Having Mass said for a non Catholic

[0Scarlett_nidiyilii]

Whenever somebody I know well has a family member die (or the person themself dies), I have a Mass said by the Capuchin Friars of the Renewal.
If the person is Catholic, I send the Mass card to the family.
If the person is not Catholic, I don’t send the Mass card to the family, but a standard sympathy card.

There are some people who I have Masses said for their conversion at a local shrine. In that case I go by first name only.
When the conversion has happened, I offer masses in thanksgiving for favors received.

 

[ComplineSanFran]

If the person is not Catholic, I don’t send the Mass card to the family, but a standard sympathy card.

And do you not tell them that you had a Mass said for their dead? This would be considered deceptive - and horrifying - to many.

 

[0Scarlett_nidiyilii]

They have the right to feel that way.
But I have an obligation to pray for the dead. And Mass is the strongest and most efficacious prayer.

 

[phil19034]

They have the right to feel that way.
But I have an obligation to pray for the dead. And Mass is the strongest and most efficacious prayer.

I knew a Protestant who died recently. I had a mass prayed form him and (based on my cousin’s suggestion) did not provide his family the Mass card.

Praying for the dead is one of the best things for us to do, and it would be very uncharitable for us to limit our prayers to Catholics.

 

[ComplineSanFran]

But I have an obligation to pray for the dead.

You can certainly do that privately, but in public, no, not without permission. If the person being prayed for is in the public arena, such as an elected official, that is different. But a private person - not of your faith - being prayed for by name in public, you are violating huge privacy issues.

 

[0Scarlett_nidiyilii]

I appreciate your concern., but we’ll have t agree to disagree on this one.

Peace!

 

[ComplineSanFran]

So name me the top 3 intentions that are named when you pray for the dead?

That s/he gets out of Purgatory… what else?

 

[steve-b]

steve-b:

True.

There can be conditions however

On one occasion in the parish I used to live a lady had organised a Catholic funeral for her departed husband who was a non-practising Anglican .

It got to the day before the funeral .

The will from the solicitors was opened and read .

Unbeknown to her he specified in his will that he wanted an Anglican funeral .

Quite a mess-up .

oops!

 

[Tis_Bearself]

Are you all doing it with their permission?

It’s not necessary to get people’s permission to pray for them. However, if a person is living or you are estranged from the family, it’s good etiquette to just keep it to yourself that you had the Mass said, and not have names published in bulletins and such.

I pray and have Masses said for people I have not seen in many years and I do not call them up for permisison first. In some cases I wouldn’t have any idea where to contact them and in other cases we are not on speaking terms and that is part of why I am praying for them.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

But a private person - not of your faith - being prayed for by name in public, you are violating huge privacy issues.

Again, it is very easy to arrange it so the name is not named.

If you send the Mass request to the Missions, the prayer will be said by some priest in some remote outback heaven knows where and no one is going to hear the name or know it.

If you request it through your parish, it is quite easy to request “Special Intention”. God knows what the intention is.

I would note that people on CAF have even had Masses said for each other using names that are variants of our online handles. God knows who the person is.

I pray for literally hundreds of people, famous, unknown, Catholic, non-Catholic, etc. Unless they are my close friends or immediate family, nobody knows I am doing this, including when I request a Mass said for them.

And by the way, there is nothing bad about having a Mass said for someone. I myself would not recoil in horror if a temple full of Buddhist monks were praying for me.

 

[edward_george1]

Sometimes I say a Mass that is offered “For a Special Intention,” as listed on the bulletin or the intention sheet on the altar. My parish actually has a Mass offered every Sunday “For the Intention of the Pastor,” because sometimes he gets Mass intentions in a private setting–spiritual direction or other such areas requiring discretion. So I offer that Mass, if the lot falls to me, “for the intention of the Pastor,” and I know that God knows what it is.

I think discretion and respect are certainly necessary, but I do think it’s a bridge too far to compare offering Mass for non-Catholics to Mormon baptism of the dead. We’re not claiming to change anyone’s religion by having Mass said for them. We’re simply praying for their souls, something we’re obligated to do. It might be prudent not to have the person’s name read out, but the two don’t exactly equate. This is honestly the first time I’ve ever heard of anyone expressing offense at the practice.

-Fr ACEGC

 

[Tis_Bearself]

I do think it’s a bridge too far to compare offering Mass for non-Catholics to Mormon baptism of the dead. We’re not claiming to change anyone’s religion by having Mass said for them. We’re simply praying for their souls, something we’re obligated to do. It might be prudent not to have the person’s name read out, but the two don’t exactly equate. This is honestly the first time I’ve ever heard of anyone expressing offense at the practice.

Thank you, Father, for being the voice of reason on this thread.
I have heard people be justifiably angry when a religious person would approach them and tell them they were praying for them or their family or whatever, on the basis that they or their family member was not religious, or were not Christian, and the prayers were seen as unwanted or intrusive.
But doing it in a way where it will not possibly upset anyone is perfectly fine and it does not change the person’s religion or anything.

I tend to think that even if Mormons prayed for me in whatever way they do, it wouldn’t be harmful if they did it in good faith. God would recognize that the Mormon person was just trying to do right by me. He would take intent into account. It would all be good and hopefully we would all end up in the same Heaven having a laugh over it.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

So name me the top 3 intentions that are named when you pray for the dead?

That s/he gets out of Purgatory… what else?

This is the only thing a Catholic prays for regarding the dead. There is nothing else the person needs at that point.

If they are already in Heaven, or already in Hell, then God just applies the prayer to some other dead person who needs one. Maybe somebody who has no one to pray for them.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

it would be very uncharitable for us to limit our prayers to Catholics.

The non-Catholics often need the prayers more because Catholic dead people usually have a lot of people praying for them. Protestants and non-believers, not so much.

Sorry to post so many times in this thread, but praying for the dead is pretty much the main “ministry” I do.

 

[ComplineSanFran]

Sorry to post so many times in this thread, but praying for the dead is pretty much the main “ministry” I do.

You realize, don’t you, that prayers for the dead (and of course purgatory) is one of the most ‘hot button’ issues of the Reformation? Any modern-day Calvinist would find your prayers deeply offensive, almost to the point of being demonic. I am very serious about this.

If you know anyone coming from this tradition, ask them pointedly, “How would you feel if I had a Mass said publicly - in a Catholic church by a Catholic priest - and the congregation all prayed together specifically that your dear departed one be released from Purgatory?”

Try it and see the reaction.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

My husband’s parents were Presbyterian. I believe his grandma was an RP. It was a family joke that I prayed for the dead in his family because no one else was doing it (another wing of the family has gone off to Baptist direction and of course they don’t pray for the dead either).

Sorry, but like Scarlett I am going to disagree with you on this point. A Mass is simply my personal expression of good will to the deceased soul, in my own tradition. It is not something I am doing to convert the deceased soul, or shove it in their family’s face that I pray for them. Most “Calvinists” I meet nowadays couldn’t care less about this to be honest, but there are a lot of atheists and agnostics who find the concept of prayer offensive (look up the story about Pat TIllman and his brother) and other people who don’t mind prayer so much but find the Catholic Church offensive. That’s as it may be.

The people I am praying for are dead, and they are not in the least harmed or affected by my prayer except by getting to Heaven faster if they need it. I am not telling their families I do it (unless it’s my own immediate family too which as I noted is not a problem) and frankly, once the person is dead, what I do or pray as my own personal matter without announcing it or publishing it is none of their family’s business. (That’s if I even know their family, or their family is even still living.)

You have a very weird hangup about this, like I am doing voodoo to make the soul turn Catholic after death. I suggest you get over it. The priest spoke the truth.

 

[TheLittleLady]

why would you assume that someone outside your faith would be comfortable with a closed Sacrament being offered for them?

What do you mean by a closed Sacrament? Mass is public. The prayers of the Mass are for anyone. Mass can be celebrated for any person, living or dead.

 

[phil19034]

Tis_Bearself:

Sorry to post so many times in this thread, but praying for the dead is pretty much the main “ministry” I do.

You realize, don’t you, that prayers for the dead (and of course purgatory) is one of the most ‘hot button’ issues of the Reformation? Any modern-day Calvinist would find your prayers deeply offensive, almost to the point of being demonic. I am very serious about this.

If you know anyone coming from this tradition, ask them pointedly, “How would you feel if I had a Mass said publicly - in a Catholic church by a Catholic priest - and the congregation all prayed together specifically that your dear departed one be released from Purgatory?”

Try it and see the reaction.

So you would rather us leave someone in purgatory so we don’t offend their living family members?

Sorry, not going to happen. If someone is offended, then that’s their problem.

BTW - the ones who get offended the most are simply the real anti-catholic bigots anyway. You know, the “new atheists” who take offense whenever someone offers to pray for them or the non-Catholics who refuse to offer their dead Catholic family members a Catholic funeral.

Note regarding the last: I attended one at a funeral home. The Catholic mother died and they had a “non-denominational” funeral with a Catholic priest. During the eulogy, the son-in-law gave a thinly veiled anti-Catholic speech. They didn’t allow the priest to wear his clericals, so he wore a black polo shirt and purple stole (small Confession one) at the grave site. The only reason they even had a priest is because the mother purchased a plot at a catholic cemetery.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

The “anti-Catholic bigots” have always been around.

I’m pretty sure that if any of the great saints like St. John Vianney or St. Therese had encountered some person yelling, “I hate God! I hate the Catholic Church! I don’t need or want your stinkin’ prayers!” or their family had said the same, any and all of those great saints would have immediately “stormed heaven” for that person AND their family, praying that they would have a conversion and open their hearts to the goodness and light of God. But those saints would have done it quietly and maybe noted it in their spiritual journal. They wouldn’t have held a giant prayer rally in the street in front of the atheist family’s house.

Praying for the deceased and having Masses said for them is no different today. We just go about it discreetly and it is fine, and in fact is a Spiritual Work of Mercy. We are certainly not taught to confine our works of mercy to Catholics only.

 

[Calliope]

I’m a pagan. I often write the names of people on the candles I burn on my altar, people who I am commending to their deity. Even so, there are people who would prefer me not to include them in my prayers because of a difference in our beliefs.

I think people will be all over the map with this one.