Have you heard this one befor?

[GerardPaul]

A member of Calvary Chapel said that the New Testament Letters to the Churchs and especialy in Revelations tells us that the early Christians were often in sin and error and only the Bible without the traditions of men can bring the Truth to keep them/us on the correct path to salvation. He said this when I said the Catholic Church came out of the early church and that without Tradition we would not have the Truth we have today or even the Bible. What do you think?

Jeffrey

 

[Catholic_Dude]

I think you answered well, you probably shook him up as well.

The bottom line is that each Christian wasnt walking around with their personal copy of the Bible, not to mention the NT wasnt even completed yet. If you happened to be a church who got a letter from an Apostle then you were lucky, but a letter or two is hardly enough to defend and teach Christianity from if you were to restrict yourself to only what was written.

Lets not forget the classic 2Thess:2:15, “hold fast to the traditions you learned from us”

 

[Ianjo99]

I think he’s stretching in order to reconcile his beliefs with facts. I would then ask him where in the bible it says that only the written scriptures without oral tradition is the path to Truth.

 

[Montie_Claunch]

Where in the New testament does it say whats in the New Testament? And what happend to Matthew 16 and the gates of hell would not prevail against them. Even if he doesn’t admit that Jesus was talking to Peter there was a church and Hell couldn’t over come them. I may be a little off on it but, that scripture I would think would go hard agianst the Early Chur from apostising.

 

[vern_humphrey]

Or to put it another way, “Which book of the Bible contains the table of contents?”

The Canon was established by the Church, based on Church tradition. If you reject the validity of Tradition, you must also reject the Bible – for the same reasons.

Many Protestants either assume that the New Testament existed during the lives of the Apostles (and was recognized as such), or the Church fell into error, and somehow stumbled over the New Testament 350 years after the Crucifixion.

 

[1962Missal]

GerardPaul:

A member of Calvary Chapel said that the New Testament Letters to the Churchs and especialy in Revelations tells us that the early Christians were often in sin and error and only the Bible without the traditions of men can bring the Truth to keep them/us on the correct path to salvation. He said this when I said the Catholic Church came out of the early church and that without Tradition we would not have the Truth we have today or even the Bible. What do you think?

Jeffrey

Tell him that you have faith in God’s promises:

Isaiah 59:20 "And he will come to Zion as Redeemer, to those in Jacob who turn from transgression, says the LORD. 21 “And as for me, this is my covenant with them, says the LORD: my spirit which is upon you, and my words which I have put in your mouth, shall not depart out of your mouth, or out of the mouth of your children, or out of the mouth of your children’s children, says the LORD, from this time forth and for evermore.”

Sacred Oral Traditon is older than the New Covenant, itself.

Justin

 

[Rand_Al_Thor]

Peace be with you!

2 Timothy 2:2

“You have **heard **everything that I teach in public; hand it on to reliable people so that they in turn will be able to teach others.” - Jerusalem Bible

“And the things which thou hast **heard **of me by many witnesses, the same commend to faithful men, who shall be fit to teach others also.” - Douay Rheims Bible

“et quae **audisti **a me per multos testes haec commenda fidelibus hominibus qui idonei erunt et alios docere” - Latin Vulgate

Note that in this passage, from three seperate translations, the verb “to hear” appears. Obviously Paul is not handing Timothy a copy of the KJV and telling him to give it to other people. How did the Church Fathers know which books to include in the Bible? As my Lutheran friend and I were talking about, they certainly had access during those three centuries to all the writings circulating around (claiming apostolic origin–over 200 in fact). But how did they know which were inspired Scripture? Well, they checked it against Tradition, and if it matched up, they put it in the Bible. If it didn’t match up, then it wasn’t something the Apostles taught and “handed on” or “commended” to others.

In Christ,
Rand

 

[auhsoj88]

Also, please consider that claiming not to have a tradition is in itself a tradition. Jesus never claimed not to have a tradition, hence why should we??? He only rejected those traditions of men that created friction with His gospels and disciplines. And claiming not to have a tradition, when Jesus (or an apostle) never said this, is indeed itself a tradition. A tradition of men, nonetheless! Another is sola scriptura!!

God bless…