay strong and save your marriage, and your Faith.

Also - you have some disordered understandings about salvation through the sacraments. I am going to PM you some information that may help you understand this a bit better.

~Liza

 

[rinnie]

[SIGN][/SIGN]

It seems many others know what I am speaking about here…that is such a good thing.

I KNOW I am a strong Catholic, always have been, always will be, but frankly I don;t feel very close to God right now in my life, but I want to be. [SIGN]WHY has he allowed me so much suffering over the past 2 years? [/SIGN]WHY? I do not understand it. I have reached out to all my priests/pastors in the whole neighborhood, and every single priest I contacted was too busy to meet with me personally, except one…who was wonderful and brought me into his home even and called right then and there his counselor friend on the phone to talk to me, which we did for 30 minutes on the speaker phone! This was utterly amazing. I wrote him yesterday thanking him and offering to take him to lunch this week! I hope he’s not too busy! Or old. He’s about 85! Then one nice non-denominational pastor met with me a couple times, which was wonderful, but I did get the sense he is trying to tell me how wrong the Catholic Church is, which I didn’t appreciate. We got into a little bit of apologetics, but it was unfruitful.

So as far as regarding what one poster here says, yes, there are many pastors I get the feeling who ARE trying to lure Catholics out of the church, by their emotional entertainment services it almost seems, and feel-good stuff. It seems to work as so many Catholics are leaving our churches by the droves…It is sad.

I didn’t mean to dis the sacraments not at all. I believe in every one of them, and as I said earlier, I believe they are gifts to us from God. For us. Especially the Eucharist! Praise God for it! They don’t save us though, only Jesus does. That is what I meant to say. I do not believe a person is “saved” at baptism. No, I do not think this. A person is saved through the blood of Jesus, He is the way, the truth and the life, as it says in Scripture. What if one got stranded on a deserted island, and there was no Eucharist, no sacraments? Well, if they are a believer in Jesus Christ, our Lord, they are saved. Period. So, there doesn’t have to be The Eucharist there at all. Really. If we believe in Him, He saves us! If we accept Him into our hearts, He is there and will never leave. We don’t have to even take the Eucharist every Sunday. I am becoming very conflicted reading what a lot of you are writing, as if the Sacraments save us. Jesus dying for me on the cross saves me. Amen

I don’t know love. No one does. But all I can say is he has his reasons. My brother who was never sick a day in his life died of a brain tumor at the age of 39. I asked my Dad why did he have to die, then a year later I lost my baby. I asked my Dad why again. My Dad finally told me the answer. Because they had to

Now My Dad is gone. All in a matter of 7 years

But my Dad told me one thing. Some answers you will get before you leave this world. Others you will get in the next world. But he said when you die and look into the eyes of Jesus you won’t have any questions, you too will know why

But my Dad said this, we are all put here to carry our crosses. And you can be sure that God thinks you can carry them. And God is never wrong. This is not the world we are looking for, our world is the next one where we can walk hand and hand with Jesus and talk to him. But for now we must trust him. If this was our world it would be his world also. But it wasn’t they killed him. They will treat you no better. But remember what Jesus told us. If this world hates you remember they hated me first.

But also remember how it all ended. The devil lost. The devil will always lose. And as long as you keep that faith that I know you have, grab on to it and say Jesus help me, He will. And then you will get up, pick up that cross and carry it with pride. Because you trust Jesus. Its really simple.

So do what Papa says. Get up, say your prayers and say Okay God today is a new day. Wash you face, comb your hair, put a smile on your face and pick up that cross and carry it in his name. He made us proud, now you make him proud. And when you fall he will pick you up again. Its called faith works. Faith works it you let it

 

[philochsfan]

This is quite odd. I heard a Protestant on a Protestant radio show this morning on my way to work.

He was concerned about the commerical mentality of Christians. Those who look of churches based on what the church can do for them. Does the church have a good Youth program for MY teenagers? Does the church have a bible study program that fits into MY hectic schedule? Does the church offer uplifting songs, contemporary songs, or just generally songs that I like? Does the church offer counseling when I need it? Does the church…for ME and those I love?

The fellow was saying we should not look to join a church for what the church can do for us, but we should join a church because of God, and who HE is and where HE is wanting us to be.

Corrine, you are Catholic. Why would you give that up just because your priest, and the married couples you have approahced in your parish, have not responed the way you would like them to have responded?

What is wrong with finding a Christian counselor that you have to pay for? Remember, you get what you pay for, and if you are expecting to get counseling for free, your counseling may be nothing to write home about. In St. Louis, where I lived for 7 years, I would go, and I would take my children, to a Catholic Counseling Center that is there. I think it is part of Catholic Charities, but I am not certain of that. It cost a bit, but my kids and I were worth it.

I wish there were a Catholic Counseling service here in western Kentucky. I would be willing to pay good money to get in a better position to deal with my family’s problems.

I pray that you will do what God wants you to do and not what you only THINK He wants.

Janice

 

[phoenixrrt62]

Dear Phoenix:

Are you really an agnostic? How honestly could you be? Thank you for your suggestions. Why are you on a Catholic forum if you are an agnostic? You must be searching. Well, I would never be anything else but a devout Catholic myself, as we have the whole truth I think. Yes, we have gone to every counselor imaginable, you name it. I’m done with it. Done. There is nothing left to do except suffer and offer it up at the foot of the Cross, pray my Rosary which I need to do more, and go to Church. And as they say Let Go and Let God. Tell me, how is your marriage? You hinted at something wrong. I’d like to know if you don’t mind. And BTW what were you fuming about which you were feeling/thinking? I’m sure you can say here.

Funny you ask if I am REALLY an agnostic. I think so…I question…I say, well there just HAS to be something here that is -well- beyond human understanding…but I see all the injustice in the world…see what nonsense is done in the name of religion, see all the rules that MAKE NO SENSE… then I say, there is no God. No god would let **** like this happen…and as to being on here? Yeah, I am searching. I used to go to catholic church…I suppose that’s why a catholic forum? Actually, I found this by accident…doing something I didn’t need to be doing. Go figure.

Anyhow…as to the marriage. I packed up what I needed…my kid’s bed, etc, got an apartment, and left the husband. We are still legally married, but I have full physical custody of him. He really has no involvment in my son’s life. He lives in another state.

As to the church…well, I went to mass for years… but, wasn’t catholic. I had some serious problems as a teen, ****** foster home, sexual-what?- almost molestation… i’d guess you’d say…by a friend of the foster family…well… I was just a hot mess. I was really thinking about suicide. Well…I get the bright idea to go to confession. Mind, I’ve never been…so I don’t know the first thing about the rules… well, I tell the priest this, and also tell him I’m pretty much at the end of my rope…and could he help? could I pray with him, something? well. he says he couldn’t help me, as I wasn’t catholic. Never mind I went to mass for ten years of my life.
Ah, hell. I can’t say as I blame him. I was seriously messed up. A month later, I was in a kid’s psych ward. That gives you an idea…

But. I was bitter. Oh, BOY, was I bitter. I know now the anger was misplaced. I didn’t then…and-well, the damage was done:0(

I am glad you are holding fast to your faith (unlike me) but…no…you should not have to suffer…no, I’m sorry, you should NOT. You and your children don’t deserve to be treated in the manner you are being treated. Sorry…
I so wish I could do more, have more ideas for you…but I do not. I just hope all turns our well for you and your children.

 

[JReducation]

How have the Old Catholic parishes lost their succession? What about Anglicans? Most Anglicans have had apostolic lines reinfused into their episcopacy long ago, about 100 years ago in the Dutch Touch co-consecrations with the Old Catholics? Some Lutherans have had the same type of thing with the TEC etc. It’s simply not true that all protestants lack succession. I agree with you that they’re good people.

Maybe what this poster needs right now is healing, help, counselling, prayers, interaction, guidance, and inspiration, not succession?

I know plenty of Catholic priests, unfortunately, who are right now behaving as sacrament vending machines instead of being counsellors, inspirational, pastoral, etc. We must get past the idea that the clergy is only there for sacraments. They are meant by God to be much more. Apparently this poster’s priests are dropping the ball.

Did you read what the Holy Father stated on the last day of the year of the priest? He says just the opposite. He said the sole purpose of the priest is to celebrate sacraments…

All the other ministries and functions that priests do in parishes and elsewhere are really an old overlap between priests and religious. These were ministries done by religious, not by priests. The Holy Father wants to get back to that.

It was religious who did the spiritual direction, pastoral counseling, care of the poor and sick, etc etc.

The priests who wanted to do those things had to become religious. Secular priests were not expected to do those things.

This is not to say that they are not to be kind and charitable. What is being said is that they have no more obligation to do these things than the average secular man. Their obligation is to adminster the sacraments. To use the Holy Father’s words, to may people holy through the sacraments. This also implies that they do what is necessary to prepare people for the sacraments.

As to the Apsotolic succssion, the Catholic and Orthodox Churches, do not acknowledge the Apostolic succession of any other Christian community. There are individuals who have Apostolic succession, because they were validly ordained. But as an ecclesial community, they do not have the succession. You must have the guarrantee that every ordained person is validly ordained. Only the 22 Catholic Churches and the 7 Orthodox Churches have that guarrantee. That’s why we say that Protestant communities are ecclesial communities, not churches. We have no way of knowing who is and who is not validly ordained. They do not have a uniform system as to Catholics and Orthodox, where you must be validly ordained a bishop before you can ordain anyone else.

But that does not take away from them being good people. They are not criminals or out to do harm, any more than some Catholics and Orthodox. I don’t believe that real religion teaches people to do harm. That would not be real religion.

Yes, there is a lot of good to be found outside of the Catholic Chrudch and within the Catholic Church, also a lot of lose canons too.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF

 

[Corinne3]

Funny you ask if I am REALLY an agnostic. I think so…I question…I say, well there just HAS to be something here that is -well- beyond human understanding…but I see all the injustice in the world…see what nonsense is done in the name of religion, see all the rules that MAKE NO SENSE… then I say, there is no God. No god would let **** like this happen…and as to being on here? Yeah, I am searching. I used to go to catholic church…I suppose that’s why a catholic forum? Actually, I found this by accident…doing something I didn’t need to be doing. Go figure.

Anyhow…as to the marriage. I packed up what I needed…my kid’s bed, etc, got an apartment, and left the husband. We are still legally married, but I have full physical custody of him. He really has no involvment in my son’s life. He lives in another state.

As to the church…well, I went to mass for years… but, wasn’t catholic. I had some serious problems as a teen, ****** foster home, sexual-what?- almost molestation… i’d guess you’d say…by a friend of the foster family…well… I was just a hot mess. I was really thinking about suicide. Well…I get the bright idea to go to confession. Mind, I’ve never been…so I don’t know the first thing about the rules… well, I tell the priest this, and also tell him I’m pretty much at the end of my rope…and could he help? could I pray with him, something? well. he says he couldn’t help me, as I wasn’t catholic. Never mind I went to mass for ten years of my life.
Ah, hell. I can’t say as I blame him. I was seriously messed up. A month later, I was in a kid’s psych ward. That gives you an idea…

But. I was bitter. Oh, BOY, was I bitter. I know now the anger was misplaced. I didn’t then…and-well, the damage was done:0(

I am glad you are holding fast to your faith (unlike me) but…no…you should not have to suffer…no, I’m sorry, you should NOT. You and your children don’t deserve to be treated in the manner you are being treated. Sorry…
I so wish I could do more, have more ideas for you…but I do not. I just hope all turns our well for you and your children.

And dear Phoenix: I wish the same for you. Our God is such a loving God and He loves You too very much. You do not deserve the ****** childhood you had, but hopefully it will make you a person of deep deep faith, like my marriage struggles I know, Praise God has made me. I am so thankful for this. Our hope is not in this life, but in the next, heaven where we will live with the Lord forever! I sometimes feel if I had everything, a perfect marriage, money, etc, I might have turned out to be a very self-centered spoiled prideful self-righteous woman. Sorry. With my painful circumstances you know what? They Have kept me on my knees and looking up…looking not to anybody or anything, only the Lord, and His wonderful Catholic Church. What a lesson I will always take with me now. I am thankful for this. I just want to do what God wants for me. When I take the Eucharist, and I hear the Priest say, “strength and healing”, all I can is YES LORD! Thank you.

God Bless You Phoenix

 

[Cable]

But that does not take away from them being good people. They are not criminals or out to do harm, any more than some Catholics and Orthodox. I don’t believe that real religion teaches people to do harm. That would not be real religion.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF

Am still waiting to hear doctrinal lies and misinformation spread by some Catholics about a non-Catholic religious community.

 

[JReducation]

Am still waiting to hear doctrinal lies and misinformation spread by some Catholics about a non-Catholic religious community.

What doctrinal lies are you looking for?

As to misinformation, that’s par for the course in human society.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF

 

[Cable]

What doctrinal lies are you looking for?

As to misinformation, that’s par for the course in human society.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF

sounds like you’re an apologist for anti-Catholic expressions

 

[JReducation]

sounds like you’re an apologist for anti-Catholic expressions

Now I’m totally lost.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF

 

[Mikeoffaith]

With all my marital issues lately, I’ve literally gotten very little, minimal help from my parish, or others, so I feel, honestly like leaving to go to a non-denominational church, where there is a prayer group, bible study, the pastor is available for counseling, etc. and I feel the spirit there much more. I am really torn, as I will always be a Catholic of course. I feel no wonder so many are leaving the church, there is so much lacking, in the way of spirit led marriage stuff, and other things, for teens, etc. I am confused.

I, and we have met with our Priests, but all they say is basically “aw that’s horrible, and you have every reason for an annulment”…that’s it. They also said, they have had much more serious issues than ours on their hands…etc… They didn’t even open their Bibles once :shrug:and show us what the Lord says, like the other pastor did, when husband and I met with him. This pastor blatently opened up his Bible, and pointed Romans 1 out to my husband, showing him the path to destruction he was on in his infidelity. He also opened up the Bible where it says Husbands love your wives as Christ does the church, then asked my husband, “do you think you are doing this”? My husband said “YES”. Then he asked him point blank, “HOW ARE YOU DOING THIS IF YOU ARE COMMITTING ADULTERY”? mY husband then proceeded to almost walk out of the session…but did not. He asked me too. I said YES. I have tried so hard to love my husband, and be a Godly wife, but my heart is so broken, I do not know if it can be un-hardened at this point, not without a conversion of my husband’s heart and actions.

Just wanted to share and ask have any of you fellow Catholics ever felt this way?

It should not be like this if you ask me. But there is no help in our church!

Oh p.s. We have no deacons I was told and no married couples who we can meet with even. I e-mailed one couple who leads a lot of things, and they never even got back to me… whereas, I e-mailed a pastor from a local church whom we met with, and he e-mailed me back the very next day and said he’s happy to meet with me or us anytime.

Hi Corinne-

I’m sorry that you are having difficulties in your marriage. I wish I had some sage piece of wisdom that would help, but I don’t. I’m sorry that you aren’t finding what you need at your local parish. Now, I know what I am about to say is going to throw some in to cardiac arrest, but here goes. What ever you do or whatever happens do not leave the Roman church over this.

I’m not sure what you were expecting from your parish priest. If you are expecting him to save your marriage forget it. Your marriage is between you and your husband and it’s up to the two of you to save it or end it. While your priest may be able to help facilitate discussion between the two of you so you guys can figure out, he is not the one who is going to put your marriage right by pulling out a bible verse. I can guarantee you neither is a pastor at your local non denominational church. The conversation, reconcilliation and healing are all up to you and your husband to work out.

I think it would be silly and unwise for you to leave the Church just because you feel your parish priest seems not interested or terribly compasionate to your needs. It doesn’t make the Roman church bad and the Baptist church better, it just makes your priest a yutz. You may want to talk to him and let him know how you are feeling and why. If he still seems uninterested, then find another parish. I think you will be much happier with this decision in the long run.

Leave your parish if you feel your needs aren’t being met there. Leave the Roman church if you completely disagree with the dogma of papal infallability.

Good luck with your marriage and I will keep you in my prayers.

 

[Mikeoffaith]

Did you read what the Holy Father stated on the last day of the year of the priest? He says just the opposite. He said the sole purpose of the priest is to celebrate sacraments.

Wow I hope that wasn’t said ex cathedra.

 

[Corinne3]

Wow I hope that wasn’t said ex cathedra.

Dear Mike:

What’s “ex cathedra?”

Rest assured, I will never leave my faith. I guess what I meant was, and should have stated it perhaps in my initial thread was, I am going to seek counsel for my marriage problems outside the church, counsel only, not ultimate leaving.

NO WAY. Our church rocks. Like NO Other Church ever could. EVER on the face of the earth.

Thank you for listening.

Corinne~

 

[Mikeoffaith]

What’s “ex cathedra?”

Ex cathedra means from the chair (throne). When the Roman Church issues a teaching that is ex cathedra (from the chair/seat/throne), it is usually mean that the teaching is put out there with the stamp of papal infallability. It means that whatever pronouncement is being made on faith or morals that it is to be held by the entire church as the gospel truth.

 

[wmscott]

Dear Mike:

What’s “ex cathedra?”

Rest assured, I will never leave my faith. I guess what I meant was, and should have stated it perhaps in my initial thread was, I am going to seek counsel for my marriage problems outside the church, counsel only, not ultimate leaving.

NO WAY. Our church rocks. Like NO Other Church ever could. EVER on the face of the earth.

Thank you for listening.

Corinne~

Connie, you may want to contact your Diocese and relay the issue you have in your parish. You may find that there are some resources there to help you. Just a thought. Peace.